10 ms·

True, but at scale of 10k, chances of collision due to malfunction are not 0.

madaxe_again 6mo ago
And so what if they collide? This isn’t Kessler syndrome territory, it’s low enough orbit that debris would re-enter and burn up rapidly. You’d lose the colliding satellites, and that’s likely all. Not that there has been a single starlink collision, but y’know.
- jacquesm 6mo ago
  > Not that there has been a single starlink collision How sure are you that that would be made public? Would it be always observed and caught outside of SpaceX? If not, is that proof that if there such collisions they don't matter?
  - madaxe_again 6mo ago
    There are a great many eyes on the sky, and you can’t hide stuff up there - even every secret military satellite is known and tracked - so something as substantial as a collision would likely be known about before it even happens, as ephemera don’t change without an input.
    - jacquesm 6mo ago
      Thank you for the answer. I'm aware of the degree of coverage over land but I was wondering about the ocean side of things as well.
  - karlgkk 6mo ago
    > How sure are you that that would be made public? Extremely sure. There are both numerous private, academic, and governmental agencies that are constantly searching for both collision paths, and collision debris. The debris cloud alone would generate an extremely visible signature. > Would it be always observed and caught outside of SpaceX? Yes.
    - jacquesm 6mo ago
      Thank you for the answer.
- LightBug1 6mo ago
  Wait until multiple, non-coordinated copy-cat constellations are sent up there ...
  - mikkupikku 6mo ago
    Large operators like SpaceX and OneWeb do coordinate with each other. Ground based radar tracking data from the government is also made available to operators, and SpaceX has developed their own optical space-based detection system (Stargaze) which makes data available to other operators as well. There's a lot of money in this stuff, lot's of planning. It's being managed by competent people who give a shit.
mikkupikku 6mo ago
Nobody says the chance of a collisions is zero. That's why it being in LEO is relevant. Internet fools who just get scared by the big number without considering the details of the situation always get this wrong.
- rob74 6mo ago
  So, because the 10,000+ Starlinks launched so far (and the countless future satellites Bezos and others want to launch for their own constellations) are in LEO, nothing bad can happen (it can only good happen)? That is, if you disregard the following quote from the article: > Each re-entry deposits about 30 kg of aluminum oxide into the upper atmosphere--an uncontrolled chemistry experiment on a planetary scale.
  - mikkupikku 6mo ago
    The bad that can happen is limited by it being in LEO. If these were MEO sats but 50x fewer (Bezos sats BTW) you wouldn't be whining about it even though the potential debris would last thousands of years instead of less than ten. And appealing to the fear of the unknown is little more than motivated reasoning, the amount of rocks and rock dust entering the atmosphere dwarfs Starlink reentries.
    - krunck 6mo ago
      Rock dust ≠ AlO "Aluminum oxide compounds generated by the entire population of satellites reentering the atmosphere in 2022 are estimated at around 17 metric tons. Reentry scenarios involving mega-constellations point to over 360 metric tons of aluminum oxide compounds per year, which can lead to significant ozone depletion." https://agupubs.onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1029/2024GL109280 https://agupubs.onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1029/2024GL10...

And so what if they collide? This isn’t Kessler syndrome territory, it’s low enough orbit that debris would re-enter and burn up rapidly. You’d lose the colliding satellites, and that’s likely all. Not that there has been a single starlink collision, but y’know.

jacquesm 6mo ago
> Not that there has been a single starlink collision How sure are you that that would be made public? Would it be always observed and caught outside of SpaceX? If not, is that proof that if there such collisions they don't matter?
- madaxe_again 6mo ago
  There are a great many eyes on the sky, and you can’t hide stuff up there - even every secret military satellite is known and tracked - so something as substantial as a collision would likely be known about before it even happens, as ephemera don’t change without an input.
  - jacquesm 6mo ago
    Thank you for the answer. I'm aware of the degree of coverage over land but I was wondering about the ocean side of things as well.
- karlgkk 6mo ago
  > How sure are you that that would be made public? Extremely sure. There are both numerous private, academic, and governmental agencies that are constantly searching for both collision paths, and collision debris. The debris cloud alone would generate an extremely visible signature. > Would it be always observed and caught outside of SpaceX? Yes.
  - jacquesm 6mo ago
    Thank you for the answer.
LightBug1 6mo ago
Wait until multiple, non-coordinated copy-cat constellations are sent up there ...
- mikkupikku 6mo ago
  Large operators like SpaceX and OneWeb do coordinate with each other. Ground based radar tracking data from the government is also made available to operators, and SpaceX has developed their own optical space-based detection system (Stargaze) which makes data available to other operators as well. There's a lot of money in this stuff, lot's of planning. It's being managed by competent people who give a shit.

mikkupikku 6mo ago

Nobody says the chance of a collisions is zero. That's why it being in LEO is relevant. Internet fools who just get scared by the big number without considering the details of the situation always get this wrong.

rob74 6mo ago
So, because the 10,000+ Starlinks launched so far (and the countless future satellites Bezos and others want to launch for their own constellations) are in LEO, nothing bad can happen (it can only good happen)? That is, if you disregard the following quote from the article: > Each re-entry deposits about 30 kg of aluminum oxide into the upper atmosphere--an uncontrolled chemistry experiment on a planetary scale.
- mikkupikku 6mo ago
  The bad that can happen is limited by it being in LEO. If these were MEO sats but 50x fewer (Bezos sats BTW) you wouldn't be whining about it even though the potential debris would last thousands of years instead of less than ten. And appealing to the fear of the unknown is little more than motivated reasoning, the amount of rocks and rock dust entering the atmosphere dwarfs Starlink reentries.
  - krunck 6mo ago
    Rock dust ≠ AlO "Aluminum oxide compounds generated by the entire population of satellites reentering the atmosphere in 2022 are estimated at around 17 metric tons. Reentry scenarios involving mega-constellations point to over 360 metric tons of aluminum oxide compounds per year, which can lead to significant ozone depletion." https://agupubs.onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1029/2024GL109280 https://agupubs.onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1029/2024GL10...