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Interesting point! One interpretation of this passage suggests Peter is actually rushing this appointment. In typical Peter fashion, he makes choices before ful

by pruetj 1y ago

Interesting point! One interpretation of this passage suggests Peter is actually rushing this appointment. In typical Peter fashion, he makes choices before fulling thinking them through (this seems to change post Pentecost). Matthias is never mentioned again in the Bible; we aren't sure what becomes of him. Canonically, he is the 12th but traditionally, it is Paul who is sometimes considered the true 12th disciple (you can find this depicted in EO iconography). So, the random selection mentioned here may have actually been a fault of Peter's and not something the Bible is endorsing as a means to choose leadership; possibly quite the opposite in this case.

biomcgary 1y ago
That's an interesting interpretation but a quick search didn't turn up the first version of that until 1861, so it seem rather late to have influenced EO iconography. Perhaps you are familiar with earlier examples of that interpretation? Impetuous or not, Peter was likely influenced by the many decisions made by lots in the Hebrew Scriptures. e.g., picking a scapegoat (Leviticus 16:7-10), assigning priestly duties (1 Chronicles 24), dividing land (1 Chronicles 6:54), etc. Furthermore, Proverbs 16:33 & 18:18 indicates the outcome of lots is from God and reduces conflict. Anyway, ascribing random processes to the divine for decision making, particularly political situations seems to have strong textual support within the Judeo-Christian tradition. I'm curious about parallels in Islam and other offshoots.
- aspenmayer 1y ago
  Don’t forget the Roman soldiers at the crucifixion who cast lots to see who would get Jesus’s seamless robe. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seamless_robe_of_Jesus https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seamless_robe_of_Jesus
- pruetj 1y ago
  Honestly, going off of something I heard Fr. Stephen De Young mention in one of his podcasts. If I remember right, he says when you see the 12 in certain icons, Paul is often present instead of Matthias. He did not speak of casting lots as being something never endorsed in the Bible, more just for this particular passage, it might not be the takeaway Luke is aiming for. Agree with all your points on 'chance' often being used in scripture.
bluGill 1y ago
You see paul because paul was a great letter writter and Luke followed Paul for some years (likely converted in Pauls misson). however read between the lines and Paul was rarely in the consoles. Even Peter doesn't seem to have been a leader - the sent him away to some visibal missons not kept him with the leaders.

by pruetj 1y ago

biomcgary 1y ago

That's an interesting interpretation but a quick search didn't turn up the first version of that until 1861, so it seem rather late to have influenced EO iconography. Perhaps you are familiar with earlier examples of that interpretation? Impetuous or not, Peter was likely influenced by the many decisions made by lots in the Hebrew Scriptures. e.g., picking a scapegoat (Leviticus 16:7-10), assigning priestly duties (1 Chronicles 24), dividing land (1 Chronicles 6:54), etc. Furthermore, Proverbs 16:33 & 18:18 indicates the outcome of lots is from God and reduces conflict. Anyway, ascribing random processes to the divine for decision making, particularly political situations seems to have strong textual support within the Judeo-Christian tradition. I'm curious about parallels in Islam and other offshoots.

aspenmayer 1y ago
Don’t forget the Roman soldiers at the crucifixion who cast lots to see who would get Jesus’s seamless robe. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seamless_robe_of_Jesus https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seamless_robe_of_Jesus
pruetj 1y ago
Honestly, going off of something I heard Fr. Stephen De Young mention in one of his podcasts. If I remember right, he says when you see the 12 in certain icons, Paul is often present instead of Matthias. He did not speak of casting lots as being something never endorsed in the Bible, more just for this particular passage, it might not be the takeaway Luke is aiming for. Agree with all your points on 'chance' often being used in scripture.

bluGill 1y ago

You see paul because paul was a great letter writter and Luke followed Paul for some years (likely converted in Pauls misson). however read between the lines and Paul was rarely in the consoles. Even Peter doesn't seem to have been a leader - the sent him away to some visibal missons not kept him with the leaders.