6 ms·

While I 100% do not support violence against Sam Altman, or anyone else for that matter, what are people without billions of dollars and without the ear of the

by ropetin 5mo ago

While I 100% do not support violence against Sam Altman, or anyone else for that matter, what are people without billions of dollars and without the ear of the president supposed to do to affect change in this modern, post-capitalist hellscape? And I am genuinely interested in ideas that people think will work, not just trying to be combative.

tptacek 5mo ago
I read this comment as saying that you (100-k)% do not support violence against Sam Altman, for some positive real number k.
JumpCrisscross 5mo ago
> what are people without billions of dollars and without the ear of the president supposed to do to affect change in this modern, post-capitalist hellscape? California has a referendum system. Get signatures for a policy and put it to the voters.
- abenga 5mo ago
  The billionaires will blanket the airwaves with bad-faith argument ads and you will lose.
  - JumpCrisscross 5mo ago
    > billionaires will blanket the airwaves with bad-faith argument ads and you will lose This is a long way to say you don’t have the votes. Airwaves affect turnout. They don’t flip people on positions.
    - vkou 5mo ago
      > They don’t flip people on positions. They absolutely do. On September 12, 2001, ~nobody in the United States was interested in starting a war with Iraq. Two years of propaganda later, and all of a sudden, half the population had acquired keen geopolitical insights which necessitated an invasion and occupation of a country that had exactly fuck-all to do with 9/11. A decade later, all of a sudden, nobody wanted to fess up to wanting anything to do with that mess. Public wants aren't discovered in some interference-free democratic vacuum. The people who own the press put a millstone on their side of the scales.
      - JumpCrisscross 5mo ago
        > Two years of propaganda later, and all of a sudden, half the population had acquired keen geopolitical insights which necessitated an invasion and occupation of a country that had exactly fuck-all to do with 9/11 There was desire for vengeance on 12 September. Reporting and politicians channeled it. That’s very different from driving consensus against something people would otherwise support.
        vkou 5mo ago
        You're proving my point. The thumb was put on the scale, he public was bombarded 24/7 with self-serving false dichotomies and viola, you've just manufactured mass public support for insane bullshit. It works the same way in other countries too. Look at any country that you believe to believe in insane shit - most of those beliefs aren't organic. Neither are the insane things you believe in. It's just that you can't even see that they aren't the product of your own reasoning. Fish don't have a word for water.
        cruffle_duffle 5mo ago
        > You're proving my point. The thumb was put on the scale, he public was bombarded 24/7 with self-serving false dichotomies and viola, you've just manufactured mass public support for insane bullshit. See also Covid-19. Same shit only waaaaaaay more batshit insane and waaaaaaaay more crazy 24-7 fear mongering.
refurb 5mo ago
Organize, petition your representative and vote. The people saying it doesn’t work are the same people who can’t must the effort to even contact their representative. I had a professor in college who was big on entrepreneurship. So he formed an organization, got others involved, went to Washington to lobby his rep. His rep said “let’s do it”, and sat him down with her staff to write a bill. That bill was brought to the floor for a vote and passed. Until you’ve done that, dont complain the system doesn’t work. The issue with politics today is the level of engagement of the average voter. Few people ever get involved, so the vacuum gets filled with whichever power-hungry mediocre person who puts some effort in.
- bluefirebrand 5mo ago
  > I had a professor in college who was big on entrepreneurship. So he formed an organization, got others involved, went to Washington to lobby his rep. His rep said “let’s do it”, and sat him down with her staff to write a bill. That bill was brought to the floor for a vote and passed. Until you’ve done that, dont complain the system doesn’t work This is a sign of the system not working. A well connected professor, with plenty of free time to form an organization and go to Washington to talk to his rep Might as well be an industry lobbyist. Could a worker from Walmart do the same thing? In theory sure. In practice unlikely, for any number of reasons. Not least because people are unlikely to take a Wal Mart worker seriously enough to join their organization.
  - saligne 5mo ago
    And because workers at the bottom with no rights and no money are fired as soon as they try to organize anything beyond their continued immiseration
  - AlecSchueler 5mo ago
    > A well connected professor, with plenty of free time And not only that but one who was "big on entrepreneurship!" Guy wasn't really rocking the boat, was he?
  - refurb 5mo ago
palmotea 5mo ago
> what are people without billions of dollars and without the ear of the president supposed to do to affect change in this modern, post-capitalist hellscape? The honest truth? They're supposed to do nothing and take their licks with a smile. If that's not good enough for them, they are allowed to occupy themselves with ineffectual political activities, preferably on issues that are exhausting and do not disturb the power of the elite (e.g. abortion, transgenderism, etc.).

by ropetin 5mo ago

tptacek 5mo ago

I read this comment as saying that you (100-k)% do not support violence against Sam Altman, for some positive real number k.

JumpCrisscross 5mo ago

> what are people without billions of dollars and without the ear of the president supposed to do to affect change in this modern, post-capitalist hellscape? California has a referendum system. Get signatures for a policy and put it to the voters.

abenga 5mo ago
The billionaires will blanket the airwaves with bad-faith argument ads and you will lose.
- JumpCrisscross 5mo ago
  > billionaires will blanket the airwaves with bad-faith argument ads and you will lose This is a long way to say you don’t have the votes. Airwaves affect turnout. They don’t flip people on positions.
  - vkou 5mo ago
    > They don’t flip people on positions. They absolutely do. On September 12, 2001, ~nobody in the United States was interested in starting a war with Iraq. Two years of propaganda later, and all of a sudden, half the population had acquired keen geopolitical insights which necessitated an invasion and occupation of a country that had exactly fuck-all to do with 9/11. A decade later, all of a sudden, nobody wanted to fess up to wanting anything to do with that mess. Public wants aren't discovered in some interference-free democratic vacuum. The people who own the press put a millstone on their side of the scales.
    - JumpCrisscross 5mo ago
      > Two years of propaganda later, and all of a sudden, half the population had acquired keen geopolitical insights which necessitated an invasion and occupation of a country that had exactly fuck-all to do with 9/11 There was desire for vengeance on 12 September. Reporting and politicians channeled it. That’s very different from driving consensus against something people would otherwise support.
      - vkou 5mo ago
        You're proving my point. The thumb was put on the scale, he public was bombarded 24/7 with self-serving false dichotomies and viola, you've just manufactured mass public support for insane bullshit. It works the same way in other countries too. Look at any country that you believe to believe in insane shit - most of those beliefs aren't organic. Neither are the insane things you believe in. It's just that you can't even see that they aren't the product of your own reasoning. Fish don't have a word for water.
        cruffle_duffle 5mo ago
        > You're proving my point. The thumb was put on the scale, he public was bombarded 24/7 with self-serving false dichotomies and viola, you've just manufactured mass public support for insane bullshit. See also Covid-19. Same shit only waaaaaaay more batshit insane and waaaaaaaay more crazy 24-7 fear mongering.

refurb 5mo ago

Organize, petition your representative and vote. The people saying it doesn’t work are the same people who can’t must the effort to even contact their representative. I had a professor in college who was big on entrepreneurship. So he formed an organization, got others involved, went to Washington to lobby his rep. His rep said “let’s do it”, and sat him down with her staff to write a bill. That bill was brought to the floor for a vote and passed. Until you’ve done that, dont complain the system doesn’t work. The issue with politics today is the level of engagement of the average voter. Few people ever get involved, so the vacuum gets filled with whichever power-hungry mediocre person who puts some effort in.

bluefirebrand 5mo ago
> I had a professor in college who was big on entrepreneurship. So he formed an organization, got others involved, went to Washington to lobby his rep. His rep said “let’s do it”, and sat him down with her staff to write a bill. That bill was brought to the floor for a vote and passed. Until you’ve done that, dont complain the system doesn’t work This is a sign of the system not working. A well connected professor, with plenty of free time to form an organization and go to Washington to talk to his rep Might as well be an industry lobbyist. Could a worker from Walmart do the same thing? In theory sure. In practice unlikely, for any number of reasons. Not least because people are unlikely to take a Wal Mart worker seriously enough to join their organization.
- saligne 5mo ago
  And because workers at the bottom with no rights and no money are fired as soon as they try to organize anything beyond their continued immiseration
- AlecSchueler 5mo ago
  > A well connected professor, with plenty of free time And not only that but one who was "big on entrepreneurship!" Guy wasn't really rocking the boat, was he?
- refurb 5mo ago

palmotea 5mo ago

> what are people without billions of dollars and without the ear of the president supposed to do to affect change in this modern, post-capitalist hellscape? The honest truth? They're supposed to do nothing and take their licks with a smile. If that's not good enough for them, they are allowed to occupy themselves with ineffectual political activities, preferably on issues that are exhausting and do not disturb the power of the elite (e.g. abortion, transgenderism, etc.).