7 ms·

It's about exposure to the way richer people think and access to the same community resources. Property taxes pay for schools. The best schools are in the riche

It's about exposure to the way richer people think and access to the same community resources. Property taxes pay for schools. The best schools are in the richest communities.

forgetfreeman 2y ago
Your local private school also isn't going to cut you a check, and I've yet to meet anyone with money that had a hard time sniffing out aspirational neighbors. Not buying it.
- ndriscoll 2y ago
  The assumption is that upper class kids are more likely to have the types of behaviors and attitudes that you'd like your kids to adopt (e.g. getting a C or even a B is embarrassing/shameful, AP classes are table stakes, drug use bad, video games/tv limited, more likely to have intact households, expected to be polite/treat others respectfully) while lower class kids are more likely to have the types of behaviors and attitudes you'd like your kids to avoid (e.g. no point in applying yourself, parents have no idea what you're up to or how you're doing in school anyway, drug use normal or cool, kids raised by tv/computer/phone, family tree is more of a chain with random links sticking out, family yells at each other so loud the neighbors hear it). It's an attempt to manipulate the Overton window that your kid will encounter interacting with peers.
  - lotsofpulp 2y ago
    A related adage to present this succinctly, "you are the company you keep".
  - forgetfreeman 2y ago
    100% of the individuals that I've known who ended up either shot dead in the street or caught serious charges were from upper middle class, outright wealthy neighborhoods, or were keeping company with rich kids. Maybe my sample is badly skewed but around these parts all the wealthy are known for is buying their lunatic children out of trouble.
    - lotsofpulp 2y ago
      https://opportunityatlas.org https://opportunityatlas.org
    - GodEmperorElon 2y ago
      [dead]
  - nicolas_t 2y ago
    In my experience, the positive attributes you list tend to be more associated with middle class than upper classes. At a certain amount of wealth, you can see very problematic behaviour.
- gnkyfrg 2y ago
  This is the kind of contemptuous skepticism of facts from, and lack of trust for, folks trying to help you understand something that permeates neglected communities and interferes with the educational process. That attitude is prevalent in poor schools, but rare in rich schools and is properly dealt with by better educators that prefer wealthy schools with good salaries. That sort of antagonism toward authority is incredibly disruptive in a community of People who want to achieve something. Parents want to get their kids away from it for a reason. It's unhealthy. You're an example of the point. I don't mean any offense by it, just that it's easy to sniff out that you haven't experienced both sides of the coin so you reveal stubborn ignorance. It inhibits learning and communicating. It's repulsive.
  - forgetfreeman 2y ago
    > just that it's easy to sniff out that you haven't experienced both sides of the coin so you reveal stubborn ignorance. You're welcome to that narrative if you find it comforting. It's wildly incorrect however. Half of my family self-identify as semi-literate rednecks. The other half are members of the most prestigious country club in the state they reside in and the least successful of them was a V level executive at a multinational bank. I've cherry-picked the best of both worlds and have done just fine for myself without having to resort to any of the soulless pantomime you're advocating here, which does more to maintain property values in exclusive neighborhoods and feed a certain class of individual's sense of self-worth than anything objective. Water finds it's level I suppose.
throwaway2037 2y ago
> Property taxes pay for schools. I know this is true for the US. The vast majority of public school budgets are paid from local property taxes. This gives wealthy communities a significant advantage. Princeton, New Jersey is famous for its high property taxes and excellent public schools. Are there any other countries that use a local-tax funding model for public schools? Most other nations that I know use a national funding model.
- Mountain_Skies 2y ago
  Baltimore is famous for its high per student funding of public schools ($21,000 per student in 2023). It's also famous for the terrible outcomes of its public school students.
  - BeefWellington 2y ago
    Yeah but how is that funding actually applied? You could throw an extreme amount of money at schools but require it be spent on specific initiatives. Things like resource officers, hiring someone with specific qualifications, and boatloads of staff training. You can average that out to a per student basis and say "look we're spending so much on education" but if the money is going to train teachers how to deal with crisis situations like school shooters, it's not really being spent on educating the student. How that money actually gets allocated matters.
  - jkolio 2y ago
    This is a common misconception. The high per capita funding is partially due to required emergency funding of repairs resulting from deferred maintenance - both in the literal sense, and in reference to the hollowing out of the city's industry and, therefore, capacity for stable community and family life. Baltimore is a Rust Belt city smack dab in the middle of a region that happily moved on to the service economy; poorer Baltimore residents are surrounded by people who can bid up the rates of goods in the area (and they do). Other jurisdictions don't have to put so much into student funding directly.
    - 2y ago

It's about exposure to the way richer people think and access to the same community resources. Property taxes pay for schools. The best schools are in the richest communities.

forgetfreeman 2y ago

Your local private school also isn't going to cut you a check, and I've yet to meet anyone with money that had a hard time sniffing out aspirational neighbors. Not buying it.

ndriscoll 2y ago
The assumption is that upper class kids are more likely to have the types of behaviors and attitudes that you'd like your kids to adopt (e.g. getting a C or even a B is embarrassing/shameful, AP classes are table stakes, drug use bad, video games/tv limited, more likely to have intact households, expected to be polite/treat others respectfully) while lower class kids are more likely to have the types of behaviors and attitudes you'd like your kids to avoid (e.g. no point in applying yourself, parents have no idea what you're up to or how you're doing in school anyway, drug use normal or cool, kids raised by tv/computer/phone, family tree is more of a chain with random links sticking out, family yells at each other so loud the neighbors hear it). It's an attempt to manipulate the Overton window that your kid will encounter interacting with peers.
- lotsofpulp 2y ago
  A related adage to present this succinctly, "you are the company you keep".
- forgetfreeman 2y ago
  100% of the individuals that I've known who ended up either shot dead in the street or caught serious charges were from upper middle class, outright wealthy neighborhoods, or were keeping company with rich kids. Maybe my sample is badly skewed but around these parts all the wealthy are known for is buying their lunatic children out of trouble.
  - lotsofpulp 2y ago
    https://opportunityatlas.org https://opportunityatlas.org
  - GodEmperorElon 2y ago
    [dead]
- nicolas_t 2y ago
  In my experience, the positive attributes you list tend to be more associated with middle class than upper classes. At a certain amount of wealth, you can see very problematic behaviour.
gnkyfrg 2y ago
This is the kind of contemptuous skepticism of facts from, and lack of trust for, folks trying to help you understand something that permeates neglected communities and interferes with the educational process. That attitude is prevalent in poor schools, but rare in rich schools and is properly dealt with by better educators that prefer wealthy schools with good salaries. That sort of antagonism toward authority is incredibly disruptive in a community of People who want to achieve something. Parents want to get their kids away from it for a reason. It's unhealthy. You're an example of the point. I don't mean any offense by it, just that it's easy to sniff out that you haven't experienced both sides of the coin so you reveal stubborn ignorance. It inhibits learning and communicating. It's repulsive.
- forgetfreeman 2y ago
  > just that it's easy to sniff out that you haven't experienced both sides of the coin so you reveal stubborn ignorance. You're welcome to that narrative if you find it comforting. It's wildly incorrect however. Half of my family self-identify as semi-literate rednecks. The other half are members of the most prestigious country club in the state they reside in and the least successful of them was a V level executive at a multinational bank. I've cherry-picked the best of both worlds and have done just fine for myself without having to resort to any of the soulless pantomime you're advocating here, which does more to maintain property values in exclusive neighborhoods and feed a certain class of individual's sense of self-worth than anything objective. Water finds it's level I suppose.

throwaway2037 2y ago

> Property taxes pay for schools. I know this is true for the US. The vast majority of public school budgets are paid from local property taxes. This gives wealthy communities a significant advantage. Princeton, New Jersey is famous for its high property taxes and excellent public schools. Are there any other countries that use a local-tax funding model for public schools? Most other nations that I know use a national funding model.

Mountain_Skies 2y ago
Baltimore is famous for its high per student funding of public schools ($21,000 per student in 2023). It's also famous for the terrible outcomes of its public school students.
- BeefWellington 2y ago
  Yeah but how is that funding actually applied? You could throw an extreme amount of money at schools but require it be spent on specific initiatives. Things like resource officers, hiring someone with specific qualifications, and boatloads of staff training. You can average that out to a per student basis and say "look we're spending so much on education" but if the money is going to train teachers how to deal with crisis situations like school shooters, it's not really being spent on educating the student. How that money actually gets allocated matters.
- jkolio 2y ago
  This is a common misconception. The high per capita funding is partially due to required emergency funding of repairs resulting from deferred maintenance - both in the literal sense, and in reference to the hollowing out of the city's industry and, therefore, capacity for stable community and family life. Baltimore is a Rust Belt city smack dab in the middle of a region that happily moved on to the service economy; poorer Baltimore residents are surrounded by people who can bid up the rates of goods in the area (and they do). Other jurisdictions don't have to put so much into student funding directly.
  - 2y ago