4 ms·

All this applies to iOS and safari too

rahkiin 4mo ago
Google is also pushing Chrome on all their other apps. Google Maps keeps asksing me in what browser to open a link; putting Chrome first: I don’t have Chrome installed. And that on top of the EEE-steps with all the non-standards they keep implementing.
dotcoma 4mo ago
Really? I Never got a weird message from Apple about other browsers being bad or potentially dangerous, and I tried Vivaldi, DDG, Brave, Firefox, Firefox Focus, and I currently have DDG set as my main browser. And of course I can delete Safari from my iphone if I wanted to.
- CamperBob2 4mo ago
  You don't get that message from Apple, but the people who would otherwise offer you a meaningful choice of browsers do. They can only do what Apple permits them to do, which isn't much.
  - dotcoma 4mo ago
    They need to get their browsers listed on AppStore, sure.
    - card_zero 4mo ago
      Or to put it another way, they can only do what Apple permits them to do.
    - cyberax 4mo ago
      Apple prohibits JITs outside the EU, and this makes a modern browser a non-starter.
- darkwater 4mo ago
  Indeed, because you are actually still using Safari under the hood.
  - slekker 4mo ago
    Not in the EU
    - microtonal 4mo ago
      AFAIK only on paper? At least, last time I checked, there were no non-WebKit browsers available yet (at least not Gecko or Blink).
  - dotcoma 4mo ago
    Does it count as Safari in stats? If it did, they’d have a 100% market share, wouldn’t they?
zerobees 4mo ago
It doesn't. Apple has its share of anticompetitive behaviors, but Microsoft is uniquely bad. I recently went through both experiences and, at least for the US region, the number of weird pop-ups and nags you get on Windows as you try to change the search engine and install Chrome is absolutely bonkers. It almost feels like some sort of a malware situation.
- bruce511 4mo ago
  I'm no MS fanboy here, but I think Apple is worse. Firstly Windows is arguably the most unrestrictive OS (certainly among the commercial options). You can install pretty much anything you like, from anywhere you like. Contrast to say Android or iOS it's a wild-west. If one wants to get on the "browser freedom" train, Windows is a strange choice over say iOS. I guess the browser change process is not universal even on Windows. I recently installed a new W11 laptop and both Chrome and FF installed fine with no drama. Sure Edge wants to be default, so does Chrome, so does FF. All nag a bit in the beginning. Describing a browser change as "nearly impossible" seems a tad hyperbolic to me. It's really easy. It's also a one-and-done task. Not really something to get all wound up about.
  - kstrauser 4mo ago
    Compare Windows to macOS instead of iOS and the equation changes significantly.
josefrichter 4mo ago
Not really. You can select any default browser on iOS, as far as I know.
- hagbard_c 4mo ago
  Yes, any default browser just as long at it uses the WebKit engine. This is comparable to how the Ford Model T could be ordered in any colour just as long as it was black.
  - josefrichter 3mo ago
    Ah I see, didn't know that. So it's just "branded" Safari..
- prmoustache 4mo ago
  you can on windows too afaik

Google is also pushing Chrome on all their other apps. Google Maps keeps asksing me in what browser to open a link; putting Chrome first: I don’t have Chrome installed. And that on top of the EEE-steps with all the non-standards they keep implementing.

dotcoma 4mo ago

Really? I Never got a weird message from Apple about other browsers being bad or potentially dangerous, and I tried Vivaldi, DDG, Brave, Firefox, Firefox Focus, and I currently have DDG set as my main browser. And of course I can delete Safari from my iphone if I wanted to.

CamperBob2 4mo ago
You don't get that message from Apple, but the people who would otherwise offer you a meaningful choice of browsers do. They can only do what Apple permits them to do, which isn't much.
- dotcoma 4mo ago
  They need to get their browsers listed on AppStore, sure.
  - card_zero 4mo ago
    Or to put it another way, they can only do what Apple permits them to do.
  - cyberax 4mo ago
    Apple prohibits JITs outside the EU, and this makes a modern browser a non-starter.
darkwater 4mo ago
Indeed, because you are actually still using Safari under the hood.
- slekker 4mo ago
  Not in the EU
  - microtonal 4mo ago
    AFAIK only on paper? At least, last time I checked, there were no non-WebKit browsers available yet (at least not Gecko or Blink).
- dotcoma 4mo ago
  Does it count as Safari in stats? If it did, they’d have a 100% market share, wouldn’t they?

zerobees 4mo ago

It doesn't. Apple has its share of anticompetitive behaviors, but Microsoft is uniquely bad. I recently went through both experiences and, at least for the US region, the number of weird pop-ups and nags you get on Windows as you try to change the search engine and install Chrome is absolutely bonkers. It almost feels like some sort of a malware situation.

bruce511 4mo ago
I'm no MS fanboy here, but I think Apple is worse. Firstly Windows is arguably the most unrestrictive OS (certainly among the commercial options). You can install pretty much anything you like, from anywhere you like. Contrast to say Android or iOS it's a wild-west. If one wants to get on the "browser freedom" train, Windows is a strange choice over say iOS. I guess the browser change process is not universal even on Windows. I recently installed a new W11 laptop and both Chrome and FF installed fine with no drama. Sure Edge wants to be default, so does Chrome, so does FF. All nag a bit in the beginning. Describing a browser change as "nearly impossible" seems a tad hyperbolic to me. It's really easy. It's also a one-and-done task. Not really something to get all wound up about.
- kstrauser 4mo ago
  Compare Windows to macOS instead of iOS and the equation changes significantly.

josefrichter 4mo ago

Not really. You can select any default browser on iOS, as far as I know.

hagbard_c 4mo ago
Yes, any default browser just as long at it uses the WebKit engine. This is comparable to how the Ford Model T could be ordered in any colour just as long as it was black.
- josefrichter 3mo ago
  Ah I see, didn't know that. So it's just "branded" Safari..
prmoustache 4mo ago
you can on windows too afaik