6 ms·

> Exhibit A for Covid having not changed this is the continuing supremacy of Silicon Valley (tech) You mean like when China built chatgpt 4 in a weekend and op

by wubrr 11mo ago

> Exhibit A for Covid having not changed this is the continuing supremacy of Silicon Valley (tech) You mean like when China built chatgpt 4 in a weekend and open-sourced it for giggles? > Shenzhen (manufacturing) ..or you mean how US manufacturing 'clusters' almost completely disappeared/replaced by Chinese ones? > Proximity to investors. Proximity to customers. Proximity to a skilled employee pool. Proxomity to acquirers. Right, cause you have to physically pet every investor on the head to fundraise, your remote employees must be in san fran cause network latency interferes with their windows remote desktop workflow, and, for some reason, you have to be physically close to your customers when you're selling your web-only llm wrapper saas.

uvaursi 11mo ago
> You mean like when China built chatgpt 4 in a weekend and open-sourced it for giggles? Link?
- fragmede 11mo ago
  It's hyperbole, but they're referring to Deepseek-r1.
SR2Z 11mo ago
> You mean like when China built chatgpt 4 in a weekend and open-sourced it for giggles? DeepSeek R1 is an amazing feat. It's not at the same level as other large frontier models from American companies, just close enough to make them sweat. > ..or you mean how US manufacturing 'clusters' almost completely disappeared/replaced by Chinese ones? The value of goods manufactured in the US has never been higher. US manufacturing focuses on goods at the top of the value chain: jetliners, cars, semiconductors, medical scanners, and other advanced electronics. These tend to cluster in a few places - for example, Long Beach is a hub of space and avionics manufacturing, Texas has the "Silicon Prarie," and Boeing in Everett is one of the major employers in the region. Manufacturing has disappeared as a share of GDP, but that's not because we make less stuff. > Right, cause you have to physically pet every investor on the head to fundraise, your remote employees must be in san fran cause network latency interferes with their windows remote desktop workflow, and, for some reason, you have to be physically close to your customers when you're selling your web-only llm wrapper saas. You sound sarcastic, but YES. You do generally have to physically be present to make deals. It is obviously theoretically possible to run a world-leading software company fully remote. Despite that, most of them are in-person at least a few days a week. If you want to take advantage of SV's easy VC money, you absolutely have to be present. Companies are not purely about the numbers. A lot of business is imprecise and heavily dependent on things like just plain LIKING the people you're in bed with, and unfortunately there is no substitute for being in the same room as someone to make a decision like that.
- com2kid 11mo ago
  > Manufacturing has disappeared as a share of GDP, but that's not because we make less stuff. We assemble. The actual parts are largely made overseas. Because location matters, assemblers in China are able to do better work at a much lower price, see every Chinese EV company, or Chinese drone companies. Heck in China you can buy a competent Chinese EV motorscooter for less than a kids bicycle in America.
  - SR2Z 11mo ago
    > We assemble. The actual parts are largely made overseas. It really depends on the product and the supply chains involved. Lots of parts make trips through multiple countries, and even the US multiple times. But yes, I agree that agglomeration matters a ton.
- wubrr 11mo ago
  > It's not at the same level as other large frontier models from American companies Cool story > The value of goods manufactured in the US has never been higher... Manufacturing has disappeared as a share of GDP, but that's not because we make less stuff. You're seriously going to try to argue how US manufacturing (which was the greatest share of global manufacturing by far) didn't decline, to support a point about how China (Shenzhen) is apparently an unreplicable manufacturing hub due to 'cluster effect'? It's funny that you don't see the contradiction. For the record, US manufacturing as a share of global manufacturing has significantly declined over the years. [0][1] " > The United States' share of global manufacturing activity declined from 28% in 2002, following the end of the 2001 U.S. recession, to 16.5% in 2011 > China displaced the United States as the largest manufacturing country in 2010 > Manufacturing output, measured in each country's local currency adjusted for inflation, has been growing more slowly in the United States than in China, South Korea, Germany, and Mexico " > You do generally have to physically be present to make deals. If you need to be physically present for a meeting, you make a trip. There is absolutely zero benefit to living in close proximity to investors the rest of the time. > It is obviously theoretically possible to run a world-leading software company fully remote. It is obviously not just theoretically possible, and many companies do so. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Manufacturing_in_the_United_States#International_comparison https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Manufacturing_in_the_United_St... [1] https://www.bcg.com/press/21september2023-north-american-companies-have-relocated-production-sourcing-over-past-five-years https://www.bcg.com/press/21september2023-north-american-com...

by wubrr 11mo ago

uvaursi 11mo ago

> You mean like when China built chatgpt 4 in a weekend and open-sourced it for giggles? Link?

fragmede 11mo ago
It's hyperbole, but they're referring to Deepseek-r1.

SR2Z 11mo ago

> You mean like when China built chatgpt 4 in a weekend and open-sourced it for giggles? DeepSeek R1 is an amazing feat. It's not at the same level as other large frontier models from American companies, just close enough to make them sweat. > ..or you mean how US manufacturing 'clusters' almost completely disappeared/replaced by Chinese ones? The value of goods manufactured in the US has never been higher. US manufacturing focuses on goods at the top of the value chain: jetliners, cars, semiconductors, medical scanners, and other advanced electronics. These tend to cluster in a few places - for example, Long Beach is a hub of space and avionics manufacturing, Texas has the "Silicon Prarie," and Boeing in Everett is one of the major employers in the region. Manufacturing has disappeared as a share of GDP, but that's not because we make less stuff. > Right, cause you have to physically pet every investor on the head to fundraise, your remote employees must be in san fran cause network latency interferes with their windows remote desktop workflow, and, for some reason, you have to be physically close to your customers when you're selling your web-only llm wrapper saas. You sound sarcastic, but YES. You do generally have to physically be present to make deals. It is obviously theoretically possible to run a world-leading software company fully remote. Despite that, most of them are in-person at least a few days a week. If you want to take advantage of SV's easy VC money, you absolutely have to be present. Companies are not purely about the numbers. A lot of business is imprecise and heavily dependent on things like just plain LIKING the people you're in bed with, and unfortunately there is no substitute for being in the same room as someone to make a decision like that.

com2kid 11mo ago
> Manufacturing has disappeared as a share of GDP, but that's not because we make less stuff. We assemble. The actual parts are largely made overseas. Because location matters, assemblers in China are able to do better work at a much lower price, see every Chinese EV company, or Chinese drone companies. Heck in China you can buy a competent Chinese EV motorscooter for less than a kids bicycle in America.
- SR2Z 11mo ago
  > We assemble. The actual parts are largely made overseas. It really depends on the product and the supply chains involved. Lots of parts make trips through multiple countries, and even the US multiple times. But yes, I agree that agglomeration matters a ton.
wubrr 11mo ago
> It's not at the same level as other large frontier models from American companies Cool story > The value of goods manufactured in the US has never been higher... Manufacturing has disappeared as a share of GDP, but that's not because we make less stuff. You're seriously going to try to argue how US manufacturing (which was the greatest share of global manufacturing by far) didn't decline, to support a point about how China (Shenzhen) is apparently an unreplicable manufacturing hub due to 'cluster effect'? It's funny that you don't see the contradiction. For the record, US manufacturing as a share of global manufacturing has significantly declined over the years. [0][1] " > The United States' share of global manufacturing activity declined from 28% in 2002, following the end of the 2001 U.S. recession, to 16.5% in 2011 > China displaced the United States as the largest manufacturing country in 2010 > Manufacturing output, measured in each country's local currency adjusted for inflation, has been growing more slowly in the United States than in China, South Korea, Germany, and Mexico " > You do generally have to physically be present to make deals. If you need to be physically present for a meeting, you make a trip. There is absolutely zero benefit to living in close proximity to investors the rest of the time. > It is obviously theoretically possible to run a world-leading software company fully remote. It is obviously not just theoretically possible, and many companies do so. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Manufacturing_in_the_United_States#International_comparison https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Manufacturing_in_the_United_St... [1] https://www.bcg.com/press/21september2023-north-american-companies-have-relocated-production-sourcing-over-past-five-years https://www.bcg.com/press/21september2023-north-american-com...