7 ms·

This is one of those “don’t be evil” like articles that companies remove when the going gets tough but I guess we should be thankful that things are looking ros

This is one of those “don’t be evil” like articles that companies remove when the going gets tough but I guess we should be thankful that things are looking rosy enough for Anthropic at the moment that they would release a blog like this. The point about filtering signal vs. noise in search engines can’t really be stated enough. At this point using a search engine and the conventional internet in general is an exercise in frustration. It’s simply a user hostile place – infinite cookie banners for sites that shouldn’t collect data at all, auto play advertisements, engagement farming, sites generated by AI to shill and produce a word count. You could argue that AI exacerbates this situation but you also have to agree that it is much more pleasant to ask perplexity, ChatGPT or Claude a question than to put yourself through the torture of conventional search. Introducing ads into this would completely deprive the user of a way of navigating the web in a way that actually respects their dignity. I also agree in the sense that the current crop of AIs do feel like a space to think as opposed to a place where I am being manipulated, controlled or treated like some sheep in flock to be sheared for cash.

pixelready 7mo ago
The current crop of LLM-backed chatbots do have a bit of that “old, good internet” flavor. A mostly unspoiled frontier where things are changing rapidly, potential seems unbounded, the people molding the actual tech and discussing it are enthusiasts with a sort of sorcerer’s apprentice vibe. Not sure how long it can persist, since I’ve seen this story before and we all understand the incentive structures at play. Does anyone know how if there are precedents for PBCs or B-Corp type businesses to be held accountable for betraying their stated values? Or is it just window dressing with no legal clout? Can they change to a standard corporation on a whim and ditch the non-shareholder maximization goals?
- chanux 7mo ago
  Just enjoy the "good times" powered by other peoples money.
- einpoklum 7mo ago
  No, they don't. They soak up tons of your most personal and sensitive information like a sponge, and you don't know what's done with it. In the "good old Internet", that did not happen. Also in the good old Internet, it wasn't the masses all dependent on a few central mega-corporations shaping the interaction, but a many-to-many affair, with people and organizations of different sizes running the sites where interaction took place. Ok, I know I'm describing the past with rosy glasses. After all, the Internet started as a DARPA project. But still, current reality is itself rather dystopic in many ways.
- petetnt 7mo ago
  There’s nothing old internet about these AI companies. Old internet was about giving out and asking for nothing in return. These companies take everything and give back nothing, unless you are willing to pay that is.
  - dasil003 7mo ago
    I get the sentiment, but if you can't acknowledge that AI is useful and currently a lot better than search for a great many things, then it's hard to have a rational conversation.
    - y0eswddl 7mo ago
      why do they need to acknowledge something outside of the point they're trying to make?
      - j-bos 7mo ago
        because that's how conversations work. anything less is sparkling debate.
      - dasil003 7mo ago
        Because it was a middlebrow dismissal of the GP
    - nickphx 7mo ago
      how is it useful to be fed misleading nonsense?
  - deleted 7mo ago
    [deleted]
terminalbraid 7mo ago
> I guess we should be thankful that things are looking rosy enough for Anthropic Forgive me if I am not.
jorvi 7mo ago
Current LLMs often produce much, much worse results than manually searching. If you need to search the internet on a topic that is full of unknown unknowns for you, they're a pretty decent way to get a lay of the land, but beyond that, off to Kagi (or Google) you go. Even worse is that the results are inconsistent. I can ask Gemini five times at what temperature I should take a waterfowl out of the oven, and get five different answers, 10°C apart. You cannot trust answers from an LLM.
- chrysoprace 7mo ago
  It obviously takes discipline, but using something like Perplexity as an aggregator typically gets me better results, because I can click through to the sources. It's not a perfect solution because you need the discipline/intuition to do that, and not blindly trust the summary.
- signatoremo 7mo ago
  > I can ask Gemini five times at what temperature I should take a waterfowl out of the oven, and get five different answers, 10°C apart. Are you sure? Both Gemini and ChatGPT gave me consistent answers 3 times in a row, even if the two versions are slightly different. Their answers are inline with this version: https://blog.thermoworks.com/duck_roast/ https://blog.thermoworks.com/duck_roast/
  - jorvi 7mo ago
    What do you mean, "are you sure"? I literally saw and see it happen in front of my eyes. Just now tested it with slight variations of "ideal temperature waterfowl cooking", "best temperature waterfowl roasting", etc. and all these questions yield different answers, with temperatures ranging from 47c-57c (ignoring the 74c food safety ones). That's my entire point. Even adding an "is" or "the" can get you way different advice. No human would give you different info when you ask "what's the waterfowl's best cooking temperature" vs "what is waterfowl's best roasting temperature".
    - cruffle_duffle 7mo ago
stavros 7mo ago
> This is one of those “don’t be evil” like articles that companies remove when the going gets tough but I guess we should be thankful that things are looking rosy enough for Anthropic at the moment that they would release a blog like this. Exactly this. Show me the incentive, and I'll show you the outcome, but at least I'm glad we're getting a bit more time ad-free.
namelosw 7mo ago
And it's very timely and intentional, as Gemini is already shoveling product links on my face repeatedly, while OpenAI is testing ads recently. [0] [0] https://openai.com/index/our-approach-to-advertising-and-expanding-access/ https://openai.com/index/our-approach-to-advertising-and-exp...
mrcwinn 7mo ago
I agree, but at least this is a policy. "Don't be evil" was vague bullshit.
jhhh 7mo ago
Right, if there's no legal weight to any of their statements then they mean almost nothing. It's a very weak signal and just feels like marketing. All digital goods can and will be made worse over time if it benefits the company.
zombot 7mo ago
> Introducing ads into this would completely deprive the user of a way of navigating the web in a way that actually respects their dignity. Say what you will, there are at least ad blockers for ads on the internet. There are _no_ ad blockers for ads in chatbots.

pixelready 7mo ago

The current crop of LLM-backed chatbots do have a bit of that “old, good internet” flavor. A mostly unspoiled frontier where things are changing rapidly, potential seems unbounded, the people molding the actual tech and discussing it are enthusiasts with a sort of sorcerer’s apprentice vibe. Not sure how long it can persist, since I’ve seen this story before and we all understand the incentive structures at play. Does anyone know how if there are precedents for PBCs or B-Corp type businesses to be held accountable for betraying their stated values? Or is it just window dressing with no legal clout? Can they change to a standard corporation on a whim and ditch the non-shareholder maximization goals?

chanux 7mo ago
Just enjoy the "good times" powered by other peoples money.
einpoklum 7mo ago
No, they don't. They soak up tons of your most personal and sensitive information like a sponge, and you don't know what's done with it. In the "good old Internet", that did not happen. Also in the good old Internet, it wasn't the masses all dependent on a few central mega-corporations shaping the interaction, but a many-to-many affair, with people and organizations of different sizes running the sites where interaction took place. Ok, I know I'm describing the past with rosy glasses. After all, the Internet started as a DARPA project. But still, current reality is itself rather dystopic in many ways.
petetnt 7mo ago
There’s nothing old internet about these AI companies. Old internet was about giving out and asking for nothing in return. These companies take everything and give back nothing, unless you are willing to pay that is.
- dasil003 7mo ago
  I get the sentiment, but if you can't acknowledge that AI is useful and currently a lot better than search for a great many things, then it's hard to have a rational conversation.
  - y0eswddl 7mo ago
    why do they need to acknowledge something outside of the point they're trying to make?
    - j-bos 7mo ago
      because that's how conversations work. anything less is sparkling debate.
    - dasil003 7mo ago
      Because it was a middlebrow dismissal of the GP
  - nickphx 7mo ago
    how is it useful to be fed misleading nonsense?
- deleted 7mo ago
  [deleted]

terminalbraid 7mo ago

> I guess we should be thankful that things are looking rosy enough for Anthropic Forgive me if I am not.

jorvi 7mo ago

Current LLMs often produce much, much worse results than manually searching. If you need to search the internet on a topic that is full of unknown unknowns for you, they're a pretty decent way to get a lay of the land, but beyond that, off to Kagi (or Google) you go. Even worse is that the results are inconsistent. I can ask Gemini five times at what temperature I should take a waterfowl out of the oven, and get five different answers, 10°C apart. You cannot trust answers from an LLM.

chrysoprace 7mo ago
It obviously takes discipline, but using something like Perplexity as an aggregator typically gets me better results, because I can click through to the sources. It's not a perfect solution because you need the discipline/intuition to do that, and not blindly trust the summary.
signatoremo 7mo ago
> I can ask Gemini five times at what temperature I should take a waterfowl out of the oven, and get five different answers, 10°C apart. Are you sure? Both Gemini and ChatGPT gave me consistent answers 3 times in a row, even if the two versions are slightly different. Their answers are inline with this version: https://blog.thermoworks.com/duck_roast/ https://blog.thermoworks.com/duck_roast/
- jorvi 7mo ago
  What do you mean, "are you sure"? I literally saw and see it happen in front of my eyes. Just now tested it with slight variations of "ideal temperature waterfowl cooking", "best temperature waterfowl roasting", etc. and all these questions yield different answers, with temperatures ranging from 47c-57c (ignoring the 74c food safety ones). That's my entire point. Even adding an "is" or "the" can get you way different advice. No human would give you different info when you ask "what's the waterfowl's best cooking temperature" vs "what is waterfowl's best roasting temperature".
  - cruffle_duffle 7mo ago

stavros 7mo ago

> This is one of those “don’t be evil” like articles that companies remove when the going gets tough but I guess we should be thankful that things are looking rosy enough for Anthropic at the moment that they would release a blog like this. Exactly this. Show me the incentive, and I'll show you the outcome, but at least I'm glad we're getting a bit more time ad-free.

namelosw 7mo ago

And it's very timely and intentional, as Gemini is already shoveling product links on my face repeatedly, while OpenAI is testing ads recently. [0] [0] https://openai.com/index/our-approach-to-advertising-and-expanding-access/ https://openai.com/index/our-approach-to-advertising-and-exp...

mrcwinn 7mo ago

I agree, but at least this is a policy. "Don't be evil" was vague bullshit.

jhhh 7mo ago

Right, if there's no legal weight to any of their statements then they mean almost nothing. It's a very weak signal and just feels like marketing. All digital goods can and will be made worse over time if it benefits the company.

zombot 7mo ago

> Introducing ads into this would completely deprive the user of a way of navigating the web in a way that actually respects their dignity. Say what you will, there are at least ad blockers for ads on the internet. There are _no_ ad blockers for ads in chatbots.