8 ms·
This behavior only works when the reverse proxy or CDN is configured like this: Proxy/CDN: HTTPS (443) → Origin server: plain HTTP (80) (example: Cloudflare i
by shishcat 10mo ago
This behavior only works when the reverse proxy or CDN is configured like this:
Proxy/CDN: HTTPS (443) → Origin server: plain HTTP (80)
(example: Cloudflare in Flexible mode)
If the origin server uses any proper TLS configuration, even a self-signed certificate, this method stops working. It only succeeds when the upstream connection to the origin is unsecured.
If you want to test this on a random site without Cloudflare or reverse proxy in general on HTTP:
curl http://www.digiboy.ir/boobs.jpg http://www.digiboy.ir/boobs.jpg -v
- mort96 10mo agoAh, Cloudflare. The world's most widely deployed encryption remover.
- spoiler 10mo agoTo be fair, Cloudflare is also the reason why most sites even have TLS at all, because it offered free certs (through letsencrypt I think?) in a fairly easy to set up way. Certs used to be expensive, and had way more operational overhead and quirks (even setting up ACME/LE)
- Tostino 10mo agoI'm not going to give them credit for the work that Lets Encrypt did.
- master_crab 10mo agoI agree, Let’s encrypt and ACME played a massive role. But it’s still far easier having Cloudflare handle TLS encryption for you. And i say this as someone who uses ACME in certmanager and certbot at home and still prefers the ease with which Cloudflare generates a cert for my domain and terminates TLS for the public side of my cloudflare tunnel.
- Tostino 10mo agoFor my home stuff I just use nginx-proxy-manager and haven't thought about it since I set it up a couple of years ago. For work, I used to use certbot directly at my old place. Now I am building my new stuff on k8s, and I have the ingress manage my certs for me (likely using certbot or similar behind the scenes). Both have been extremely low setup effort and no ongoing effort. I don't like giving Cloudflare my (or my companies/customers) data in exchange for being able to click a checkbox.
- TiredOfLife 10mo agoLets Encrypt can proxy my old http only website to show as https? Without access to server configuration? How?
- Tostino 10mo agoWith nginx-proxy-manager which uses Let's Encrypt for certs you can... This isn't the gotcha you think it is.
- TiredOfLife 10mo agoI don't have access to the server.
- Tostino 10mo agoIt can be run anywhere. You don't need it on the same server. Cloudflare isn't running on the same server either.
- TiredOfLife 10mo agoCloudflare is a checkbox.
- Tostino 10mo agoAnd you only let them see every bit of traffic to and from your site in exchange. What a deal. You changed the subject btw.
- TiredOfLife 10mo agoI didn't. I said that Cloudflare is the one that allowed my http only site to become https.
- spoiler 10mo agoMy bad! I slightly confused my timeline. CF offered free certs long before LE!
- estimator7292 10mo agoAbsolutely not, no. That is all thanks to Let's Encrypt.
- DoctorOW 10mo agoThis was true before Let's Encrypt existed, they'd buy massive 500 domain wildcard SSL certs that free users would split.
- thayne 10mo agoCloudflare has native integration with Let's encrypt, which makes using TLS with a CDN much easier than if you had to acquire the ACME cert and deploy it to the CDN yourself. Granted, most CDNs these days have some form of free certicate system, but that wasn't always the case.
- koakuma-chan 10mo agoLet's Encrypt is unusable for me because they want you to install that certbot thing. I don't know what that is or what it does. I don't want some magical auto update thing. Is it so hard to just make a generate button that gives you cert.pem and pkey.pem? Cloudflare managed to do it.
- anticrymactic 10mo agoLet's encrypt supports ACME. Here are hundreds of ways to obtain a certificate: https://letsencrypt.org/docs/client-options/#other-client-options https://letsencrypt.org/docs/client-options/#other-client-op...
- spoiler 10mo agoRight, DoctorOW correct me; I have limited memory about the state of affairs from a decade ago. They offered free certs for a long time regardless of LE integration
- udev4096 10mo ago[flagged]
- spoiler 10mo agoAre we witch hunting Cloudflare now? What have they done? I think overall CF seems like a pretty decent company? Lol I'm a bit out of the loop it seems. Also what mis-information (other than the claiming CF integrated with LE, but it turns out CF offered free certs before LE even existed lol) did I spread?
- Bratmon 10mo agoPeople on this website will just type any wild lie. I kinda love it. The sky is purple! Charlie Brown had hoes! Cloudflare invented Let's Encrypt! Just say anything you want! We live in a post-truth world- there's no need for anything you say to correspond to any external reality!
- balamatom 10mo agoCongrats! You get it!
- ranger_danger 10mo ago> this website you must be new to the internet...
- tracker1 10mo agoI'm pretty sure Lincoln said that first...
- spoiler 10mo agoI never said Cloudflare was behind Let's Encrypt… Did I? Probably just a misunderstanding. Someone l pointed out I mixed up my timeline a bit because this was over a decade ago, but it turns out CF offered free certs even earlier than LE :) So, while i got the details wrong, I still stand behind what I say: most sites on the web even have TLS enabled because CF offers it for free. I'm not talking about the reverse proxy aspect, but from the UA's perspective
- bawolff 10mo agoIs it really that different than AWS? You either trust your service provider or you don't.
- dhab 10mo agoCould someone help me understand. I looked at: https://developers.cloudflare.com/ssl/origin-configuration/ssl-modes/#custom-ssltls https://developers.cloudflare.com/ssl/origin-configuration/s... it seems to support multiple modes. I didn't quite get if Automatic TLS (https://developers.cloudflare.com/ssl/origin-configuration/ssl-modes/#automatic-ssltls-default https://developers.cloudflare.com/ssl/origin-configuration/s...) could use plain transfers. So: * Is it insecure by default or you have to be intentionally insecure? * Why would anyone pick the flexible/potentially-insecure option?
- wavesquid 10mo agoHistorically? 1. Because TLS certificates were not free 2. Because firewall was "enough" in most people's minds 3. Because TLS was the most CPU intensive part of serving a static site 4. Because some people were using cheap shared hosting providers that upcharged for TLS
- penteract 10mo ago> Why would anyone pick the flexible/potentially-insecure option? Because having a connection that's encrypted between a user and Cloudflare, then unencrypted between Cloudflare and your server is often better than unencrypted all the way. Sketchy ISPs could insert/replace ads, and anyone hosting a free wifi hotspot could learn things your users wouldn't want them to know (e.g. their address if they order a delivery). Setting up TLS properly on your server is harder than using Cloudflare (disclaimer: I have not used Cloudflare, though I have sorted out a certificate for an https server). The problem is that users can't tell if their connection is encrypted all the way to your server. Visiting an https url might lead someone to assume that no-one can eavesdrop on their connection by tapping a cross-ocean cable (TLS can deliver this property). Cloudflare breaks that assumption. Cloudflare's marketing on this is deceptive: https://www.cloudflare.com/application-services/products/ssl/ https://www.cloudflare.com/application-services/products/ssl... says "TLS ensures data passing between users and servers is encrypted". This is true, but the servers it's talking about are Cloudflare's, not the website owner's. Going through to "compare plans", the description of "Universal SSL Certificate" says "If you do not currently use SSL, Cloudflare can provide you with SSL capabilities — no configuration required." This could mislead users and server operators into thinking that they are more secure than they actually are. You cannot get the full benefits of TLS without a private key on your web server. Despite this, I would guess that Cloudflare's "encryption remover" improves security compared to a world where Cloudflare did not offer this. I might feel differently about this if I knew more about people who interact with traffic between Cloudflare's servers and the servers of Cloudflare's customers.
- p0w3n3d 10mo agoEU should simply do the global surveillance quietly on cloudflare, instead of asking all the countries for the law </Irony>
- bobmcnamara 10mo agoIt'll also work DigiNotar-style, when using the only root CA blessed by the National Information Network for general use: I.R. Iran.
- huflungdung 10mo agoDigiboy is a treasure trove of enterprise software. Where else would I get a pirated hpe ilo license from?
- udev4096 10mo agoInteresting. I was just setting up a LB like this: client ->LB(nginx) ->TLS terminate for LB conn -> proxy_pass to backend which is behind nginx and has separate TLS certs. it's surprisingly easy to configure. Wonder why people still use HTTP at all. Even at home, I have setup LE certs for all local domains On a side note, nginx doesn't support HTTP/2 for https load balancing so I am thinking of switching to haproxy which supports it
- butvacuum 10mo agoBecause you've now published your internal machine names. Look up certificate transparency logs.
- udev4096 10mo agoWhat do you mean? I used self-signed for communication b/w LB and the nginx serving backend Edit: I don't see any "machine name" on crt.sh for public LB which uses LE Ah, you meant the DNS address is on CT now. You think I wouldn't know that? Regardless, a dns01 challenge is far better than using self-signed at home
- ranger_danger 10mo agoI don't think this is true... a reverse proxy/CDN can see the full request URL even if the origin server is using TLS (unless you're using mTLS, which almost nobody is), and we don't even know if it's the proxy/CDN or the origin that is filtering based on keywords... but all of them could be doing it.