6 ms·

Maybe, maybe that's FUD...I can't predict the future.

righthand 1y ago
You can’t predict the future or are choosing to ignore the future? Are you pretending that automation doesn’t take away human jobs?
- sokoloff 1y ago
  When automation took away millions of farming jobs, I think that was good for society and virtually every individual in it.
  - jampekka 1y ago
    In aggregate it was good for society, but it was a disaster for a lot of people and a lot of areas. This is the theme of e.g. The Grapes of Wrath. We should welcome automation and efficiency, but also address the situation of the "losers" of the development and not just expect the invisible hand will sort everything out.
  - micromacrofoot 1y ago
    when offshoring took millions of factory jobs it was a lot less clear automation was good for farming, but the consolidation into corporate megafarms probably not so much I would argue that automating labor isn't bad, but it's being used to take labor away without a solution
  - righthand 1y ago
    Can you elaborate why having a less diverse farming economy is good for every individual? Automation didn’t invent commodities so it’s unrelated to the advent of a food surplus. It might make obtaining surplus easier but it didn’t give more purpose to people by forcing them to sell their land to a bigger corporation. Even if 50% of farmers don’t want to be farmers anymore doesn’t mean they’d gladly give up their job for a recliner and ubi.
    - sokoloff 1y ago
      When 80% of Americans were in farming, it's fair to say that it took around 80% of labor to feed America. If I try to approximate the same today, the median US family can be fed for something around 1/10th of their labor. That seems like a fantastic improvement, unless you really, really like farming.
micromacrofoot 1y ago
Yeah but if you look to the present... there aren't really any jobs where someone is blissfully wandering the earth delegating tasks. Most of the time I can't even take a walk on calls because someone wants to screen share something with me... I'd like you to be right, but I live in society where joy at work is often considered antithetical to productivity. No matter how much more productive I get, that space is used to fill in more productivity. We'll need more than tooling to stop this.

You can’t predict the future or are choosing to ignore the future? Are you pretending that automation doesn’t take away human jobs?

sokoloff 1y ago
When automation took away millions of farming jobs, I think that was good for society and virtually every individual in it.
- jampekka 1y ago
  In aggregate it was good for society, but it was a disaster for a lot of people and a lot of areas. This is the theme of e.g. The Grapes of Wrath. We should welcome automation and efficiency, but also address the situation of the "losers" of the development and not just expect the invisible hand will sort everything out.
- micromacrofoot 1y ago
  when offshoring took millions of factory jobs it was a lot less clear automation was good for farming, but the consolidation into corporate megafarms probably not so much I would argue that automating labor isn't bad, but it's being used to take labor away without a solution
- righthand 1y ago
  Can you elaborate why having a less diverse farming economy is good for every individual? Automation didn’t invent commodities so it’s unrelated to the advent of a food surplus. It might make obtaining surplus easier but it didn’t give more purpose to people by forcing them to sell their land to a bigger corporation. Even if 50% of farmers don’t want to be farmers anymore doesn’t mean they’d gladly give up their job for a recliner and ubi.
  - sokoloff 1y ago
    When 80% of Americans were in farming, it's fair to say that it took around 80% of labor to feed America. If I try to approximate the same today, the median US family can be fed for something around 1/10th of their labor. That seems like a fantastic improvement, unless you really, really like farming.

micromacrofoot 1y ago

Yeah but if you look to the present... there aren't really any jobs where someone is blissfully wandering the earth delegating tasks. Most of the time I can't even take a walk on calls because someone wants to screen share something with me... I'd like you to be right, but I live in society where joy at work is often considered antithetical to productivity. No matter how much more productive I get, that space is used to fill in more productivity. We'll need more than tooling to stop this.