7 ms·

I don't think all applications will work cross dock.. Some sure, all no. And in regards to housing the GPU inside dock, thats exactly what I was thinking. I

by Casc 14y ago

I don't think all applications will work cross dock.. Some sure, all no. And in regards to housing the GPU inside dock, thats exactly what I was thinking. I believe you may have missed: "Once docked, a smartphone can unlock additional cores that would otherwise consume too much power, activate a more powerful GPU, possibly one even housed in the docking station itself..."

jiggy2011 14y ago
I missed the part about the docking station and assumed you meant inside the phone, sorry. Once you have put the GPU inside the docking station though, people will start to say "hmm, why not put a faster CPU in there too" "oh, and a bigger SSD so we can cache more stuff" at which point the phone starts to become redundant. As with all of these things , I imagine it will be cyclical.
- Casc 14y ago
  Sure, I would think of the phone as your identity... your data, your apps, your storage... That's what makes the difference. Further, I don't forsee all applications working cross dock.. Some sure, all no. RE your earlier point on the workplace - The smartphone could always act as a key/SSO type device, and you can only access certain information when docked in a certain environment, within a VPN, etc. Basically this thing becomes your identity.. if you lose it, yep you're SOL. Thank god for remote wipe? With hardware becoming cheaper as you say, and cloud storage, get a new one, sync and go on your way. I agree with your point on redundancy until you want an ipod/camera/phone/mobile apps... You're already carrying it around... why not make laptops/desktops/tablets a hollow extension of the computer in your pocket? I don't think it's about the hardware as much as the interactive storage, the effort that goes into maintaining your data, apps, life... the things iCloud and dropbox try to solve, and while they can still serve their purpose aren't quite right in terms of a truly portable lifestyle.
  - jiggy2011 14y ago
    It really depends how much of storage/apps are moved to the cloud. The way I imagine it evolving is more that the local storage on client side devices is used as a cache for commonly used files + code and the apps and files themselves live in the "cloud", so with a fast enough internet connection using a standalone device is indistinguishable from docking your phone. Now that cloud may be a generic cloud like dropbox/aws etc or it may be something specific that is hosted and run by the workplace. The issue with having a completely dumb clamshell is that the screen and keyboard will be worth more than the computing hardware. Let's say the clamshell costs $250 without any brains but basic brains can be added for an extra $30 or so. There is actually a lot of utility in having independant brains on the laptop. For example if I got out with my phone , I can give the laptop to someone else to use. Or what if I want to use my phone at the same time as I want to use the laptop? In this case you will be stretching the hardware to run 2 displays at once (with different apps, as well as having 2 complete UI systems loaded into memory) as well as the physical docking being an issue. For example what if I am talking on my phone and I want to walk to the other side of the room without dragging the laptop along or undocking it? Having everything dependent on a small , easily lose able device is a biggie too. Replacing your phone is likely to be expensive (since it has a display etc) and essentially losing access to computing because you are too broke to replace your phone until your next payday is a big issue.
    - Casc 14y ago
      I see where you're coming from. I agree it definitely depends on how much moves to the cloud, could something like this have the potential to affect that? If pulled off correctly, I'd think so. I'm not convinced the cloud is the place for everything. In terms of phone... bluetooth headset paired to docking station! Yea losing the phone comes at quite a price, I agree. Personally, I'd pay for it. C'mon, you can't pretend this thing wouldn't be bad ass if it was pulled off properly.
      - jiggy2011 14y ago
        The lowest friction solution always has a big advantage. Under your solution I have to take a dumb laptop , a smartphone and a bluetooth headset with me everywhere and hook them all up together whenever I want to sit down and do something, bluetooth headsets are particularly cumbersome compared to putting a phone to your ear, not to mention that they make a lot of people feel dumb to wear. A "cloud" solution that is fast and smooth enough will replicate the functionality of having one "mega device" without the drawbacks. I actually think that the cloud will become the place for everything for a conceptual point of view. If you are concerned about privacy etc it will be possible to run your own personal cloud out of a tiny PC in the corner of your home. Some concessions will have to be made for offline use of course (which I guess will become increasingly rare). Really though it makes more sense to think of your devices as an extension of your "cloud" rather than the other way around.
- jerf 14y ago
  The driving force here is that the phone does need to be capable of being an independent computing unit, so that tends to force things onto the phone. A new GPU and CPU etc may be nice, but for most people won't be necessary, and I suspect your average clamshell simply won't have it. I think the general case will be dumb clamshell with nothing but peripherals, USB ports, and a battery. The alternative is significantly more expensive, yet brings the average user no benefit. (Possibly negative if its less reliable.) A clamshell that does have everything in it will simply be a laptop, and laptops will continue to outclass phones in raw performance for a good long time. (The presence of additional, usable volume will continue to be an advantage for a good long time yet, and by volume I mean literally three-dimensional space.)
  - jiggy2011 14y ago
    I don't think it would be much more expensive, considering the raspberry pi project managed to make a complete computer for $25. I guess we will see both options and the market will sort it out, it's basically a case between having one "do it all" system vs 2 specialized systems. Historically though, things such as laptop docking stations and laptops with detachable tablets have never really taken off and I imagine this could be a case of the same.
    - jerf 14y ago
      When consumers are aggressively searching for the lowest price, and in general lack the sophistication to tell what the performance is, you generally end up in a situation where even a buck or two can be the difference between a product that sells and doesn't. Sometimes the sophisticated option can be squeezed right out when the masses can't tell the difference... ask me how I feel about the inability to buy anything but TFT screens in a laptop sometime.
      - jiggy2011 14y ago
        That is true, people often have crappy taste when it comes to quality (or just low budgets). However I think there is a big difference between buying "a laptop" and "a laptop that doesn't do anything unless you plug a phone into it".
- Simucal 14y ago
  To me, the phones primary purpose in this scenario is to maintain state. I can be working at home and instantly sleep my "phone-computer", slip it in my pocket and then resume right where I left off when I arrive at work by re-docking it.
  - Casc 14y ago
    You got it. And enjoy some media / regular mobile experience in the interim.
  - dmragone 14y ago
    Exactly! Even now I'm annoyed that I have to type on my iPhone keyboard when I'm sitting at my computer and someone sends me a text. Would infinitely prefer that when I'm in proximity of my computer and logged in that the phone functionality was available in the computer's OS and on screen. And then being able to get up and carry what I was doing on my computer wherever I go would be the next step.
    - jiggy2011 14y ago
      Wouldn't it be simple enough to write an app for your phone that would check if it was connected to your "home" wifi and then upload incoming sms messages to your desktop/laptop. The phone app could wait for you to type a reply on your PC which is then sent back to the phone and then the phone would send it. I'd be amazed if something like this does not exist.
      - MartinodF 14y ago
        AirDroid is a pretty good start: https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.sand.airdroid https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.sand.airdr.... It lets you manage most of the phone functionality from your desktop.
      - vidarh 14y ago
        But that only solves a narrow sliver of what he wanted.

by Casc 14y ago

jiggy2011 14y ago

I missed the part about the docking station and assumed you meant inside the phone, sorry. Once you have put the GPU inside the docking station though, people will start to say "hmm, why not put a faster CPU in there too" "oh, and a bigger SSD so we can cache more stuff" at which point the phone starts to become redundant. As with all of these things , I imagine it will be cyclical.

Casc 14y ago
Sure, I would think of the phone as your identity... your data, your apps, your storage... That's what makes the difference. Further, I don't forsee all applications working cross dock.. Some sure, all no. RE your earlier point on the workplace - The smartphone could always act as a key/SSO type device, and you can only access certain information when docked in a certain environment, within a VPN, etc. Basically this thing becomes your identity.. if you lose it, yep you're SOL. Thank god for remote wipe? With hardware becoming cheaper as you say, and cloud storage, get a new one, sync and go on your way. I agree with your point on redundancy until you want an ipod/camera/phone/mobile apps... You're already carrying it around... why not make laptops/desktops/tablets a hollow extension of the computer in your pocket? I don't think it's about the hardware as much as the interactive storage, the effort that goes into maintaining your data, apps, life... the things iCloud and dropbox try to solve, and while they can still serve their purpose aren't quite right in terms of a truly portable lifestyle.
- jiggy2011 14y ago
  It really depends how much of storage/apps are moved to the cloud. The way I imagine it evolving is more that the local storage on client side devices is used as a cache for commonly used files + code and the apps and files themselves live in the "cloud", so with a fast enough internet connection using a standalone device is indistinguishable from docking your phone. Now that cloud may be a generic cloud like dropbox/aws etc or it may be something specific that is hosted and run by the workplace. The issue with having a completely dumb clamshell is that the screen and keyboard will be worth more than the computing hardware. Let's say the clamshell costs $250 without any brains but basic brains can be added for an extra $30 or so. There is actually a lot of utility in having independant brains on the laptop. For example if I got out with my phone , I can give the laptop to someone else to use. Or what if I want to use my phone at the same time as I want to use the laptop? In this case you will be stretching the hardware to run 2 displays at once (with different apps, as well as having 2 complete UI systems loaded into memory) as well as the physical docking being an issue. For example what if I am talking on my phone and I want to walk to the other side of the room without dragging the laptop along or undocking it? Having everything dependent on a small , easily lose able device is a biggie too. Replacing your phone is likely to be expensive (since it has a display etc) and essentially losing access to computing because you are too broke to replace your phone until your next payday is a big issue.
  - Casc 14y ago
    I see where you're coming from. I agree it definitely depends on how much moves to the cloud, could something like this have the potential to affect that? If pulled off correctly, I'd think so. I'm not convinced the cloud is the place for everything. In terms of phone... bluetooth headset paired to docking station! Yea losing the phone comes at quite a price, I agree. Personally, I'd pay for it. C'mon, you can't pretend this thing wouldn't be bad ass if it was pulled off properly.
    - jiggy2011 14y ago
      The lowest friction solution always has a big advantage. Under your solution I have to take a dumb laptop , a smartphone and a bluetooth headset with me everywhere and hook them all up together whenever I want to sit down and do something, bluetooth headsets are particularly cumbersome compared to putting a phone to your ear, not to mention that they make a lot of people feel dumb to wear. A "cloud" solution that is fast and smooth enough will replicate the functionality of having one "mega device" without the drawbacks. I actually think that the cloud will become the place for everything for a conceptual point of view. If you are concerned about privacy etc it will be possible to run your own personal cloud out of a tiny PC in the corner of your home. Some concessions will have to be made for offline use of course (which I guess will become increasingly rare). Really though it makes more sense to think of your devices as an extension of your "cloud" rather than the other way around.
jerf 14y ago
The driving force here is that the phone does need to be capable of being an independent computing unit, so that tends to force things onto the phone. A new GPU and CPU etc may be nice, but for most people won't be necessary, and I suspect your average clamshell simply won't have it. I think the general case will be dumb clamshell with nothing but peripherals, USB ports, and a battery. The alternative is significantly more expensive, yet brings the average user no benefit. (Possibly negative if its less reliable.) A clamshell that does have everything in it will simply be a laptop, and laptops will continue to outclass phones in raw performance for a good long time. (The presence of additional, usable volume will continue to be an advantage for a good long time yet, and by volume I mean literally three-dimensional space.)
- jiggy2011 14y ago
  I don't think it would be much more expensive, considering the raspberry pi project managed to make a complete computer for $25. I guess we will see both options and the market will sort it out, it's basically a case between having one "do it all" system vs 2 specialized systems. Historically though, things such as laptop docking stations and laptops with detachable tablets have never really taken off and I imagine this could be a case of the same.
  - jerf 14y ago
    When consumers are aggressively searching for the lowest price, and in general lack the sophistication to tell what the performance is, you generally end up in a situation where even a buck or two can be the difference between a product that sells and doesn't. Sometimes the sophisticated option can be squeezed right out when the masses can't tell the difference... ask me how I feel about the inability to buy anything but TFT screens in a laptop sometime.
    - jiggy2011 14y ago
      That is true, people often have crappy taste when it comes to quality (or just low budgets). However I think there is a big difference between buying "a laptop" and "a laptop that doesn't do anything unless you plug a phone into it".
Simucal 14y ago
To me, the phones primary purpose in this scenario is to maintain state. I can be working at home and instantly sleep my "phone-computer", slip it in my pocket and then resume right where I left off when I arrive at work by re-docking it.
- Casc 14y ago
  You got it. And enjoy some media / regular mobile experience in the interim.
- dmragone 14y ago
  Exactly! Even now I'm annoyed that I have to type on my iPhone keyboard when I'm sitting at my computer and someone sends me a text. Would infinitely prefer that when I'm in proximity of my computer and logged in that the phone functionality was available in the computer's OS and on screen. And then being able to get up and carry what I was doing on my computer wherever I go would be the next step.
  - jiggy2011 14y ago
    Wouldn't it be simple enough to write an app for your phone that would check if it was connected to your "home" wifi and then upload incoming sms messages to your desktop/laptop. The phone app could wait for you to type a reply on your PC which is then sent back to the phone and then the phone would send it. I'd be amazed if something like this does not exist.
    - MartinodF 14y ago
      AirDroid is a pretty good start: https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.sand.airdroid https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.sand.airdr.... It lets you manage most of the phone functionality from your desktop.
    - vidarh 14y ago
      But that only solves a narrow sliver of what he wanted.