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When viewed as a percent of their annual revenue, rather than an absolute number, it's not really all that massive. It's like 3% or so. And you can't really ju

When viewed as a percent of their annual revenue, rather than an absolute number, it's not really all that massive. It's like 3% or so. And you can't really just look at the 3%, you have to factor in what benefits (money, political sway, whatever) they received in exchange for the data. For simplicity, if they got paid, I don't know, $150M/yr from China for the data and they've been sending data for (at least) 4 years... They would have made a profit despite the fine! ($150M is obviously pulled out of my ass, just as a demonstration of how when you look at the fines from a bigger context, it might just be a line item on the expense report that's worth taking the risk on)

dmix 1y ago
> When viewed as a percent of their annual revenue, I've always found this viewpoint a bit childish, with little regard for how businesses work IRL (even the ignoring the obvious profits vs revenue part). Reminds me of how every comment section re: some crime story is people calling for death penalty or how a mob should kill them first. Justice is never that simple. I understand people want businesses they don't like to simply not exist anymore but that doesn't mean it's rational to throw up insane fines because you spent 2min doing back of a napkin math of revenue * (imaginary deterrent %) > For simplicity, if they got paid, I don't know, $150M/yr from China for the data and they've been sending data for (at least) 4 years... They would have made a profit despite the fine! The Chinese government doesn't need to pay companies to exfiltrate data from companies within their reach.
- ziddoap 1y ago
  >I've always found this viewpoint a bit childish, It's childish to view fines as a percent of revenue rather than an absolute number...? That's certainly an odd take. Fines are meant to be a deterrent. If you fine Microsoft $50,000 they will literally not notice. If you fine my locally owned convenience store $50,000 they will probably be forced to close. It's absurd to ignore that. >I understand people want businesses they don't like to simply not exist anymore I did not say this, or anything close to it. My entire point was that looking at a number in a vacuum and saying "that's massive" or "that's not that big" is silly. What's "massive" to some companies is a tiny blip on the radar of other companies. I cannot understand anyone who thinks looking at fines in context is "childish". Not looking at fines in context is something only the largest and richest of companies would be a proponent for, because it would make the fines absolutely meaningless for them while being effective against anyone smaller.
- bryan_w 1y ago
  I'm convinced that when someone makes an argument using revenue vs profit, it is either a literal teenager (look at that huge number! I've never seen a number so big), or an inauthentic poster (just putting the fries in the bag)

dmix 1y ago

> When viewed as a percent of their annual revenue, I've always found this viewpoint a bit childish, with little regard for how businesses work IRL (even the ignoring the obvious profits vs revenue part). Reminds me of how every comment section re: some crime story is people calling for death penalty or how a mob should kill them first. Justice is never that simple. I understand people want businesses they don't like to simply not exist anymore but that doesn't mean it's rational to throw up insane fines because you spent 2min doing back of a napkin math of revenue * (imaginary deterrent %) > For simplicity, if they got paid, I don't know, $150M/yr from China for the data and they've been sending data for (at least) 4 years... They would have made a profit despite the fine! The Chinese government doesn't need to pay companies to exfiltrate data from companies within their reach.

ziddoap 1y ago
>I've always found this viewpoint a bit childish, It's childish to view fines as a percent of revenue rather than an absolute number...? That's certainly an odd take. Fines are meant to be a deterrent. If you fine Microsoft $50,000 they will literally not notice. If you fine my locally owned convenience store $50,000 they will probably be forced to close. It's absurd to ignore that. >I understand people want businesses they don't like to simply not exist anymore I did not say this, or anything close to it. My entire point was that looking at a number in a vacuum and saying "that's massive" or "that's not that big" is silly. What's "massive" to some companies is a tiny blip on the radar of other companies. I cannot understand anyone who thinks looking at fines in context is "childish". Not looking at fines in context is something only the largest and richest of companies would be a proponent for, because it would make the fines absolutely meaningless for them while being effective against anyone smaller.
bryan_w 1y ago
I'm convinced that when someone makes an argument using revenue vs profit, it is either a literal teenager (look at that huge number! I've never seen a number so big), or an inauthentic poster (just putting the fries in the bag)