7 ms·

India Launches Beta Version of Its Data Site

125 points by vikram360 14y ago

BigEndian101 14y ago
Its
- thunderrabbit 14y ago
  Cannot an admin fix the grammar mistake here? http://how-to-spell-its.com/ http://how-to-spell-its.com/
SingAlong 14y ago
For anyone's brain food - the app is opensource and the sourcecode is available at https://github.com/opengovplatform/opengovplatform/ https://github.com/opengovplatform/opengovplatform/ [EDIT:] It looks like it was developed on Drupal - (https://github.com/opengovplatform/opengovplatform/blob/master/ogpl/webapp/core/INSTALL.txt https://github.com/opengovplatform/opengovplatform/blob/mast...) According to info, this is a Govt of US-India collaboration. [EDIT-2:] I hope their data dump is not from the production servers (https://github.com/opengovplatform/opengovplatform/blob/668b73f4e8d7835cc4b9f79a057e4483dc5dd6e3/ogpl/db/dbdump.zip https://github.com/opengovplatform/opengovplatform/blob/668b...) Because I found this on grepping - https://gist.github.com/3608089 https://gist.github.com/3608089
Zirro 14y ago
I don't think I've ever seen so many separate JavaScript and CSS-files used on a page before. Surely most, if not all, could be reduced into one?
- weego 14y ago
  It's rarely beneficial to compress to one single file, but I completely agree that the way they are doing it it very inefficient, especially spamming the @import notation.
  - raganesh 14y ago
    Not sure what you mean by "rarely beneficial to compress to one single file". But in multiple situations I have seen significant web load performance improvements when the number of discrete files being loaded is reduced - merge all JS into one file, all CSS into another and sprite images. This is due to HTTP 2-connection rule.
    - SquareWheel 14y ago
      And slow-start certainly contributes.
- ericgsmith 14y ago
  Drupal 7 does this out of the box, with an option to aggregate and compress JS and CSS. I have not developed on Drupal 6 but would be incredibly surprised if there wasn't at least a community developed module to do this.
  - gingerjoos 14y ago
    If I remember correctly this has been available out of the box at least since Drupal 5 up. Have worked on Drupal 5 and 6, don't remember using any custom module to do aggregation.
- aasarava 14y ago
  In Drupal any module can inject its own separate stylesheet into the page. It's standard practice to enable Drupal's CSS (and javascript) compression feature once you move the site to production. That they haven't done it suggests the developers aren't very familiar with Drupal, or easily overlook details.
arocks 14y ago
For some reason the link to 'Dataset' doesn't work for me. However, this link works: http://data.gov.in/search/apachesolr_search/?filters=type%3Adataset http://data.gov.in/search/apachesolr_search/?filters=type%3A...
rkk 14y ago
Brave move to open source the project - and handy, as it seems they could use some friendly advice on Drupal security and best practices, e.g. https://github.com/opengovplatform/opengovplatform/blob/master/ogpl/webapp/core/superadmin.php https://github.com/opengovplatform/opengovplatform/blob/mast... vs. http://ogpl.gov.in/superadmin.php http://ogpl.gov.in/superadmin.php ;)
sandGorgon 14y ago
For those who are interested, there are a bunch of us discussing open Govt. datasets (for India) at the DataMeet Google Group - https://groups.google.com/forum/?fromgroups=#!forum/datameet https://groups.google.com/forum/?fromgroups=#!forum/datameet
monsterix 14y ago
It is a very encouraging step from GoI, looking at the recent slur about rampant corruption in India [http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=4447605 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=4447605]. That said, I do feel that the task of opening the Government doesn't end at launching a portal (yet another CMS) or giving out yet another data-set. Looking at how much impact these platforms have induced even in developed nations there seems little incentive [some advantage definitely] to pursue such an initiative in a country like India. Millions die of basic malnutrition there, and perhaps their focus should be to make food available to consume, rather than data. Of course the data will help but aren't we missing the big picture? It is relevant to note that incentive for active development on Gov data-sets like these (believed to improve the existing establishment) is probably not as attractive an idea as it is to disrupt the legacy itself. That's how the relationship has been between the establishment and disruptive thinkers for centuries. I mean all this seems like a complicated play of a ton of variables - democracy, education, impact, profit, consumption, need etc. Yet no doubt the launch is certainly a positive one from the largest democracy in the world.
- sandGorgon 14y ago
  Also, it is relevant to note that incentive for active development on Gov data-sets like these (believed to improve the existing establishment) is probably not as attractive an idea as it is to disrupt the legacy. That's how the relationship has been for centuries. Actually, it is part of the GoI's "Data Sharing and Accessibility Policy" that was made law. http://www.india.gov.in/allimpfrms/alldocs/16473.pdf http://www.india.gov.in/allimpfrms/alldocs/16473.pdf Looking at how much impact these platforms have induced even in developed nations there seems little advantage [some advantage definitely] of pursuing such an initiative in a country like India. Millions die of basic malnutrition there and perhaps the focus should be to make food available to consume, rather than data. That is an extremely uninformed statement - one of the biggest challenges for efficiency in governance is accountability. Think of the govt. as a large legacy codebase, with the QA being done only by the parliamentarians/senators. Release of data allows QA by the ordinary citizens. India has a judicial process called Public Interest Litigation [1]. Combined with public datasets, it makes for powerful governance. [1] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Public-interest_litigation_%28India%29 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Public-interest_litigation_%28I...
SudarshanP 14y ago
From: http://ogpl.gov.in/about_us http://ogpl.gov.in/about_us Open Government Platform (OGPL) is being developed by nodal agencies from both the countries (National Informatics Centre, Department of Electronics & IT, Government of India and Office of Citizen Services & Innovative Technologies, General Services Administration, U.S. Government). To know more about the participating organizations visit following links National Informatics Centre (http://www.nic.in http://www.nic.in) General Services Administration (http://data.gov http://data.gov)
scorpion032 14y ago
One of the core values of any government should be to make available all of it's data freely to all citizens available via API. Everything being publicly auctioned and the free data available publicly will stop many of the scams of the nature India is going through right now. I am not sure if any one would, but if someone comes up with a bill that holds the powers-that-be responsible under the "Duty to Report" bill, I would support them.
- pierrend 14y ago
  > "make available all of it's data freely" Not "all" the data. Many datasets should not be shared. Good reasons include: a)security reasons b)ecology reasons (don't say where endangered species are) c)personal data d) current trial
  - lignuist 14y ago
    IMO the rule should be: release everything unless there are strong arguments, to not release specific data sets. These arguments should be transparent and publicly discussed. Just saying "it affects public security" is not a strong argument. It should be at least said, why exactly it affects the security. However, there are good reasons, to not publish some data sets.
  - easternmonk 14y ago
    India currently has the so called "right to information" bill. That Bill outlines what information can be withheld. Now using the same bill government should ideally come up with "Duty to report" bill.
  - harigov 14y ago
    Make all the information accessible but restrict access based on User privileges. If some piece of information like endangered species location is to be known, user must identify himself/herself and then proceed to use the data. Anything happens to the endangered species, you know who all got access to that information. Similarly for other data.
- lutusp 14y ago
hiltro 14y ago
Why is it that contires such as india seems to be behind in the way of website design, the design is just too busy for me and the styles/colours remind me of early 2000 sites.
- pooriaazimi 14y ago
  I really think that's a gross generalization of a billion (and change[1]) people! [1]: The "change" is about 77% of U.S. population.
- nmridul 14y ago
  Most of the government IT projects won't have any designers (or professional designers) unless they are related to designs as such. The designs are mostly created by the programmers over there and most of the times it will be to the liking of the bureaucracy or who ever is in charge there. Appearance is last priority.
- manojlds 14y ago
  Have you looked at sites by computer scientists? Like some of the Microsoft Research related sites? They serve the purpose. Don't expect them to be pleasant on your eyes.
  - w1ntermute 14y ago
    How about comparing apples to apples? Take a look at the equivalent US site[0]. It's pretty obvious the Indian equivalent blatantly ripped off the design - same sort of bar at the top, then a header with a logo, then a horizontal set of links to diferent places on the site, then a set of rotating images, then links with in-depth info in 3 columns. Some of the UI differences include the addition of scrolling text and a crappier color scheme. 0: http://www.data.gov/ http://www.data.gov/
    - manojlds 14y ago
      Did you miss the point that this is a India-US collaboration.
jrockway 14y ago
"Its", not "it's", is the possessive form of "it". The current headline reads "India launches beta version of it is data site."
- StavrosK 14y ago
  This bugs me too, can someone please change it?
tshadwell 14y ago
Oh gods, the source code please no please kill it. 20+imports in css, 20+ script tags please no
berito 14y ago
Notice the use of the phrase "allopathic hospitals" in a database of number of beds available! It always cracks me up how modern medicine is referred to as just another form of medicine, like Ayurvedic or homeopathic. The Indian government is clearly of the opinion that forms of quackery that are homeopathy and Ayurveda actually work and are worthy of tax payer money.
- shiven 14y ago
  Please qualify your claims with sources and/or evidence. I agree with your statement regarding Homeopathy being quackery, but I see no reason to paint Ayurvedic Medicine with the same brush. Unless, of course, our definitions of Ayurveda differ on a fundamental level.
  - berito 14y ago
    The burden of proof is on you if you are making the outrageous claim that ayurveda works.
- w1ntermute 14y ago
  In India, you can even get a degree in the field: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bachelor_of_Ayurveda,_Medicine_and_Surgery http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bachelor_of_Ayurveda,_Medicine_... It's pretty crazy that this sort of crap still gets attention in this day and age.
  - pullo 14y ago
    Having known people who benefitted from ayurvedic treatment, I tell you that the regimen (medication and food restrictions- you are not assigned one without the other) is one of the toughest I have seen. the people who successfully get through it, swear by ayurvedic medicine. I have been to some of the facilities and met the doctors and they are above average ( by Indian standards). This is why, this mode of treatment in still popular among many in india. needless to say many treatment centers are based in cities and visited by what you might call a more educated and worldly crowd (I mean no offense here, but could not find a better way to say it :) I am willing to forgo my personal observation as an one off, but please qualify your comment.
webwanderings 14y ago
What's up with the dark color scheme?
zwass 14y ago
Am I the only one who finds it strange there are no buttons to change to languages other than English (or if there are, they weren't obvious enough for me to find)?
fareesh 14y ago
This site is absolute trash, pretty much like anything else the NIC creates. I've tried to register using a dozen possible methods and there are all sorts of errors. Seriously, how hard is it to allow someone to create an account, beta or no beta? They have this ridiculous list of ways to sign up including Foursquare and PayPal and almost none of them work. Yes Paypal, really.
- fareesh 14y ago
  So after about 20 attempts I now have an account, but if I try to download a data set, it takes me to my profile page.
aasarava 14y ago
Has anyone tried to actually download a data set? It seems you have to register first. Is there any good reason why an open government initiative would need to require registration to access the actual data?

125 points by vikram360 14y ago

BigEndian101 14y ago

Its

thunderrabbit 14y ago
Cannot an admin fix the grammar mistake here? http://how-to-spell-its.com/ http://how-to-spell-its.com/

SingAlong 14y ago

For anyone's brain food - the app is opensource and the sourcecode is available at https://github.com/opengovplatform/opengovplatform/ https://github.com/opengovplatform/opengovplatform/ [EDIT:] It looks like it was developed on Drupal - (https://github.com/opengovplatform/opengovplatform/blob/master/ogpl/webapp/core/INSTALL.txt https://github.com/opengovplatform/opengovplatform/blob/mast...) According to info, this is a Govt of US-India collaboration. [EDIT-2:] I hope their data dump is not from the production servers (https://github.com/opengovplatform/opengovplatform/blob/668b73f4e8d7835cc4b9f79a057e4483dc5dd6e3/ogpl/db/dbdump.zip https://github.com/opengovplatform/opengovplatform/blob/668b...) Because I found this on grepping - https://gist.github.com/3608089 https://gist.github.com/3608089

Zirro 14y ago

I don't think I've ever seen so many separate JavaScript and CSS-files used on a page before. Surely most, if not all, could be reduced into one?

weego 14y ago
It's rarely beneficial to compress to one single file, but I completely agree that the way they are doing it it very inefficient, especially spamming the @import notation.
- raganesh 14y ago
  Not sure what you mean by "rarely beneficial to compress to one single file". But in multiple situations I have seen significant web load performance improvements when the number of discrete files being loaded is reduced - merge all JS into one file, all CSS into another and sprite images. This is due to HTTP 2-connection rule.
  - SquareWheel 14y ago
    And slow-start certainly contributes.
ericgsmith 14y ago
Drupal 7 does this out of the box, with an option to aggregate and compress JS and CSS. I have not developed on Drupal 6 but would be incredibly surprised if there wasn't at least a community developed module to do this.
- gingerjoos 14y ago
  If I remember correctly this has been available out of the box at least since Drupal 5 up. Have worked on Drupal 5 and 6, don't remember using any custom module to do aggregation.
aasarava 14y ago
In Drupal any module can inject its own separate stylesheet into the page. It's standard practice to enable Drupal's CSS (and javascript) compression feature once you move the site to production. That they haven't done it suggests the developers aren't very familiar with Drupal, or easily overlook details.

arocks 14y ago

For some reason the link to 'Dataset' doesn't work for me. However, this link works: http://data.gov.in/search/apachesolr_search/?filters=type%3Adataset http://data.gov.in/search/apachesolr_search/?filters=type%3A...

rkk 14y ago

Brave move to open source the project - and handy, as it seems they could use some friendly advice on Drupal security and best practices, e.g. https://github.com/opengovplatform/opengovplatform/blob/master/ogpl/webapp/core/superadmin.php https://github.com/opengovplatform/opengovplatform/blob/mast... vs. http://ogpl.gov.in/superadmin.php http://ogpl.gov.in/superadmin.php ;)

sandGorgon 14y ago

For those who are interested, there are a bunch of us discussing open Govt. datasets (for India) at the DataMeet Google Group - https://groups.google.com/forum/?fromgroups=#!forum/datameet https://groups.google.com/forum/?fromgroups=#!forum/datameet

monsterix 14y ago

It is a very encouraging step from GoI, looking at the recent slur about rampant corruption in India [http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=4447605 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=4447605]. That said, I do feel that the task of opening the Government doesn't end at launching a portal (yet another CMS) or giving out yet another data-set. Looking at how much impact these platforms have induced even in developed nations there seems little incentive [some advantage definitely] to pursue such an initiative in a country like India. Millions die of basic malnutrition there, and perhaps their focus should be to make food available to consume, rather than data. Of course the data will help but aren't we missing the big picture? It is relevant to note that incentive for active development on Gov data-sets like these (believed to improve the existing establishment) is probably not as attractive an idea as it is to disrupt the legacy itself. That's how the relationship has been between the establishment and disruptive thinkers for centuries. I mean all this seems like a complicated play of a ton of variables - democracy, education, impact, profit, consumption, need etc. Yet no doubt the launch is certainly a positive one from the largest democracy in the world.

sandGorgon 14y ago
Also, it is relevant to note that incentive for active development on Gov data-sets like these (believed to improve the existing establishment) is probably not as attractive an idea as it is to disrupt the legacy. That's how the relationship has been for centuries. Actually, it is part of the GoI's "Data Sharing and Accessibility Policy" that was made law. http://www.india.gov.in/allimpfrms/alldocs/16473.pdf http://www.india.gov.in/allimpfrms/alldocs/16473.pdf Looking at how much impact these platforms have induced even in developed nations there seems little advantage [some advantage definitely] of pursuing such an initiative in a country like India. Millions die of basic malnutrition there and perhaps the focus should be to make food available to consume, rather than data. That is an extremely uninformed statement - one of the biggest challenges for efficiency in governance is accountability. Think of the govt. as a large legacy codebase, with the QA being done only by the parliamentarians/senators. Release of data allows QA by the ordinary citizens. India has a judicial process called Public Interest Litigation [1]. Combined with public datasets, it makes for powerful governance. [1] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Public-interest_litigation_%28India%29 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Public-interest_litigation_%28I...

SudarshanP 14y ago

From: http://ogpl.gov.in/about_us http://ogpl.gov.in/about_us Open Government Platform (OGPL) is being developed by nodal agencies from both the countries (National Informatics Centre, Department of Electronics & IT, Government of India and Office of Citizen Services & Innovative Technologies, General Services Administration, U.S. Government). To know more about the participating organizations visit following links National Informatics Centre (http://www.nic.in http://www.nic.in) General Services Administration (http://data.gov http://data.gov)

scorpion032 14y ago

One of the core values of any government should be to make available all of it's data freely to all citizens available via API. Everything being publicly auctioned and the free data available publicly will stop many of the scams of the nature India is going through right now. I am not sure if any one would, but if someone comes up with a bill that holds the powers-that-be responsible under the "Duty to Report" bill, I would support them.

pierrend 14y ago
> "make available all of it's data freely" Not "all" the data. Many datasets should not be shared. Good reasons include: a)security reasons b)ecology reasons (don't say where endangered species are) c)personal data d) current trial
- lignuist 14y ago
  IMO the rule should be: release everything unless there are strong arguments, to not release specific data sets. These arguments should be transparent and publicly discussed. Just saying "it affects public security" is not a strong argument. It should be at least said, why exactly it affects the security. However, there are good reasons, to not publish some data sets.
- easternmonk 14y ago
  India currently has the so called "right to information" bill. That Bill outlines what information can be withheld. Now using the same bill government should ideally come up with "Duty to report" bill.
- harigov 14y ago
  Make all the information accessible but restrict access based on User privileges. If some piece of information like endangered species location is to be known, user must identify himself/herself and then proceed to use the data. Anything happens to the endangered species, you know who all got access to that information. Similarly for other data.
lutusp 14y ago

hiltro 14y ago

Why is it that contires such as india seems to be behind in the way of website design, the design is just too busy for me and the styles/colours remind me of early 2000 sites.

pooriaazimi 14y ago
I really think that's a gross generalization of a billion (and change[1]) people! [1]: The "change" is about 77% of U.S. population.
nmridul 14y ago
Most of the government IT projects won't have any designers (or professional designers) unless they are related to designs as such. The designs are mostly created by the programmers over there and most of the times it will be to the liking of the bureaucracy or who ever is in charge there. Appearance is last priority.
manojlds 14y ago
Have you looked at sites by computer scientists? Like some of the Microsoft Research related sites? They serve the purpose. Don't expect them to be pleasant on your eyes.
- w1ntermute 14y ago
  How about comparing apples to apples? Take a look at the equivalent US site[0]. It's pretty obvious the Indian equivalent blatantly ripped off the design - same sort of bar at the top, then a header with a logo, then a horizontal set of links to diferent places on the site, then a set of rotating images, then links with in-depth info in 3 columns. Some of the UI differences include the addition of scrolling text and a crappier color scheme. 0: http://www.data.gov/ http://www.data.gov/
  - manojlds 14y ago
    Did you miss the point that this is a India-US collaboration.

jrockway 14y ago

"Its", not "it's", is the possessive form of "it". The current headline reads "India launches beta version of it is data site."

StavrosK 14y ago
This bugs me too, can someone please change it?

tshadwell 14y ago

Oh gods, the source code please no please kill it. 20+imports in css, 20+ script tags please no

berito 14y ago

Notice the use of the phrase "allopathic hospitals" in a database of number of beds available! It always cracks me up how modern medicine is referred to as just another form of medicine, like Ayurvedic or homeopathic. The Indian government is clearly of the opinion that forms of quackery that are homeopathy and Ayurveda actually work and are worthy of tax payer money.

shiven 14y ago
Please qualify your claims with sources and/or evidence. I agree with your statement regarding Homeopathy being quackery, but I see no reason to paint Ayurvedic Medicine with the same brush. Unless, of course, our definitions of Ayurveda differ on a fundamental level.
- berito 14y ago
  The burden of proof is on you if you are making the outrageous claim that ayurveda works.
w1ntermute 14y ago
In India, you can even get a degree in the field: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bachelor_of_Ayurveda,_Medicine_and_Surgery http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bachelor_of_Ayurveda,_Medicine_... It's pretty crazy that this sort of crap still gets attention in this day and age.
- pullo 14y ago
  Having known people who benefitted from ayurvedic treatment, I tell you that the regimen (medication and food restrictions- you are not assigned one without the other) is one of the toughest I have seen. the people who successfully get through it, swear by ayurvedic medicine. I have been to some of the facilities and met the doctors and they are above average ( by Indian standards). This is why, this mode of treatment in still popular among many in india. needless to say many treatment centers are based in cities and visited by what you might call a more educated and worldly crowd (I mean no offense here, but could not find a better way to say it :) I am willing to forgo my personal observation as an one off, but please qualify your comment.

webwanderings 14y ago

What's up with the dark color scheme?

zwass 14y ago

Am I the only one who finds it strange there are no buttons to change to languages other than English (or if there are, they weren't obvious enough for me to find)?

fareesh 14y ago

This site is absolute trash, pretty much like anything else the NIC creates. I've tried to register using a dozen possible methods and there are all sorts of errors. Seriously, how hard is it to allow someone to create an account, beta or no beta? They have this ridiculous list of ways to sign up including Foursquare and PayPal and almost none of them work. Yes Paypal, really.

fareesh 14y ago
So after about 20 attempts I now have an account, but if I try to download a data set, it takes me to my profile page.

aasarava 14y ago

Has anyone tried to actually download a data set? It seems you have to register first. Is there any good reason why an open government initiative would need to require registration to access the actual data?