5 ms·

The beauty of rape as an accusation is that it is so reviled that people tend to suspend their objectivity and take the view of guilty until proven innocent. E

The beauty of rape as an accusation is that it is so reviled that people tend to suspend their objectivity and take the view of guilty until proven innocent. Even people who are cleared of rape charges are viewed in a highly negative light, by virtue of association. Even if the people who set this up drop everything and don't try for an extradition to the united states, they will have succeeded in thoroughly sliming Julian. They don't need to kill him or imprison him (that would probably backfire anyhow), they only need to classically condition people to associate JULIAN ASSANGE and RAPIST. You realize that the central intelligence agency actually had plans to make Castro's beard fall out because they believed that Cubans would view him as less virile and thus easier to depose? Or that they wanted to dose him with LSD so he would act crazy during a major speech? You really think the United States intelligence apparatus wouldn't try to break someone that burned them very hard by playing on views like "Personally I'd class it as the second most significant crime against the person that the law recognises after murder"???? Particularly given that rape can be her word versus his, and that can be sufficient to get a conviction? With murder, you need a body, and that can be hard to produce.

Tyrannosaurs 14y ago
The fact it's easy to falsify and that such a false accusation can ruin lives doesn't change the nature or severity of the crime. And the fact that the CIA have a real history of crap like this doesn't change the possibility that this is a real accusation of a real crime with real victims. I'm not saying he's guilty and I agree that what we know of the evidence at the moment means that the whole thing isn't cut and dried (rape cases rarely are, the nature of the crime makes the investigation and prosecution of them messy in the extreme and there are far too many false accusations - something which should be a crime). What I am saying that he's wanted for questioning and that situations like this where things aren't clear are why we have due process. Is it possible that he's being set up? Yes. Is it possible that he's committed a significant crime? Yes. How best to deal with this? Using an established, public process based on solid principals of justice established over centuries which may be flawed but is the best thing we have at present, or some curious combination of political manoeuvring, PR and who knows what else? The Swedish justice system may not be perfect, but it's surely a far better way of establishing what might have happened between Assange and the two women than what we're seeing now. If the case is that weak and the police have been that remiss then his lawyers should have a field day.
- vidarh 14y ago
  The Swedish justice system might have been a better way, if they had not in the past demonstrated they are prepared to hand even asylum seekers over to the CIA to be shipped off to be tortured and if it wasn't for all the irregularities with this case so far. Given that, I see no reason at all to trust that he would get a fair trial, if he'd get one at all.
- wnight 14y ago
  You're on your anti-rape high-horse but nobody is saying it's a goodness, that's just a straw man you've dragged out to beat. However if you actually cared about rape you'd be upset at the many documented cases of molestation and rape the US, UK, and Swedish governments are sitting on despite ample evidence, while pursing this nonsense. No, it's pretty obvious you're just another anti-Wikileaks crusader because you ignore everything relevant such as how he was already questioned and released, how even with allegations of murder questioning takes place in the defendants country of residence UNTIL adequate proof has been collected for extradition, etc. As for the possibility of Assange being a rapist, there's the same possibility you're a rapist. But regarding probability, yes, that the CIA has pulled this shit before, and the Swedish police aren't following protocol at all, does make it far less likely that the case is real. They wouldn't need these games if he was actually accused of a real crime. I only wish you were trolling, and not representative of Fox News viewers.
  - Tyrannosaurs 14y ago
    I honestly have no strong views on wikileaks (I find Assanges absolute certainty about what they do troubling but I think the principal of disclosure is fine). I live in the UK and have voted for left wing parties every election (local, national and Euopean) for over 20 years now. My political ideals are so far from Fox News it's not true. In terms of questioning and release, who knows maybe they'd question someone as many often as twice before charging them with rape. If you think that's suspicious then you have an odd idea of what comprises a thorough criminal investigation. Yes, I could be a rapist though there is a key difference between Assange and myself when it comes to the possibility which is that there are currently at least two ore women making suggestions that he might have than are saying the same about me. In terms of being anti-rape. Sorry, guilty as charged. It's a controversial view that people shouldn't be forced into sex against their will but thats the kind of troll I am. I wish that the police investigated them all with this level of vigour but the fact that they don't has no real significance here other than another example of how high profile figures of all sorts tend to get more attention in these cases.
HomaSapiens 14y ago
I keep seeing people who reflexively refuse to entertain the notion that Assange could be guilty. The other beauty if you want to call it that, of rape as an accusation is that it's so easy to brand the woman as a liar and a slut. Especially to the people who matter-- other men. I do not know why it's so hard to believe that a driven, virile man who is gathering the reins of power into his hands for the GOOD OF MANKIND must be pure of heart and soul. My experience with suchlike is that they are bullies at heart. We hope they will be bullies on the side of light and goodness, but-- maybe not in every part of their lives. People who KNOW WHAT IS GOOD FOR MANKIND often KNOW WHAT IS GOOD IN BED too, and go for it regardless.
- NathanRice 14y ago
  When I first saw the news of the rape allegations, my reaction was "eew, what a slimy fellow". I have only changed my tune after looking at the details closely. I do feel that these women have the right to air their grievances publicly, and be afforded the opportunity for an impartial legal process. Unfortunately, I have very strong doubts that any impartial legal process will occur, but rather a highly partial extra-legal process. I respect that you have observed situations where men have taken advantage of women, or a woman's rights have been disregarded; it happens with alarming frequency, and it saddens me greatly. I do feel that society in general (in the west anyhow) is very sympathetic to the woman in instances of sexual assault. Because of its horrible frequency, it is very easy for any man to imagine that the woman who was raped was his mother, his wife, his daughter, his sister or a close female friend. This fills us with wrath and gives us a desire for terrible vengeance; that is precisely why we must collect ourselves and be rational. did you know that rapists and child molesters tend to be treated so savagely by other inmates that special prisons (or special wings in regular prisons) are constructed to keep them alive?

Tyrannosaurs 14y ago

The fact it's easy to falsify and that such a false accusation can ruin lives doesn't change the nature or severity of the crime. And the fact that the CIA have a real history of crap like this doesn't change the possibility that this is a real accusation of a real crime with real victims. I'm not saying he's guilty and I agree that what we know of the evidence at the moment means that the whole thing isn't cut and dried (rape cases rarely are, the nature of the crime makes the investigation and prosecution of them messy in the extreme and there are far too many false accusations - something which should be a crime). What I am saying that he's wanted for questioning and that situations like this where things aren't clear are why we have due process. Is it possible that he's being set up? Yes. Is it possible that he's committed a significant crime? Yes. How best to deal with this? Using an established, public process based on solid principals of justice established over centuries which may be flawed but is the best thing we have at present, or some curious combination of political manoeuvring, PR and who knows what else? The Swedish justice system may not be perfect, but it's surely a far better way of establishing what might have happened between Assange and the two women than what we're seeing now. If the case is that weak and the police have been that remiss then his lawyers should have a field day.

vidarh 14y ago
The Swedish justice system might have been a better way, if they had not in the past demonstrated they are prepared to hand even asylum seekers over to the CIA to be shipped off to be tortured and if it wasn't for all the irregularities with this case so far. Given that, I see no reason at all to trust that he would get a fair trial, if he'd get one at all.
wnight 14y ago
You're on your anti-rape high-horse but nobody is saying it's a goodness, that's just a straw man you've dragged out to beat. However if you actually cared about rape you'd be upset at the many documented cases of molestation and rape the US, UK, and Swedish governments are sitting on despite ample evidence, while pursing this nonsense. No, it's pretty obvious you're just another anti-Wikileaks crusader because you ignore everything relevant such as how he was already questioned and released, how even with allegations of murder questioning takes place in the defendants country of residence UNTIL adequate proof has been collected for extradition, etc. As for the possibility of Assange being a rapist, there's the same possibility you're a rapist. But regarding probability, yes, that the CIA has pulled this shit before, and the Swedish police aren't following protocol at all, does make it far less likely that the case is real. They wouldn't need these games if he was actually accused of a real crime. I only wish you were trolling, and not representative of Fox News viewers.
- Tyrannosaurs 14y ago
  I honestly have no strong views on wikileaks (I find Assanges absolute certainty about what they do troubling but I think the principal of disclosure is fine). I live in the UK and have voted for left wing parties every election (local, national and Euopean) for over 20 years now. My political ideals are so far from Fox News it's not true. In terms of questioning and release, who knows maybe they'd question someone as many often as twice before charging them with rape. If you think that's suspicious then you have an odd idea of what comprises a thorough criminal investigation. Yes, I could be a rapist though there is a key difference between Assange and myself when it comes to the possibility which is that there are currently at least two ore women making suggestions that he might have than are saying the same about me. In terms of being anti-rape. Sorry, guilty as charged. It's a controversial view that people shouldn't be forced into sex against their will but thats the kind of troll I am. I wish that the police investigated them all with this level of vigour but the fact that they don't has no real significance here other than another example of how high profile figures of all sorts tend to get more attention in these cases.

HomaSapiens 14y ago

I keep seeing people who reflexively refuse to entertain the notion that Assange could be guilty. The other beauty if you want to call it that, of rape as an accusation is that it's so easy to brand the woman as a liar and a slut. Especially to the people who matter-- other men. I do not know why it's so hard to believe that a driven, virile man who is gathering the reins of power into his hands for the GOOD OF MANKIND must be pure of heart and soul. My experience with suchlike is that they are bullies at heart. We hope they will be bullies on the side of light and goodness, but-- maybe not in every part of their lives. People who KNOW WHAT IS GOOD FOR MANKIND often KNOW WHAT IS GOOD IN BED too, and go for it regardless.

NathanRice 14y ago
When I first saw the news of the rape allegations, my reaction was "eew, what a slimy fellow". I have only changed my tune after looking at the details closely. I do feel that these women have the right to air their grievances publicly, and be afforded the opportunity for an impartial legal process. Unfortunately, I have very strong doubts that any impartial legal process will occur, but rather a highly partial extra-legal process. I respect that you have observed situations where men have taken advantage of women, or a woman's rights have been disregarded; it happens with alarming frequency, and it saddens me greatly. I do feel that society in general (in the west anyhow) is very sympathetic to the woman in instances of sexual assault. Because of its horrible frequency, it is very easy for any man to imagine that the woman who was raped was his mother, his wife, his daughter, his sister or a close female friend. This fills us with wrath and gives us a desire for terrible vengeance; that is precisely why we must collect ourselves and be rational. did you know that rapists and child molesters tend to be treated so savagely by other inmates that special prisons (or special wings in regular prisons) are constructed to keep them alive?