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Is it such a burden to write them a letter stating, "Because you have decided to disable my electronic access, I am notifying you that I withdraw my consent to

Is it such a burden to write them a letter stating, "Because you have decided to disable my electronic access, I am notifying you that I withdraw my consent to e-delivery. Please provide me statements and directions to mail you a check for payment." Maybe spend 20-30 min to find the specific laws that give you the right to do that and remind them of their timelines to comply. Send a letter like that certified. It gets attention, and the time to write and mail a check really isn't, if you batch your bills, more than using an app. We do have ways to push their inconvenience back on them.

Forgeties79 7mo ago
Not everyone has the time and resources to battle their utilities and bank(s). I know it’s important and sustained effort is necessary even if it’s hard, but we are talking about massive populations here and most people simply can’t or won’t fight that battle on their own. Organizing a large pushback is also a huge effort. And at the end of the day, there is an easy solution for folks: buy a “proper” smart phone that “just works” because it solves the problem now. We’ve gotten to the point where unfortunately it is a luxury to fight for your privacy and consumer rights.
- bornfreddy 7mo ago
  Fighting for your rights is usually not the easy path, yes. It's been like that since forever.
  - abustamam 7mo ago
    Well, we gotta choose our battles, right? It's easy to get collective support for visible oppression and fascism. Everyone sees it on the news. It's hard to get support for "lemme use a smartphone that isn't apple or android." the average person doesn't care. Not saying that we should just give up. But as the above poster said, it's a luxury that takes a lot of time and resources.
    - bornfreddy 7mo ago
      > It's easy to get collective support for visible oppression and fascism. Everyone sees it on the news. Do they? News is usually the first thing that is replaced by propaganda. But yes, everyone chooses the battles they wish to fight. None are easy.
      - abustamam 7mo ago
        Perhaps, but a recent example is ICE in Minnesota. The administration tried its best to spin it to match its propaganda but many people saw through it.
  - Forgeties79 7mo ago
    Yes that is correct. So what do you suggest people do? What is a realistic way to move the needle? Because I can tell you now that (as I detailed in another comment) asking someone to change their banks, utilities, etc. to accommodate their smartphone choice is not a serious suggestion, nor is asking everyone to wage war with all the services they engage with. They’re simply not going to do it no matter how many passionate speeches or flippant comments you throw out there. They’re going to buy the thing that solves the immediate problem of not having access to critical services in their lives. If their amazing open source phone can’t pay their bills, it’s going in the bin. To be clear I want the same thing you do. But just going “do it it’s important” is not going to make it happen.
- JCattheATM 7mo ago
  > Not everyone has the time and resources to battle their utilities and bank(s). They do, they just don't want to. Typing a short letter and mailing it is very little effort. Less so with AI these days.
  - Forgeties79 7mo ago
    An AI generated letter isn’t going to get my utility company to drop their explicitly chosen practice of blocking VPN’s. These aren’t oversights, these are deliberate practices.
    - JCattheATM 7mo ago
      'AI generated' is irrelevant here, they wouldn't know and it's just a time saver in response to the 'people don't have enough time' excuse. That's a weird one though, if you have alternatives you could always switch.
      - Forgeties79 7mo ago
        My only alternative is to not have natural gas
        JCattheATM 7mo ago
        Fair enough, although barring VPN use is quite a bit different from forcing an app that requires Play Services or iPhone. A VPN isn't as legitimate a need to pay a utility bill in the same way paying without an Android or iOS phone can be.
        Forgeties79 7mo ago
        I don’t see why not. It entirely depends on why someone needs a VPN. And I also shouldn’t need to justify it regardless.
        7mo ago
safety1st 7mo ago
It is great that you have the right in your jurisdiction to do that. Where I am, they just shut off your power if you don't pay. It's a big and hairy world out there. Having lived on three continents and traveled to some pretty wild places, I always get a kick out of seeing which rights people have and assume that the rest of the world also has.
abustamam 7mo ago
This only works if the company cares though.
- abighamb 7mo ago
  This a pretty general recipe to make a company care. A Professional letter letting them know that you know your rights, and that they know your rights (Them getting your letter is your proof of that) is what the beginning of someone losing his bonus for a compliance incident looks like. Companies don't care about you, or even shareholders, they care about the incentives of leadership.

Forgeties79 7mo ago

Not everyone has the time and resources to battle their utilities and bank(s). I know it’s important and sustained effort is necessary even if it’s hard, but we are talking about massive populations here and most people simply can’t or won’t fight that battle on their own. Organizing a large pushback is also a huge effort. And at the end of the day, there is an easy solution for folks: buy a “proper” smart phone that “just works” because it solves the problem now. We’ve gotten to the point where unfortunately it is a luxury to fight for your privacy and consumer rights.

bornfreddy 7mo ago
Fighting for your rights is usually not the easy path, yes. It's been like that since forever.
- abustamam 7mo ago
  Well, we gotta choose our battles, right? It's easy to get collective support for visible oppression and fascism. Everyone sees it on the news. It's hard to get support for "lemme use a smartphone that isn't apple or android." the average person doesn't care. Not saying that we should just give up. But as the above poster said, it's a luxury that takes a lot of time and resources.
  - bornfreddy 7mo ago
    > It's easy to get collective support for visible oppression and fascism. Everyone sees it on the news. Do they? News is usually the first thing that is replaced by propaganda. But yes, everyone chooses the battles they wish to fight. None are easy.
    - abustamam 7mo ago
      Perhaps, but a recent example is ICE in Minnesota. The administration tried its best to spin it to match its propaganda but many people saw through it.
- Forgeties79 7mo ago
  Yes that is correct. So what do you suggest people do? What is a realistic way to move the needle? Because I can tell you now that (as I detailed in another comment) asking someone to change their banks, utilities, etc. to accommodate their smartphone choice is not a serious suggestion, nor is asking everyone to wage war with all the services they engage with. They’re simply not going to do it no matter how many passionate speeches or flippant comments you throw out there. They’re going to buy the thing that solves the immediate problem of not having access to critical services in their lives. If their amazing open source phone can’t pay their bills, it’s going in the bin. To be clear I want the same thing you do. But just going “do it it’s important” is not going to make it happen.
JCattheATM 7mo ago
> Not everyone has the time and resources to battle their utilities and bank(s). They do, they just don't want to. Typing a short letter and mailing it is very little effort. Less so with AI these days.
- Forgeties79 7mo ago
  An AI generated letter isn’t going to get my utility company to drop their explicitly chosen practice of blocking VPN’s. These aren’t oversights, these are deliberate practices.
  - JCattheATM 7mo ago
    'AI generated' is irrelevant here, they wouldn't know and it's just a time saver in response to the 'people don't have enough time' excuse. That's a weird one though, if you have alternatives you could always switch.
    - Forgeties79 7mo ago
      My only alternative is to not have natural gas
      - JCattheATM 7mo ago
        Fair enough, although barring VPN use is quite a bit different from forcing an app that requires Play Services or iPhone. A VPN isn't as legitimate a need to pay a utility bill in the same way paying without an Android or iOS phone can be.
        Forgeties79 7mo ago
        I don’t see why not. It entirely depends on why someone needs a VPN. And I also shouldn’t need to justify it regardless.
        7mo ago

safety1st 7mo ago

It is great that you have the right in your jurisdiction to do that. Where I am, they just shut off your power if you don't pay. It's a big and hairy world out there. Having lived on three continents and traveled to some pretty wild places, I always get a kick out of seeing which rights people have and assume that the rest of the world also has.

abustamam 7mo ago

This only works if the company cares though.

abighamb 7mo ago
This a pretty general recipe to make a company care. A Professional letter letting them know that you know your rights, and that they know your rights (Them getting your letter is your proof of that) is what the beginning of someone losing his bonus for a compliance incident looks like. Companies don't care about you, or even shareholders, they care about the incentives of leadership.