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Nurses in Spain make 2500-3000 euro a month, in a country where the most common salary is 1250 euro. Are they overworked? Well then they can take a pay cut so w

by nsksl 1y ago

Nurses in Spain make 2500-3000 euro a month, in a country where the most common salary is 1250 euro. Are they overworked? Well then they can take a pay cut so we can hire more of them.

laurencerowe 1y ago
Eurostat average full time salary 2022 for Spain is €31k. 2021 average nurse salary €38k. While mean is not median the stats seem to show much less of a difference than your figures. For comparison in the US median full time wage is $66k while median nurses wages is $86k. Nursing is a skilled occupation requiring a bachelors degree. Seems good they get paid around average wages for graduates. https://ec.europa.eu/eurostat/databrowser/view/nama_10_fte__custom_13597179/bookmark/table?lang=en&bookmarkId=c29eed24-377e-4763-aaf0-0419906d2ecd&c=1730705507900 https://ec.europa.eu/eurostat/databrowser/view/nama_10_fte__... https://www.euronews.com/next/2023/12/14/nurses-salaries-across-europe-which-countries-have-the-highest-and-lowest-wages https://www.euronews.com/next/2023/12/14/nurses-salaries-acr...
- nsksl 1y ago
  Averages as well as you say are useless. You know this, so I don’t know why you bring averages up. I specifically mentioned the most common salary, not the average or the mean, which are completely skewed. You should also research the salaries of other people who also have a “bachelor’s degree” as you call it. That is, if they get employment and don’t have to emigrate.
  - rsynnott 1y ago
    That looks like probably median _income_ (ie would include people on social welfare, pensions, part-time workers). Data seems a bit all over the place, but most estimates of median full-time seem to be around 2000eur/month. Spanish min wage is 1184/month for a full-timer, so it's virtually impossible that median full-time income would be only 75 eur more than that.
spicyusername 1y ago
They can take a pay cut Why is it always a race to the bottom...?
pavel_lishin 1y ago
How many hours do they work, compared to the people making €1250/month?
- nsksl 1y ago
  Fewer, for sure. Not to mention they work for the state so they are guaranteed to have lots of free days by law and their work hours are always respected.
an0malous 1y ago
Same for doctors, we constrain the number of new doctors trained every year to keep their salaries high. Just like constraining the housing supply to keep housing prices high, greed has corrupted these systems from getting better and now we’re just asking people to die instead.
- nradov 1y ago
  Which country are you talking about, and who is "we"? In the USA, Congress constrains the number of new doctors trained every year not to keep salaries high but rather to limit Medicare expenses. If Medicare beneficiaries can't get an appointment due to a doctor shortage then no claim will be submitted to CMS. Most of the funding for residency programs comes from Medicare, and every year there are medical students who graduate with the MD but are unable to practice medicine because they don't get matched to a residency program. At one point the AMA did lobby Congress to limit the number of doctors but they reversed their position on that issue long ago. https://savegme.org/ https://savegme.org/
  - magicalhippo 1y ago
    At least here in Norway, the doctor associations fights hard against any talk about reducing the ridiculously long shifts that nets the doctors large paychecks. They'd much rather have 1-2 doctors do the work of 3-4, so they can cash in. Though there is a change of guard happening. Younger people, including doctors, value work-life balance much more and are less inclined to work long hours for more cash.
  - esbranson 1y ago
    The US is a federal system, and the states run healthcare and academia. If Congress can tax a state X amount of dollars, that state is obviously able to do so also. New York accounts for nearly half of all state Medicaid GME funding nationally, with NY state Medicaid GME alone reaching ~$1.8 billion of the $4.4 billion total GME spending in NY in 2012 (federal + state + private).[1] And is New York better off? Do these claims about GME hold up there? Don't blame AMA or Congress, blame your dominant state political party. Congress should probably require matching for GME which would completely cut off funding for most states. We can already read the headlines. If you actually knew about this before I mentioned it please let me know, but I think you likely didn't, even though you've obviously spent time researching this important topic. I am actually more irritated how little "people in the know" actually know. It's why I despise outlets like NPR who spread propaganda (agitprop mostly) and refuse to report relevant info and the damage it has caused to America's intelligentsia. Defund NPR and friends, they are the root cause of this mess. [1] https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/books/NBK248024/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/books/NBK248024/

by nsksl 1y ago

Nurses in Spain make 2500-3000 euro a month, in a country where the most common salary is 1250 euro. Are they overworked? Well then they can take a pay cut so we can hire more of them.

laurencerowe 1y ago

Eurostat average full time salary 2022 for Spain is €31k. 2021 average nurse salary €38k. While mean is not median the stats seem to show much less of a difference than your figures. For comparison in the US median full time wage is $66k while median nurses wages is $86k. Nursing is a skilled occupation requiring a bachelors degree. Seems good they get paid around average wages for graduates. https://ec.europa.eu/eurostat/databrowser/view/nama_10_fte__custom_13597179/bookmark/table?lang=en&bookmarkId=c29eed24-377e-4763-aaf0-0419906d2ecd&c=1730705507900 https://ec.europa.eu/eurostat/databrowser/view/nama_10_fte__... https://www.euronews.com/next/2023/12/14/nurses-salaries-across-europe-which-countries-have-the-highest-and-lowest-wages https://www.euronews.com/next/2023/12/14/nurses-salaries-acr...

nsksl 1y ago
Averages as well as you say are useless. You know this, so I don’t know why you bring averages up. I specifically mentioned the most common salary, not the average or the mean, which are completely skewed. You should also research the salaries of other people who also have a “bachelor’s degree” as you call it. That is, if they get employment and don’t have to emigrate.
- rsynnott 1y ago
  That looks like probably median _income_ (ie would include people on social welfare, pensions, part-time workers). Data seems a bit all over the place, but most estimates of median full-time seem to be around 2000eur/month. Spanish min wage is 1184/month for a full-timer, so it's virtually impossible that median full-time income would be only 75 eur more than that.

spicyusername 1y ago

They can take a pay cut Why is it always a race to the bottom...?

pavel_lishin 1y ago

How many hours do they work, compared to the people making €1250/month?

nsksl 1y ago
Fewer, for sure. Not to mention they work for the state so they are guaranteed to have lots of free days by law and their work hours are always respected.

an0malous 1y ago

Same for doctors, we constrain the number of new doctors trained every year to keep their salaries high. Just like constraining the housing supply to keep housing prices high, greed has corrupted these systems from getting better and now we’re just asking people to die instead.

nradov 1y ago
Which country are you talking about, and who is "we"? In the USA, Congress constrains the number of new doctors trained every year not to keep salaries high but rather to limit Medicare expenses. If Medicare beneficiaries can't get an appointment due to a doctor shortage then no claim will be submitted to CMS. Most of the funding for residency programs comes from Medicare, and every year there are medical students who graduate with the MD but are unable to practice medicine because they don't get matched to a residency program. At one point the AMA did lobby Congress to limit the number of doctors but they reversed their position on that issue long ago. https://savegme.org/ https://savegme.org/
- magicalhippo 1y ago
  At least here in Norway, the doctor associations fights hard against any talk about reducing the ridiculously long shifts that nets the doctors large paychecks. They'd much rather have 1-2 doctors do the work of 3-4, so they can cash in. Though there is a change of guard happening. Younger people, including doctors, value work-life balance much more and are less inclined to work long hours for more cash.
- esbranson 1y ago
  The US is a federal system, and the states run healthcare and academia. If Congress can tax a state X amount of dollars, that state is obviously able to do so also. New York accounts for nearly half of all state Medicaid GME funding nationally, with NY state Medicaid GME alone reaching ~$1.8 billion of the $4.4 billion total GME spending in NY in 2012 (federal + state + private).[1] And is New York better off? Do these claims about GME hold up there? Don't blame AMA or Congress, blame your dominant state political party. Congress should probably require matching for GME which would completely cut off funding for most states. We can already read the headlines. If you actually knew about this before I mentioned it please let me know, but I think you likely didn't, even though you've obviously spent time researching this important topic. I am actually more irritated how little "people in the know" actually know. It's why I despise outlets like NPR who spread propaganda (agitprop mostly) and refuse to report relevant info and the damage it has caused to America's intelligentsia. Defund NPR and friends, they are the root cause of this mess. [1] https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/books/NBK248024/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/books/NBK248024/