7 ms·

Being forced into a never ending apartheid situation may also be the reason. Give them voting rights or give them a state, it's pretty simple.

jameshilliard 1y ago
> Being forced into a never ending apartheid situation may also be the reason. An occupation is not apartheid. > Give them voting rights Israel tried that...Palestinians straight up voted for Hamas terrorists[0] who promptly eliminated voting rights(although based on opinion polling Hamas would likely be elected again). > give them a state Israel tried moving towards that in Gaza[1], it backfired spectacularly leading to the current conflict. Any other ideas on how to move towards peaceful coexistence? I think the first step is some sort of de-radicalization program, but not sure how one would implement that. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2006_Palestinian_legislative_election https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2006_Palestinian_legislative_e... [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israeli_disengagement_from_the_Gaza_Strip https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israeli_disengagement_from_the...
- markessien 1y ago
  Israel has said: The Palestinians will never have a state. They have also said - the Palestinians will never vote in Israel. Is this not apartheid?
  - jameshilliard 1y ago
    > Is this not apartheid? Apartheid by definition means race based discrimination, which is different from citizenship based discrimination(which basically all countries have to various degrees).
    - markessien 1y ago
      Anyone in the world who has one race can freely move there. People of other races cannot. Rights are awarded based on race. Nothing to do with citizenship. Apartheid.
      - jameshilliard 1y ago
        > Anyone in the world who has one race can freely move there. People of other races cannot. Rights are awarded based on race. Nothing to do with citizenship. You're obviously referring to a Israeli citizenship law[0] here. Your claim that it has nothing to do with citizenship makes no sense. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Law_of_Return https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Law_of_Return
dotancohen 1y ago
Since the 1990s Israel has been trying to give them a state, to varying degrees. They got civil and security autonomy in Areas A of the West Bank, for example. And Israel pulled her citizens out of the Gaza strip in 2005. The problem is that the PA, who rules the West Bank are extremely corrupt, and Hamas is committed to Israel's destruction. Neither side has been actually performing all the functions of state, UNRWA has been doing that.
- markessien 1y ago
  The PM of Israel has stated: The Palestinians will NEVER have a state. What part of that statement did I misunderstand? Israel's stated policy is this: No State for the Palestinians, no Civil Rights. This is clear.
  - dotancohen 1y ago
    The leaders of Hamas have stated the the Jewish state is to destroyed and the Jewish residents exterminated. The PA leaders have stated that the German genocide of Jews never occurred. And Egyptian, Jordanian, Palestinian, Libyan, and Iraqi leaders have all stated the the idea of a Palestinian People was invented in the 1960s. No joke. If you want to start pulling out quotes to judge merit in the Middle East, there's enough material to hang anybody.
    - markessien 1y ago
      The leaders of Israel have not just spoken about it, they have actually destroyed the Palestinian State in the last few months. They have killed tens of thousands of kids. Should they be deradicalised?
      - dotancohen 1y ago
        [flagged]
        markessien 1y ago

jameshilliard 1y ago

> Being forced into a never ending apartheid situation may also be the reason. An occupation is not apartheid. > Give them voting rights Israel tried that...Palestinians straight up voted for Hamas terrorists[0] who promptly eliminated voting rights(although based on opinion polling Hamas would likely be elected again). > give them a state Israel tried moving towards that in Gaza[1], it backfired spectacularly leading to the current conflict. Any other ideas on how to move towards peaceful coexistence? I think the first step is some sort of de-radicalization program, but not sure how one would implement that. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2006_Palestinian_legislative_election https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2006_Palestinian_legislative_e... [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israeli_disengagement_from_the_Gaza_Strip https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israeli_disengagement_from_the...

markessien 1y ago
Israel has said: The Palestinians will never have a state. They have also said - the Palestinians will never vote in Israel. Is this not apartheid?
- jameshilliard 1y ago
  > Is this not apartheid? Apartheid by definition means race based discrimination, which is different from citizenship based discrimination(which basically all countries have to various degrees).
  - markessien 1y ago
    Anyone in the world who has one race can freely move there. People of other races cannot. Rights are awarded based on race. Nothing to do with citizenship. Apartheid.
    - jameshilliard 1y ago
      > Anyone in the world who has one race can freely move there. People of other races cannot. Rights are awarded based on race. Nothing to do with citizenship. You're obviously referring to a Israeli citizenship law[0] here. Your claim that it has nothing to do with citizenship makes no sense. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Law_of_Return https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Law_of_Return

dotancohen 1y ago

Since the 1990s Israel has been trying to give them a state, to varying degrees. They got civil and security autonomy in Areas A of the West Bank, for example. And Israel pulled her citizens out of the Gaza strip in 2005. The problem is that the PA, who rules the West Bank are extremely corrupt, and Hamas is committed to Israel's destruction. Neither side has been actually performing all the functions of state, UNRWA has been doing that.

markessien 1y ago
The PM of Israel has stated: The Palestinians will NEVER have a state. What part of that statement did I misunderstand? Israel's stated policy is this: No State for the Palestinians, no Civil Rights. This is clear.
- dotancohen 1y ago
  The leaders of Hamas have stated the the Jewish state is to destroyed and the Jewish residents exterminated. The PA leaders have stated that the German genocide of Jews never occurred. And Egyptian, Jordanian, Palestinian, Libyan, and Iraqi leaders have all stated the the idea of a Palestinian People was invented in the 1960s. No joke. If you want to start pulling out quotes to judge merit in the Middle East, there's enough material to hang anybody.
  - markessien 1y ago
    The leaders of Israel have not just spoken about it, they have actually destroyed the Palestinian State in the last few months. They have killed tens of thousands of kids. Should they be deradicalised?
    - dotancohen 1y ago
      [flagged]
      - markessien 1y ago