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I think Nix has a marketing issue as it goes so deep. But if you're going to consider it only as an alternative to homebrew, you don't have to know anything asi

I think Nix has a marketing issue as it goes so deep. But if you're going to consider it only as an alternative to homebrew, you don't have to know anything aside from different CLI invocations: `nix-shell -iA <package>` to install, and maybe a step up with `nix-shell -p <package> --run <cmd>` to run without installing. You don't have to use nix-darwin or managing configs and the Nix language at all.

cosmic_cheese 1y ago
That’s still more to remember than `x install y`, which might sound trivial but that’s the exact kind of friction that impedes adoption. Maybe it would make sense for nix to add a mode that basically aliases that first command to `nix install <package>`.
- drcongo 1y ago
  That's essentially what Devbox does for you as a package manager, a hand wrapper around nix for using nix just for its package ecosystem.
  - lambdaba 1y ago
    Oh yeah, I knew about devbox but hadn't seen (perhaps it's new) that it can handle global packages: https://www.jetify.com/docs/devbox/devbox_global/ https://www.jetify.com/docs/devbox/devbox_global/
- lambdaba 1y ago
  Yeah, I'm just addressing you specifically, you could switch easily and Nix has a much larger package selection (outside of GUI apps on macOS). And it immediately can do more via nix-shell -p, which can be also be used as shebang. But yeah, Nix is much more than a homebrew replacement and that has its downsides.
  - verdverm 1y ago
    Nix may have a larger selection, but I sampled a few of the projects I install from homebrew and... 1. Did't actually exist 2. Outdated version 3. Incorrect build I'll keep the quality of Homebrew packages over the quantity in Nix
    - lambdaba 1y ago
      I'm curious of what the packages are because I only have ~10 packages that I use from homebrew, either very Mac-specific or that have better packaging (ffmpeg, mpv)
      - spacedcowboy 1y ago
        Not going to list them all, but... @M4MBP ~ % brew list | wc -l 149
        troupo 1y ago
        Some/many of those are likely to be dependencies. For example, it shows openssl@1.1 and openssl@3 on my machine
        mbirth 1y ago
        `brew leaves` will show manually installed packages.
        spacedcowboy 1y ago
        Right, but I don't think that's the issue. If the complaint is that other systems are less up-to-date than brew is, then the number of things installed is still the issue - whether they're dependencies or not. Unless, of course, the other system manages dependencies differently, say it compiles in static versions of required libraries at build-time, or divides them up into fewer dependent packages.
      - verdverm 1y ago
norman784 1y ago
I tried nix a few times in the past and it has too many issues on Mac (never got it working), also the learning curve is too steep, maybe I'll give it a try again.
- lambdaba 1y ago
  An easy option nowadays is Determinate Nix https://docs.determinate.systems/determinate-nix/ https://docs.determinate.systems/determinate-nix/
  - troupo 1y ago
    So, an "easy" "better" option is: - worse ux (nix commands are much more cumbersome and often make no sense compared to `brew install`) - you have to use some third-party wrappers to make it work on Mac - features incomplete and outdated packages (and is missing others apparently https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=44034446 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=44034446) ... but it "does the job better than anything else could". --- This is the issue I have with the whole nix discourse: it's hailed as this great magical tool. But when pressed for details it's always this: weird commands, configs, working or non-working wrappers etc.
    - lambdaba 1y ago
      This is just from my experience, I'm not part of any kind of Nix cult or anything, not that I'm aware of. I don't know what you're talking about re: third party wrappers, this is just an option for a slightly easier and perhaps more robust install. And homebrew isn't free of issues at all.
      - troupo 1y ago
        So a "better than anything" still needs "a better more robust install" and you still use homebrew for "packages that are packaged better like ... the extremely popular and often installed ffmpeg" ;) > And homebrew isn't free of issues at all. No one advertises brew as "the best", "better than everything else" etc. BTW, looked at Determinate Nix. It's a custom distribution and a custom daemon, and its own fork of documentation

cosmic_cheese 1y ago

That’s still more to remember than `x install y`, which might sound trivial but that’s the exact kind of friction that impedes adoption. Maybe it would make sense for nix to add a mode that basically aliases that first command to `nix install <package>`.

drcongo 1y ago
That's essentially what Devbox does for you as a package manager, a hand wrapper around nix for using nix just for its package ecosystem.
- lambdaba 1y ago
  Oh yeah, I knew about devbox but hadn't seen (perhaps it's new) that it can handle global packages: https://www.jetify.com/docs/devbox/devbox_global/ https://www.jetify.com/docs/devbox/devbox_global/
lambdaba 1y ago
Yeah, I'm just addressing you specifically, you could switch easily and Nix has a much larger package selection (outside of GUI apps on macOS). And it immediately can do more via nix-shell -p, which can be also be used as shebang. But yeah, Nix is much more than a homebrew replacement and that has its downsides.
- verdverm 1y ago
  Nix may have a larger selection, but I sampled a few of the projects I install from homebrew and... 1. Did't actually exist 2. Outdated version 3. Incorrect build I'll keep the quality of Homebrew packages over the quantity in Nix
  - lambdaba 1y ago
    I'm curious of what the packages are because I only have ~10 packages that I use from homebrew, either very Mac-specific or that have better packaging (ffmpeg, mpv)
    - spacedcowboy 1y ago
      Not going to list them all, but... @M4MBP ~ % brew list | wc -l 149
      - troupo 1y ago
        Some/many of those are likely to be dependencies. For example, it shows openssl@1.1 and openssl@3 on my machine
        mbirth 1y ago
        `brew leaves` will show manually installed packages.
        spacedcowboy 1y ago
        Right, but I don't think that's the issue. If the complaint is that other systems are less up-to-date than brew is, then the number of things installed is still the issue - whether they're dependencies or not. Unless, of course, the other system manages dependencies differently, say it compiles in static versions of required libraries at build-time, or divides them up into fewer dependent packages.
    - verdverm 1y ago

norman784 1y ago

I tried nix a few times in the past and it has too many issues on Mac (never got it working), also the learning curve is too steep, maybe I'll give it a try again.

lambdaba 1y ago
An easy option nowadays is Determinate Nix https://docs.determinate.systems/determinate-nix/ https://docs.determinate.systems/determinate-nix/
- troupo 1y ago
  So, an "easy" "better" option is: - worse ux (nix commands are much more cumbersome and often make no sense compared to `brew install`) - you have to use some third-party wrappers to make it work on Mac - features incomplete and outdated packages (and is missing others apparently https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=44034446 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=44034446) ... but it "does the job better than anything else could". --- This is the issue I have with the whole nix discourse: it's hailed as this great magical tool. But when pressed for details it's always this: weird commands, configs, working or non-working wrappers etc.
  - lambdaba 1y ago
    This is just from my experience, I'm not part of any kind of Nix cult or anything, not that I'm aware of. I don't know what you're talking about re: third party wrappers, this is just an option for a slightly easier and perhaps more robust install. And homebrew isn't free of issues at all.
    - troupo 1y ago
      So a "better than anything" still needs "a better more robust install" and you still use homebrew for "packages that are packaged better like ... the extremely popular and often installed ffmpeg" ;) > And homebrew isn't free of issues at all. No one advertises brew as "the best", "better than everything else" etc. BTW, looked at Determinate Nix. It's a custom distribution and a custom daemon, and its own fork of documentation