8 ms·

This isn’t explicitly called out in any of the other comments in my opinion so I’ll state this. Valve as a company is incredibly focused internally on its busi

This isn’t explicitly called out in any of the other comments in my opinion so I’ll state this. Valve as a company is incredibly focused internally on its business. Its business is games, game hardware, and game delivery. For anything outside of that purview instead of trying to build a huge internal team they contract out. I’m genuinely curious why other companies don’t do this style more often because it seems incredibly cost effective. They hire top level contractors to do top tier work on hyper specific areas and everyone benefits. I think this kind of work is why Valve gets a free pass to do some real heinous shit (all the gambling stuff) and maintain incredible good will. They’re a true “take the good with the bad” kind of company. I certainly don’t condone all the bad they’ve put out, and I also have to recognize all the good they’ve done at the same time. Back to the root point. Small company focused on core business competencies, extremely effective at contracting non-core business functions. I wish more businesses functioned this way.

smotched 9mo ago
Whats the bad practices valve is doing in gambling?
- mewse-hn 9mo ago
  Loot box style underage gambling in their live service games - TF2 hats, counterstrike skins, "trading cards", etc etc
- msh 9mo ago
  Lootboxes comes to mind.
- crtasm 9mo ago
  Their games and systems tie into huge gambling operations on 3rd party sites If you have 30mins for a video I recommend People Make Games' documentary on it https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eMmNy11Mn7g https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eMmNy11Mn7g
  - deleted 9mo ago
    [deleted]
  - trinsic2 9mo ago
    Yeah, im sorry. Valve is the last company people should be focusing for this type of behavior. All the other AAA game companies use these mechanics to deliberate manipulate players. IMHO valve doesn't use predatory practices to keep this stuff going.
    - heywoods 9mo ago
      Just because they weren’t the first mover into predatory practices doesn’t mean they can’t say no to said practices. Each actor has agency to make their own operating and business decisions. Is Valve the worst of the lot? Absolutely not. But it was still their choice to implement.
      - inexcf 9mo ago
        What makes Valve special is that they were the first mover on those practices like lootboxes, gamepasses... but they never pushed it as far as the competition where it became predatory.
      - trinsic2 9mo ago
        They have a track record of not engaging in these practices. It might be true that someday, we will get the wrong people in leadership positions at Valve that would entertain this behavior, but so far I don't think its going to happen. Valve has been time and time again, on the side of sane thinking around these topics. So IMHO your concern isn't really warranted as of yet.
    - crtasm 9mo ago
      How much of the video did you watch? I'm not aware of other game companies that enable 3rd party integrations into their item systems. This isn't just "lootboxes bad" - it's Valve profiting from actual gambling happening on external sites.
tayo42 9mo ago
I feel like I rarely see contacting out work go well. This seems like an exception
- magicalhippo 9mo ago
  If you have competent people on both sides who care, I don't see why it wouldn't work. The problem seems, at least from a distance, to be that bosses treat it as a fire-and-forget solution. We haven't had any software done by oursiders yet, but we have hired consultants to help us on specifics, like changing our infra and help move local servers to the cloud. They've been very effective and helped us a lot. We had talks though so we found someone who we could trust had the knowledge, and we were knowledgeable enough ourselves that we could determine that. We then followed up closely.
  - tayo42 9mo ago
    I think your first 2 sentances are pretty common issues though.
  - stackskipton 9mo ago
    Most companies that hiring a ton of contractors are doing it for business/financial reporting reasons. Contractors don't show up as employees so investors don't see employee count rise so metric of "Revenue/Employee" ratio does not get dragged down and contractors can be cut immediately with no further on expenses. Laid off employees take about quarter to be truly shed from the books between severance, vacation payouts and unemployment insurance.
- abnercoimbre 9mo ago
  Nope. Plenty of top-tier contractors work quietly with their clientele and let the companies take the credit (so long as they reference the contractor to others, keeping the gravy train going.) If you don't see it happening, the game is being played as intended.
- TulliusCicero 9mo ago
  Valve contracts out to actually competent people and companies rather than giant bodycount consulting firms.
javier2 9mo ago
Yeah, I suppose this workflow is not for everyone. I can only imagine Valve has very specific issue or requirements in mind when they hire contractors like this. When you hire like this, i suspect what one really pay for is a well known name that will be able to push something important to you to upstream linux. Its the right way to do it if you want it resolved quickly. If you come in as a fresh contributor, landing features upstream could take years.
butlike 9mo ago
Small company doesn't have the capital to contract out library work like that. Same story as it's always been

smotched 9mo ago

Whats the bad practices valve is doing in gambling?

mewse-hn 9mo ago
Loot box style underage gambling in their live service games - TF2 hats, counterstrike skins, "trading cards", etc etc
msh 9mo ago
Lootboxes comes to mind.
crtasm 9mo ago
Their games and systems tie into huge gambling operations on 3rd party sites If you have 30mins for a video I recommend People Make Games' documentary on it https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eMmNy11Mn7g https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eMmNy11Mn7g
- deleted 9mo ago
  [deleted]
- trinsic2 9mo ago
  Yeah, im sorry. Valve is the last company people should be focusing for this type of behavior. All the other AAA game companies use these mechanics to deliberate manipulate players. IMHO valve doesn't use predatory practices to keep this stuff going.
  - heywoods 9mo ago
    Just because they weren’t the first mover into predatory practices doesn’t mean they can’t say no to said practices. Each actor has agency to make their own operating and business decisions. Is Valve the worst of the lot? Absolutely not. But it was still their choice to implement.
    - inexcf 9mo ago
      What makes Valve special is that they were the first mover on those practices like lootboxes, gamepasses... but they never pushed it as far as the competition where it became predatory.
    - trinsic2 9mo ago
      They have a track record of not engaging in these practices. It might be true that someday, we will get the wrong people in leadership positions at Valve that would entertain this behavior, but so far I don't think its going to happen. Valve has been time and time again, on the side of sane thinking around these topics. So IMHO your concern isn't really warranted as of yet.
  - crtasm 9mo ago
    How much of the video did you watch? I'm not aware of other game companies that enable 3rd party integrations into their item systems. This isn't just "lootboxes bad" - it's Valve profiting from actual gambling happening on external sites.

tayo42 9mo ago

I feel like I rarely see contacting out work go well. This seems like an exception

magicalhippo 9mo ago
If you have competent people on both sides who care, I don't see why it wouldn't work. The problem seems, at least from a distance, to be that bosses treat it as a fire-and-forget solution. We haven't had any software done by oursiders yet, but we have hired consultants to help us on specifics, like changing our infra and help move local servers to the cloud. They've been very effective and helped us a lot. We had talks though so we found someone who we could trust had the knowledge, and we were knowledgeable enough ourselves that we could determine that. We then followed up closely.
- tayo42 9mo ago
  I think your first 2 sentances are pretty common issues though.
- stackskipton 9mo ago
  Most companies that hiring a ton of contractors are doing it for business/financial reporting reasons. Contractors don't show up as employees so investors don't see employee count rise so metric of "Revenue/Employee" ratio does not get dragged down and contractors can be cut immediately with no further on expenses. Laid off employees take about quarter to be truly shed from the books between severance, vacation payouts and unemployment insurance.
abnercoimbre 9mo ago
Nope. Plenty of top-tier contractors work quietly with their clientele and let the companies take the credit (so long as they reference the contractor to others, keeping the gravy train going.) If you don't see it happening, the game is being played as intended.
TulliusCicero 9mo ago
Valve contracts out to actually competent people and companies rather than giant bodycount consulting firms.

javier2 9mo ago

Yeah, I suppose this workflow is not for everyone. I can only imagine Valve has very specific issue or requirements in mind when they hire contractors like this. When you hire like this, i suspect what one really pay for is a well known name that will be able to push something important to you to upstream linux. Its the right way to do it if you want it resolved quickly. If you come in as a fresh contributor, landing features upstream could take years.

butlike 9mo ago

Small company doesn't have the capital to contract out library work like that. Same story as it's always been