6 ms·

People think AIPAC is some all powerful unique lobbying group, in fact they're not even in the top 10 major lobbyists. Did you know SpaceX gave 5x as much as AI

by sequoia 3mo ago

People think AIPAC is some all powerful unique lobbying group, in fact they're not even in the top 10 major lobbyists. Did you know SpaceX gave 5x as much as AIPAC in 2024? AIPAC was also outspent by Coinbase, by Ripple, and several other companies[0]. And this "18th largest lobbyist" position is after a post-october-7 surge in spending. Pre-october-7 (2022) they were ranked forty sixth in terms of spending. Can you name 10 of the groups who spent more than them? How about five? The question worth asking is why are people obsessed with demonizing the AIPAC in particular and singling it out as the one or primary 'evil lobbying group' when there are tens or dozens of groups that spent more. The 2024 AIPAC spending number (50 mil, which is donated by American voters, not foreign money) is 1/8th of the $400 million plan Qatar (a foreign government) gave Trump in 2025. People focus on AIPAC specifically because they have a problem with Jews. Jews and other Israel supporting Americans are allowed to pool money and lobby just like anyone else. the fact that people think they shouldn't be allowed to play this game, the same one everyone else is playing in US politics, is what should be questioned. 0: https://www.opensecrets.org/elections-overview/top-organizations?cycle=2024 https://www.opensecrets.org/elections-overview/top-organizat...

pphysch 3mo ago
AIPAC is just the most well-known and representative entity in a large constellation of a hostile foreign lobby that has somehow avoided accountability under FARA. Qatar didn't spend 9 figures getting Trump elected, but an Israeli gambling magnate did.
- sequoia 3mo ago
  AIPAC is not foreign, this is another misconception/lie. AIPAC is an American lobby funded by Americans.
  - pphysch 3mo ago
    Everybody knows which country AIPAC is loyal to, and it's not the USA. The bad faith arguments undermine your hasbara.
Hikikomori 3mo ago
So they're getting their moneys worth.
- sequoia 3mo ago
  This is a great example of the prejudice (pre-judging) at play when it comes to Israel. One starts with the conclusion ("Israel/Jews are evil and controlling the government with money") then works backwards to build an argument. "They are spending so much, that's why they control the government!" They (American citizens funding AIPAC) actually spending much less than many other lobbying groups. "Aha- they're so conniving they can control the government even without being in the top 10 lobbies!" There's no winning against this "logic" because the conclusion has been decided ahead of time & any evidence is interpreted as supporting that conclusion, no matter which way it goes.
  - Hikikomori 3mo ago
    This is a great example of perpetual victimhood of Zionists.
mrhottakes 3mo ago
"You can't criticize lobbying unless you can name all the more active lobbyists" is a very strange concept. Have you thought this one all the way through?
123-12277 3mo ago
[dead]
kjs3 3mo ago
The butwhatabout-ism is strong with this one...
mthoms 3mo ago
How many of those other groups have openly lobbied for war? I have no doubt there are a few others TBH. The oil industry comes to mind. The point being, it's not just the amount of money at play. That's only part of it. But you know that.
khriss 3mo ago
> The question worth asking is why are people obsessed with demonizing the AIPAC in particular and singling it out as the one or primary 'evil lobbying group' Is your assertion that no one is allowed to criticize AIPAC unless they can 'prove' to you that others who spend more than them are not somehow worse?
- sequoia 3mo ago
  No, I'm saying people obsessed with AIPAC to the exclusion of all other lobbying groups are not motivated primarily by an objection to lobbying. I'm also saying the narrative that "AIPAC controls the gov't via lobbying" which many people believe is incoherent because Coinbase must control the gov't even more by this thinking. If you think people aren't obsessed with AIPAC you are not following US politics.
  - khriss 3mo ago
    > If you think people aren't obsessed with AIPAC you are not following US politics. I think a simpler explanation might be just that there is a lot of attention being paid to why the US seems beholden to Israel to the extent that it would be willing to risk it's relationship with other allies that provide far more in return. Exhibit A is the Iran war where the US essentially abandoned it's middle east and far east allies (to the extent to moving interceptors from Korea and Japan) to defend Israel. Other regional allies were largely left to fend for themselves. Seeing all this, people are legitimately asking, what exactly does the US get in return for the enormous support, both direct and indirect that it provides to Israel. Given it's role, naturally AIPAC is going to be central to these conversations.
    - theshrike79 3mo ago
      And specifically agreeing to a war, which every single president before has said "fuck no" because they understood the wider ramifications. Fun fact: Not a single Kia vehicle sold in Finland has had a tow hook in it for 6 months - they're ALL stuck in Hormuz.
    - sequoia 3mo ago
vrganj 3mo ago
Maybe people focus on AIPAC because they have a problem with any or all of the other bullet points I mentioned that AIPAC supports and enables and that your whole long message never addressed?
lenkite 3mo ago
AIPAC is also the unique lobbying group that effectively threatens US congressfolk on X. After Massie lost, they went ahead and boasted that "elected officials are free to disagree with us, but only briefly". They deleted that post after extensive outrage, then said it was "fake" a few weeks later. But way too many independent people across the entire political spectrum took screenshots of that timeline.

by sequoia 3mo ago

pphysch 3mo ago

AIPAC is just the most well-known and representative entity in a large constellation of a hostile foreign lobby that has somehow avoided accountability under FARA. Qatar didn't spend 9 figures getting Trump elected, but an Israeli gambling magnate did.

sequoia 3mo ago
AIPAC is not foreign, this is another misconception/lie. AIPAC is an American lobby funded by Americans.
- pphysch 3mo ago
  Everybody knows which country AIPAC is loyal to, and it's not the USA. The bad faith arguments undermine your hasbara.

Hikikomori 3mo ago

So they're getting their moneys worth.

sequoia 3mo ago
This is a great example of the prejudice (pre-judging) at play when it comes to Israel. One starts with the conclusion ("Israel/Jews are evil and controlling the government with money") then works backwards to build an argument. "They are spending so much, that's why they control the government!" They (American citizens funding AIPAC) actually spending much less than many other lobbying groups. "Aha- they're so conniving they can control the government even without being in the top 10 lobbies!" There's no winning against this "logic" because the conclusion has been decided ahead of time & any evidence is interpreted as supporting that conclusion, no matter which way it goes.
- Hikikomori 3mo ago
  This is a great example of perpetual victimhood of Zionists.

mrhottakes 3mo ago

"You can't criticize lobbying unless you can name all the more active lobbyists" is a very strange concept. Have you thought this one all the way through?

123-12277 3mo ago

[dead]

kjs3 3mo ago

The butwhatabout-ism is strong with this one...

mthoms 3mo ago

How many of those other groups have openly lobbied for war? I have no doubt there are a few others TBH. The oil industry comes to mind. The point being, it's not just the amount of money at play. That's only part of it. But you know that.

khriss 3mo ago

> The question worth asking is why are people obsessed with demonizing the AIPAC in particular and singling it out as the one or primary 'evil lobbying group' Is your assertion that no one is allowed to criticize AIPAC unless they can 'prove' to you that others who spend more than them are not somehow worse?

sequoia 3mo ago
No, I'm saying people obsessed with AIPAC to the exclusion of all other lobbying groups are not motivated primarily by an objection to lobbying. I'm also saying the narrative that "AIPAC controls the gov't via lobbying" which many people believe is incoherent because Coinbase must control the gov't even more by this thinking. If you think people aren't obsessed with AIPAC you are not following US politics.
- khriss 3mo ago
  > If you think people aren't obsessed with AIPAC you are not following US politics. I think a simpler explanation might be just that there is a lot of attention being paid to why the US seems beholden to Israel to the extent that it would be willing to risk it's relationship with other allies that provide far more in return. Exhibit A is the Iran war where the US essentially abandoned it's middle east and far east allies (to the extent to moving interceptors from Korea and Japan) to defend Israel. Other regional allies were largely left to fend for themselves. Seeing all this, people are legitimately asking, what exactly does the US get in return for the enormous support, both direct and indirect that it provides to Israel. Given it's role, naturally AIPAC is going to be central to these conversations.
  - theshrike79 3mo ago
    And specifically agreeing to a war, which every single president before has said "fuck no" because they understood the wider ramifications. Fun fact: Not a single Kia vehicle sold in Finland has had a tow hook in it for 6 months - they're ALL stuck in Hormuz.
  - sequoia 3mo ago

vrganj 3mo ago

Maybe people focus on AIPAC because they have a problem with any or all of the other bullet points I mentioned that AIPAC supports and enables and that your whole long message never addressed?

lenkite 3mo ago

AIPAC is also the unique lobbying group that effectively threatens US congressfolk on X. After Massie lost, they went ahead and boasted that "elected officials are free to disagree with us, but only briefly". They deleted that post after extensive outrage, then said it was "fake" a few weeks later. But way too many independent people across the entire political spectrum took screenshots of that timeline.