5 ms·

Elon Musk is reportedly taking control of the inner workings of US govt agencies

75 points by cdme 2y ago

tayo42 2y ago
No one voted for him. Hes not american. What can be done? Amazing these absolutely insane things are happening.
- moprobz 2y ago
  [flagged]
  - trod1234 2y ago
    No, there are plenty of complacent people out there that are willfully blind to the evil things they do. The real problem is the bankers, the ones who loaned him the money.
- hughdbrown 2y ago
  He's an American because he got naturalized citizenship. According to the State Department and the Supreme Court, at a minimum, he qualifies as an American.
  - llamaimperative 2y ago
    Not if he immigrated here illegally (which he did, according to his brother). There’s no valid path to naturalization via an invalid/fraudulent lawful permanent resident status.
    - hughdbrown 2y ago
      He is currently a naturalized American citizen. For him to lose that status, he would have to be stripped of it by a legal process, commonly called denaturalization. [0] It is not enough for people to accuse you of having committed fraud in naturalization. > There’s no valid path to naturalization I think it is correct to say that your naturalized status can be unwound if a prosecution against you is successful, but until that happens, you are considered an American citizen. Presumption of innocence and all that American stuff. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Denaturalization https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Denaturalization
  - tayo42 2y ago
    he's not American enough to run for president.
    - breadwinner 2y ago
      Right, and that's why he installed Trump as the proxy president.
- credit_guy 2y ago
  The B-21 Raider will cost $700 million apiece. The US Air Force will buy about 100. During WWII the best bomber of the war (so somewhat the equivalent of the B-21 for the time) was the B-29, and the US built 4000 of those. And many, many more of other types of bombers. How did we get from there to here? Musk's company meanwhile is churning out rockets like there's no tomorrow. They are at number 35 of the super huge one, the Starship, although rumors are that they are currently in various stages of build with 4 more.
  - tayo42 2y ago
    Your point is weak, 35 is less then 4000. Even still if it's equivalent we can only speculate what his role in rockets actually is all we have is pr. What I do know from personal first hand experience (ex-Twitter) is that he is a terrible leader and person. Also he isn't smart. No media influence on how I feel about how he runs companies.
    - credit_guy 2y ago
      > Your point is weak, 35 is less then 4000 Ok, I admit, I could have spent more time crafting the argument. The point is, SpaceX has already built 35 of the Starship, and flown quite a few of them, all while in prototype mode. When they reach full production mode, they intend to build one Starship per day. You may retort that Musk's promises don't amount for much, but it is a fact that SpaceX launches more rockets than any other company in the world, private or government-owned. Just this year they've launched 13 times, which is almost one launch every other day.
bediger4000 2y ago
How is this legal?
- deleted 2y ago
  [deleted]
- quantified 2y ago
  Apparently executive orders are enough? Or not, you can say anything in an executive order and if people fall in line it works.
  - deleted 2y ago
    [deleted]
- trod1234 2y ago
  What is legality when the rule of law no longer applies and becomes only a rule by law. An imperfect system was corrupted, and no one did a thing to stop it (in aggregate). Mind you this didn't start with trump. It's been a long-running plan by Fabian's dating back to the 1900s. Everyone just thought it was some fringe conspiracy theory because that's how the media portrayed it. Even the Kennedy Assassination was insufficient to wake people up to the corruption. Now that its actually happening, and most of the smart people have been removed, discredited, or destroyed. What hope do the masses actually have?
  - nozzlegear 2y ago
    Who is Fabian?
    - defrost 2y ago
      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quintus_Fabius_Maximus_Verrucosus https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quintus_Fabius_Maximus_Verruco... I suspect that's a reference to the dark cabal of socialists .. /s https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fabian_Society https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fabian_Society
breadwinner 2y ago
Elon Musk was not elected, and his appointment was not confirmed by the senate. And yet he is taking control of the government. Since Musk took over Twitter it is worth nearly 80% less than when he bought it, according to Fidelity [1]. Is this what he is going to do to the US government? [1] https://www.cnn.com/2024/10/02/business/elon-musk-twitter-x-fidelity/index.html https://www.cnn.com/2024/10/02/business/elon-musk-twitter-x-...
- tim333 2y ago
  With a combination of Musk's proposed spending cuts and Trump's tariffs they may be able to achieve something like that for the US.
- trod1234 2y ago
  Not news that globalists are dismantling the few roadblocks left so they can turn it into an empire. People have been calling this day for decades, while state-run media, a tyrant's best friend, labelled it fringe. You won't have any enforceable rights, and will be no better than a slave by the time they are done. Shock doctrine is all about creating the disasters surreptitiously, then claiming to have a solution, which isn't a solution but just another mile down the road towards the inevitable goal. "I'm American... yes, but what kind of American are you?"
  - nozzlegear 2y ago
    You think Elon is still a closet globalist after the last six months, and he's part of a cabal of globalists that are dismantling roadblocks in the government by hitching their ride to an ultranationalistic and protectionist president? > "I'm American... yes, but what kind of American are you?" A surprisingly good movie, but not because of its political commentary which it shied away from almost entirely.
    - trod1234 2y ago
      Of course, the cabal of globalists are all backed by the same people. Those people are the fiat inflationary money printer central bankers, following a policy interventionism which taken to its conclusion results in destruction. You gauge a group of people by their actions, and not what they say because deceitful parasites lie more than they breathe. A Protectionist/ultranationalistic president won't be in office for long. They'll 25th amendment him given his age/competency. That leaves Vance as president, and his policies are unclear, but any policy is going to require money, and that money has only one place to come from, central bankers.
ajuc 2y ago
Create a system in which politicians have to suck up to rich people to win elections. Wonder why you get oligarchy as a result. If anything it's a miracle it's only becoming explicit now. The whole system was held by spit and glue. In many countries parties are funded from taxes (proportionally to the results of the last elections). People/corporations paying politicians is illegal. Politicians don't have to compete for billioners' money - they just compete for votes. It's pretty obvious it's a better system. It wastes less money too (there's a cap to the marketing arms race).
- tim333 2y ago
  In the US back in the Carter days too. They really need to rewind a bit.
ty6853 2y ago
Trump and his brethren are out for blood after the 34 felonies and the assassination attempt. Hope the attempt at 'rule of law' (and sentence of basically nothing) for rarely prosecuted paperwork crimes was worth it because it's looking like the most costly prosecution in US history in terms of after effects.
- krapp 2y ago
  I don't know. I feel like the real problem there is that Trump committed 34 felonies. Or that he got off. Or that committing 34 felonies doesn't disqualify someone from being president. Or even that Trump and his brethren are even "out for blood." Not that anyone had the audacity to apply the law to a sitting president to begin with. Although it's weirdly controversial to claim that the president shouldn't be above the law.
  - ty6853 2y ago
    I don't disagree, but there is a reason for the saying 'if you take a shot at the king you had better not miss.' Trump doesn't care if what comes after is right or wrong. Prosecutors can smugly pat themselves on their back while everyone else suffers even more.
  - tim333 2y ago
    [flagged]
    - krapp 2y ago
      What's weird is that the "what even is the crime here" and "they aren't real felonies" spiel only ever applies to Trump. If Biden tried to hide hush money payments to a porn star to keep a scandal about tax dodging and campaign finance law violations out of an election cycle you'd be calling for his head. I mean that's basically what the whole Hunter Biden laptop story is supposed to be, isn't it? There isn't even any there there but Trumpists act like it's the biggest scandal since Watergate.
      - 2y ago
ChrisArchitect 2y ago
Related: Musk aides lock government workers out of computer systems at US agency https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42892278 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42892278 Elon Musk's Doge Wants Access to the Treasury's Payment Systems https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42894166 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42894166
joker666 2y ago
[flagged]
- bmgoau 2y ago
  > what do you really want? An unelected oligarch to not impose his own vision onto the federal government. A social network is one thing. But now lives and livelihoods are at risk. I'll take bureaucracy over Musk's unchecked changes any day.
allkindsof 2y ago
Can we get this unflagged?
- tim333 2y ago
  As a potential tech fix to the endless debates about flagging maybe there should be an upvote/downvote system for flagging rather than just a flag option?

75 points by cdme 2y ago

tayo42 2y ago

No one voted for him. Hes not american. What can be done? Amazing these absolutely insane things are happening.

moprobz 2y ago
[flagged]
- trod1234 2y ago
  No, there are plenty of complacent people out there that are willfully blind to the evil things they do. The real problem is the bankers, the ones who loaned him the money.
hughdbrown 2y ago
He's an American because he got naturalized citizenship. According to the State Department and the Supreme Court, at a minimum, he qualifies as an American.
- llamaimperative 2y ago
  Not if he immigrated here illegally (which he did, according to his brother). There’s no valid path to naturalization via an invalid/fraudulent lawful permanent resident status.
  - hughdbrown 2y ago
    He is currently a naturalized American citizen. For him to lose that status, he would have to be stripped of it by a legal process, commonly called denaturalization. [0] It is not enough for people to accuse you of having committed fraud in naturalization. > There’s no valid path to naturalization I think it is correct to say that your naturalized status can be unwound if a prosecution against you is successful, but until that happens, you are considered an American citizen. Presumption of innocence and all that American stuff. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Denaturalization https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Denaturalization
- tayo42 2y ago
  he's not American enough to run for president.
  - breadwinner 2y ago
    Right, and that's why he installed Trump as the proxy president.
credit_guy 2y ago
The B-21 Raider will cost $700 million apiece. The US Air Force will buy about 100. During WWII the best bomber of the war (so somewhat the equivalent of the B-21 for the time) was the B-29, and the US built 4000 of those. And many, many more of other types of bombers. How did we get from there to here? Musk's company meanwhile is churning out rockets like there's no tomorrow. They are at number 35 of the super huge one, the Starship, although rumors are that they are currently in various stages of build with 4 more.
- tayo42 2y ago
  Your point is weak, 35 is less then 4000. Even still if it's equivalent we can only speculate what his role in rockets actually is all we have is pr. What I do know from personal first hand experience (ex-Twitter) is that he is a terrible leader and person. Also he isn't smart. No media influence on how I feel about how he runs companies.
  - credit_guy 2y ago
    > Your point is weak, 35 is less then 4000 Ok, I admit, I could have spent more time crafting the argument. The point is, SpaceX has already built 35 of the Starship, and flown quite a few of them, all while in prototype mode. When they reach full production mode, they intend to build one Starship per day. You may retort that Musk's promises don't amount for much, but it is a fact that SpaceX launches more rockets than any other company in the world, private or government-owned. Just this year they've launched 13 times, which is almost one launch every other day.

bediger4000 2y ago

How is this legal?

deleted 2y ago
[deleted]
quantified 2y ago
Apparently executive orders are enough? Or not, you can say anything in an executive order and if people fall in line it works.
- deleted 2y ago
  [deleted]
trod1234 2y ago
What is legality when the rule of law no longer applies and becomes only a rule by law. An imperfect system was corrupted, and no one did a thing to stop it (in aggregate). Mind you this didn't start with trump. It's been a long-running plan by Fabian's dating back to the 1900s. Everyone just thought it was some fringe conspiracy theory because that's how the media portrayed it. Even the Kennedy Assassination was insufficient to wake people up to the corruption. Now that its actually happening, and most of the smart people have been removed, discredited, or destroyed. What hope do the masses actually have?
- nozzlegear 2y ago
  Who is Fabian?
  - defrost 2y ago
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quintus_Fabius_Maximus_Verrucosus https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quintus_Fabius_Maximus_Verruco... I suspect that's a reference to the dark cabal of socialists .. /s https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fabian_Society https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fabian_Society

breadwinner 2y ago

Elon Musk was not elected, and his appointment was not confirmed by the senate. And yet he is taking control of the government. Since Musk took over Twitter it is worth nearly 80% less than when he bought it, according to Fidelity [1]. Is this what he is going to do to the US government? [1] https://www.cnn.com/2024/10/02/business/elon-musk-twitter-x-fidelity/index.html https://www.cnn.com/2024/10/02/business/elon-musk-twitter-x-...

tim333 2y ago
With a combination of Musk's proposed spending cuts and Trump's tariffs they may be able to achieve something like that for the US.
trod1234 2y ago
Not news that globalists are dismantling the few roadblocks left so they can turn it into an empire. People have been calling this day for decades, while state-run media, a tyrant's best friend, labelled it fringe. You won't have any enforceable rights, and will be no better than a slave by the time they are done. Shock doctrine is all about creating the disasters surreptitiously, then claiming to have a solution, which isn't a solution but just another mile down the road towards the inevitable goal. "I'm American... yes, but what kind of American are you?"
- nozzlegear 2y ago
  You think Elon is still a closet globalist after the last six months, and he's part of a cabal of globalists that are dismantling roadblocks in the government by hitching their ride to an ultranationalistic and protectionist president? > "I'm American... yes, but what kind of American are you?" A surprisingly good movie, but not because of its political commentary which it shied away from almost entirely.
  - trod1234 2y ago
    Of course, the cabal of globalists are all backed by the same people. Those people are the fiat inflationary money printer central bankers, following a policy interventionism which taken to its conclusion results in destruction. You gauge a group of people by their actions, and not what they say because deceitful parasites lie more than they breathe. A Protectionist/ultranationalistic president won't be in office for long. They'll 25th amendment him given his age/competency. That leaves Vance as president, and his policies are unclear, but any policy is going to require money, and that money has only one place to come from, central bankers.

ajuc 2y ago

Create a system in which politicians have to suck up to rich people to win elections. Wonder why you get oligarchy as a result. If anything it's a miracle it's only becoming explicit now. The whole system was held by spit and glue. In many countries parties are funded from taxes (proportionally to the results of the last elections). People/corporations paying politicians is illegal. Politicians don't have to compete for billioners' money - they just compete for votes. It's pretty obvious it's a better system. It wastes less money too (there's a cap to the marketing arms race).

tim333 2y ago
In the US back in the Carter days too. They really need to rewind a bit.

ty6853 2y ago

Trump and his brethren are out for blood after the 34 felonies and the assassination attempt. Hope the attempt at 'rule of law' (and sentence of basically nothing) for rarely prosecuted paperwork crimes was worth it because it's looking like the most costly prosecution in US history in terms of after effects.

krapp 2y ago
I don't know. I feel like the real problem there is that Trump committed 34 felonies. Or that he got off. Or that committing 34 felonies doesn't disqualify someone from being president. Or even that Trump and his brethren are even "out for blood." Not that anyone had the audacity to apply the law to a sitting president to begin with. Although it's weirdly controversial to claim that the president shouldn't be above the law.
- ty6853 2y ago
  I don't disagree, but there is a reason for the saying 'if you take a shot at the king you had better not miss.' Trump doesn't care if what comes after is right or wrong. Prosecutors can smugly pat themselves on their back while everyone else suffers even more.
- tim333 2y ago
  [flagged]
  - krapp 2y ago
    What's weird is that the "what even is the crime here" and "they aren't real felonies" spiel only ever applies to Trump. If Biden tried to hide hush money payments to a porn star to keep a scandal about tax dodging and campaign finance law violations out of an election cycle you'd be calling for his head. I mean that's basically what the whole Hunter Biden laptop story is supposed to be, isn't it? There isn't even any there there but Trumpists act like it's the biggest scandal since Watergate.
    - 2y ago

ChrisArchitect 2y ago

Related: Musk aides lock government workers out of computer systems at US agency https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42892278 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42892278 Elon Musk's Doge Wants Access to the Treasury's Payment Systems https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42894166 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42894166

joker666 2y ago

[flagged]

bmgoau 2y ago
> what do you really want? An unelected oligarch to not impose his own vision onto the federal government. A social network is one thing. But now lives and livelihoods are at risk. I'll take bureaucracy over Musk's unchecked changes any day.

allkindsof 2y ago

Can we get this unflagged?

tim333 2y ago
As a potential tech fix to the endless debates about flagging maybe there should be an upvote/downvote system for flagging rather than just a flag option?