9 ms·

> In reality, this wouldn’t happen, because, generally, people understand that stabbings are a cultural issue, rather than a technical one Many UK MPs don't un

> In reality, this wouldn’t happen, because, generally, people understand that stabbings are a cultural issue, rather than a technical one Many UK MPs don't understand this. I've heard of MPs making (moronic) suggestions such as selling kitchen knives without the point on it. I've literally seen this advertised as a solution on the news. For whatever reason they don't seem to understand that literally anyone can make a shiv.

fidotron 1y ago
https://www.forbes.com/sites/ianmorris/2019/03/14/yes-a-politician-really-did-suggest-all-knives-should-have-gps-trackers-built-in/ https://www.forbes.com/sites/ianmorris/2019/03/14/yes-a-poli... For anyone doubting the veracity of that.
exasperaited 1y ago
> I've heard of MPs making (moronic) suggestions such as selling kitchen knives without the point on it. I've literally seen this advertised as a solution on the news. As someone who is clumsy and easily distracted, I have such a kitchen knife. They are commonly available. It works absolutely fine and it has three times minimised an injury that would have been nasty because I am an easily-distracted tired old idiot. The point of a knife is only needed in a handful of kitchen applications. Most knives do not need to be able to stab at all. Only cut. And combined with rules on the sales of longer blades that do have a point, this idea could genuinely be part of reducing knife crime (especially among the very youngest). Because it does reduce access to knives that would be useful for stabbing, and it reduces the severity of injuries caused by the youngest in knife crime incidents. Without meaningfully affecting the kitchen usefulness of most small blades at all. If I go to a supermarket and buy a long enough knife with a point on it, in theory I am asked to prove my age (in practice they laugh at the idea that I might not be young enough). The same is true for many (not all) products on Amazon, in fact. The knife without a point on it did not trigger age verification. Nor does a boxcutter type thing, in practice; only retractible blades that don't snap off are on the list, AFAIK. (And only flick-knife-type mechanisms are banned). I anticipate being downvoted for simply writing about this, but harm reduction through knife sales controls is not something that just stupid MPs think: it is supported by expert opinion. Knife crime in the UK is a problem. It is still not a problem as severe per-capita as it is elsewhere, but we are trying measures to dissuade it. Behaviour modification is not always stupid or evil; cultures do it all the time.
- VikingMiner 1y ago
  [flagged]
  - exasperaited 1y ago
    [flagged]
    - VikingMiner 1y ago
      [flagged]
      - exasperaited 1y ago
        I didn't say that at all. You've totally the legal right to use knives in a dangerous way in your home. It's completely compatible with age restrictions on long pointed blades, though, isn't it?
        deleted 1y ago
        [deleted]
    - crtasm 1y ago
      Then what's the proper tool for cutting fruit or veg? I can't think of one.
      - exasperaited 1y ago
        I have a small-ish flat-cut paring knife that has a non-pointed blade. It is very sharp, and even the squared off end is enough to pierce a tomato, say. I can't think of any application where the point of the knive is particularly essential for fruit or veg, and I can think of several veg where using the point of a tool is actually quite likely to cause an accident. Sweet potato being one of them. There is one true application: deboning or filleting. But most people simply don't do this in a kitchen anyway, because they are buying deboned and filleted meat. I don't see a particular problem with asking people who do want to cook to that level to prove they are adults before buying knives that have such obvious dual use as a weapon. Because you're asking people who already know they should be responsible with knives (and not for example use kitchen knives to get into plastic packaging, like an idiot). You really don't need the point of a kitchen knife all that much in a kitchen, and the fact that the counterexamples raised are misuse (stabbing into packaging etc.) is pretty illustrative.
arp242 1y ago
"We believe that paedophiles are using an area of internet the size of Ireland, and through this they can control keyboards." – Syd Rapson MP in 2001. But really, with 650 MPs there's bound to be a few that are a bit silly at least some of the time. You can hear some wild takes at the local pub too (or nextdoor), but that doesn't mean everyone in your area is a moron.
- VikingMiner 1y ago
  I too have watched Brass Eye, and they literally had MPs telling people about the dangers of "cake" in a previous episode. It showed that MPs and TV celebrities would literally say anything Anchorman style if it was put on a teleprompter / script in front of them. They are nothing other than paid actors. While I don't believe everyone in Parliament is a moron. I think more than enough of them are moronic, out of touch, malicious or home combination of the three for it to be a problem. Generally the only solution presented for any issue in the UK is banning something. There is no other course of action that they can envisage. So you end up in a false dichotomy, discussing whether something should be banned or not. There is no discussion why the issue is happening in the first place, only whether <thing> should be banned or not.
  - arp242 1y ago
    Some journalist shows up with a somewhat implausible story and can tell any lie to convince you it's real. I can see how an MP might fall for it, and it's a mistake to think you're somehow above that. We also don't see any of the false positives; did they go "MP shopping" and we only saw the ones that did fall for it?
tzs 1y ago
I would love it if my steak knives did not have a point. Never once have I needed to stab my steak. The only thing I’ve ever stabbed with them is myself by accident.

fidotron 1y ago

https://www.forbes.com/sites/ianmorris/2019/03/14/yes-a-politician-really-did-suggest-all-knives-should-have-gps-trackers-built-in/ https://www.forbes.com/sites/ianmorris/2019/03/14/yes-a-poli... For anyone doubting the veracity of that.

exasperaited 1y ago

> I've heard of MPs making (moronic) suggestions such as selling kitchen knives without the point on it. I've literally seen this advertised as a solution on the news. As someone who is clumsy and easily distracted, I have such a kitchen knife. They are commonly available. It works absolutely fine and it has three times minimised an injury that would have been nasty because I am an easily-distracted tired old idiot. The point of a knife is only needed in a handful of kitchen applications. Most knives do not need to be able to stab at all. Only cut. And combined with rules on the sales of longer blades that do have a point, this idea could genuinely be part of reducing knife crime (especially among the very youngest). Because it does reduce access to knives that would be useful for stabbing, and it reduces the severity of injuries caused by the youngest in knife crime incidents. Without meaningfully affecting the kitchen usefulness of most small blades at all. If I go to a supermarket and buy a long enough knife with a point on it, in theory I am asked to prove my age (in practice they laugh at the idea that I might not be young enough). The same is true for many (not all) products on Amazon, in fact. The knife without a point on it did not trigger age verification. Nor does a boxcutter type thing, in practice; only retractible blades that don't snap off are on the list, AFAIK. (And only flick-knife-type mechanisms are banned). I anticipate being downvoted for simply writing about this, but harm reduction through knife sales controls is not something that just stupid MPs think: it is supported by expert opinion. Knife crime in the UK is a problem. It is still not a problem as severe per-capita as it is elsewhere, but we are trying measures to dissuade it. Behaviour modification is not always stupid or evil; cultures do it all the time.

VikingMiner 1y ago
[flagged]
- exasperaited 1y ago
  [flagged]
  - VikingMiner 1y ago
    [flagged]
    - exasperaited 1y ago
      I didn't say that at all. You've totally the legal right to use knives in a dangerous way in your home. It's completely compatible with age restrictions on long pointed blades, though, isn't it?
      - deleted 1y ago
        [deleted]
  - crtasm 1y ago
    Then what's the proper tool for cutting fruit or veg? I can't think of one.
    - exasperaited 1y ago
      I have a small-ish flat-cut paring knife that has a non-pointed blade. It is very sharp, and even the squared off end is enough to pierce a tomato, say. I can't think of any application where the point of the knive is particularly essential for fruit or veg, and I can think of several veg where using the point of a tool is actually quite likely to cause an accident. Sweet potato being one of them. There is one true application: deboning or filleting. But most people simply don't do this in a kitchen anyway, because they are buying deboned and filleted meat. I don't see a particular problem with asking people who do want to cook to that level to prove they are adults before buying knives that have such obvious dual use as a weapon. Because you're asking people who already know they should be responsible with knives (and not for example use kitchen knives to get into plastic packaging, like an idiot). You really don't need the point of a kitchen knife all that much in a kitchen, and the fact that the counterexamples raised are misuse (stabbing into packaging etc.) is pretty illustrative.

arp242 1y ago

"We believe that paedophiles are using an area of internet the size of Ireland, and through this they can control keyboards." – Syd Rapson MP in 2001. But really, with 650 MPs there's bound to be a few that are a bit silly at least some of the time. You can hear some wild takes at the local pub too (or nextdoor), but that doesn't mean everyone in your area is a moron.

VikingMiner 1y ago
I too have watched Brass Eye, and they literally had MPs telling people about the dangers of "cake" in a previous episode. It showed that MPs and TV celebrities would literally say anything Anchorman style if it was put on a teleprompter / script in front of them. They are nothing other than paid actors. While I don't believe everyone in Parliament is a moron. I think more than enough of them are moronic, out of touch, malicious or home combination of the three for it to be a problem. Generally the only solution presented for any issue in the UK is banning something. There is no other course of action that they can envisage. So you end up in a false dichotomy, discussing whether something should be banned or not. There is no discussion why the issue is happening in the first place, only whether <thing> should be banned or not.
- arp242 1y ago
  Some journalist shows up with a somewhat implausible story and can tell any lie to convince you it's real. I can see how an MP might fall for it, and it's a mistake to think you're somehow above that. We also don't see any of the false positives; did they go "MP shopping" and we only saw the ones that did fall for it?

tzs 1y ago

I would love it if my steak knives did not have a point. Never once have I needed to stab my steak. The only thing I’ve ever stabbed with them is myself by accident.