7 ms·

Go look at the demographics of the last election and then tell me which groups shouldn't be allowed to vote.

RickS 4mo ago
That's a response to an opinion I don't hold, but I could have been more clear. The claim I'm making is about the fitness to hold office. Specifically: septo/octogenarians belong at the ballot box, but not on the ballot. If you'd like to dissuade me of something, that's the meat of it.
- jgeada 4mo ago
  What is the justification? Why can someone vote for a future they're not likely have to endure? We don't allow under 18s to vote, so clearly some age restrictions are legitimate.
mylifeandtimes 4mo ago
Hey, I hear you, but the age cutoff could also be on holding office. As someone just hitting the 60 yr old mark, and looking at my parents who are still pretty sharp in their late 80s, -- so definitely talking about myself and my capacity here, No-one over 70 has any business in a high ranking government office. The mental flexibility isn't there. Which means no one over 66 should be allowed to run office (yes, I know this puts senators in office until 72, and kicks out representatives at 68, but it also gives a single number which is easier to understand). It's also a question of accountability. A 40 year old politician will expect/have to live with their choices for another 40 years.
- newsclues 4mo ago
  It’s not just mental ability it’s a set of perverse incentives: the old robbing the future of the young, instead of planting trees whose shade the old will never personally enjoy.
Der_Einzige 4mo ago
Go look at recent changes to how young men vote and tell me which groups shouldn't be allowed to vote in the future.
rayiner 4mo ago
[flagged]
- throw-234 4mo ago
  > You're overlooking that the geriatric people are carrying on the traditional liberal/conservative debate on both sides of the aisle. Workers skew young, capital skews old. When politics is money literally the only thing the left / right actually agree on is fucking over young people. That's what it takes to collectively focus on inflating real-estate / stocks that the youth is locked out of, while ignoring the labor market, and the cost of education, and periodically blowing up the economy on behalf of interest groups, with outsourcing or the like previously, next with AI. We've probably been in a job recession for years, and we only just noticed.
- mindslight 4mo ago
  I think that's exactly what OP meant? While Trump's policies take the long term gerontocratic/anarcho-capitalist dynamics strangling of our society and crank them to 11, a lot of younger people ended up buying into his "burn it all down" messaging imagining it would result in some principled evenly-applied reform that might get the boot off their own necks. And that level of foolishness seems straight from the naive rashness of youth.
  - rayiner 4mo ago
    [flagged]
    - mindslight 4mo ago
      There is too much to unpack here. Perhaps you'd like to make your point in something other than identity politics anecdotes and personal attacks? If you don't like my phrasing of "boot on their necks", feel free to substitute your own when constructively responding to the point. The frustrations that have led to Trumpism are certainly palpable and understandable, so don't feign like I'm using hyperbolic language out of nowhere. But no, in general I am comfortable modeling Trump's second term as a complete self-own on the part of voters - regardless of whether they've realized it yet, or ever will. As a libertarian who partook in both red and blue tribe media and was both sidesing through 2020, I have not come to this conclusion lightly. There has simply been no way I've been able to steelman it.
CalRobert 4mo ago
Of course, when I go to my local city planning meetings and see the demographics shouting down any new housing my feelings are different.
antisthenes 4mo ago
> Go look at the demographics of the last election and then tell me which groups shouldn't be allowed to vote The group that uses the rhetoric like "which groups shouldn't be allowed to vote". You tell me which one that is.

RickS 4mo ago

That's a response to an opinion I don't hold, but I could have been more clear. The claim I'm making is about the fitness to hold office. Specifically: septo/octogenarians belong at the ballot box, but not on the ballot. If you'd like to dissuade me of something, that's the meat of it.

jgeada 4mo ago
What is the justification? Why can someone vote for a future they're not likely have to endure? We don't allow under 18s to vote, so clearly some age restrictions are legitimate.

mylifeandtimes 4mo ago

Hey, I hear you, but the age cutoff could also be on holding office. As someone just hitting the 60 yr old mark, and looking at my parents who are still pretty sharp in their late 80s, -- so definitely talking about myself and my capacity here, No-one over 70 has any business in a high ranking government office. The mental flexibility isn't there. Which means no one over 66 should be allowed to run office (yes, I know this puts senators in office until 72, and kicks out representatives at 68, but it also gives a single number which is easier to understand). It's also a question of accountability. A 40 year old politician will expect/have to live with their choices for another 40 years.

newsclues 4mo ago
It’s not just mental ability it’s a set of perverse incentives: the old robbing the future of the young, instead of planting trees whose shade the old will never personally enjoy.

Der_Einzige 4mo ago

Go look at recent changes to how young men vote and tell me which groups shouldn't be allowed to vote in the future.

rayiner 4mo ago

[flagged]

throw-234 4mo ago
> You're overlooking that the geriatric people are carrying on the traditional liberal/conservative debate on both sides of the aisle. Workers skew young, capital skews old. When politics is money literally the only thing the left / right actually agree on is fucking over young people. That's what it takes to collectively focus on inflating real-estate / stocks that the youth is locked out of, while ignoring the labor market, and the cost of education, and periodically blowing up the economy on behalf of interest groups, with outsourcing or the like previously, next with AI. We've probably been in a job recession for years, and we only just noticed.
mindslight 4mo ago
I think that's exactly what OP meant? While Trump's policies take the long term gerontocratic/anarcho-capitalist dynamics strangling of our society and crank them to 11, a lot of younger people ended up buying into his "burn it all down" messaging imagining it would result in some principled evenly-applied reform that might get the boot off their own necks. And that level of foolishness seems straight from the naive rashness of youth.
- rayiner 4mo ago
  [flagged]
  - mindslight 4mo ago
    There is too much to unpack here. Perhaps you'd like to make your point in something other than identity politics anecdotes and personal attacks? If you don't like my phrasing of "boot on their necks", feel free to substitute your own when constructively responding to the point. The frustrations that have led to Trumpism are certainly palpable and understandable, so don't feign like I'm using hyperbolic language out of nowhere. But no, in general I am comfortable modeling Trump's second term as a complete self-own on the part of voters - regardless of whether they've realized it yet, or ever will. As a libertarian who partook in both red and blue tribe media and was both sidesing through 2020, I have not come to this conclusion lightly. There has simply been no way I've been able to steelman it.

CalRobert 4mo ago

Of course, when I go to my local city planning meetings and see the demographics shouting down any new housing my feelings are different.

antisthenes 4mo ago

> Go look at the demographics of the last election and then tell me which groups shouldn't be allowed to vote The group that uses the rhetoric like "which groups shouldn't be allowed to vote". You tell me which one that is.