7 ms·

Damn, why get into this in the first place anyway? Seems like looking for trouble. I feel sorry for the guy but still, respect the beliefs of the people you are

Damn, why get into this in the first place anyway? Seems like looking for trouble. I feel sorry for the guy but still, respect the beliefs of the people you are living with.

going_north 2y ago
This kind of thinking is very dangerous.
- bilbo0s 2y ago
  All kinds of thinking are dangerous. If you want a lack of thought danger, I'm afraid you'd need a world filled with people who don't think at all. Consider, your kind of thinking is dangerous... to someone. (Probably millions of someones.) So is my kind of thinking. So is everyone else' kind of thinking.
mysterydip 2y ago
Wouldn't that result in zero change? We'd still have segregation or slavery, no women voting, etc.
- bilbo0s 2y ago
  Meh, even with change, in the future, we may still have segregation, or slavery, or no women voting. (Most probably, all three.) Change, simply "is". It's not "good" or "bad" in and of itself. We shouldn't be using it as the basis of an argument for or against some particular thing. We should, instead, argue the specific merits of that particular thing. Killing people for thought crime is "bad", in my opinion, because the person may not have intended to commit any crime. He might have said, "John should not have torn pages from the quran." And at the same time had no intention of an angry mob descending on John's home to burn John and his family to death. But for a lot of crimes, in the legal codes of many places, it's not necessary to prove "intent".
pavel_lishin 2y ago
[flagged]
pipes 2y ago
You mean because he belongs to a minority group he should respect the majority belief? Does this always hold true, no matter what the majority believes? Does a death sentence for disrespecting seem like a fair punishment?
- AnimalMuppet 2y ago
  Let's talk "should" and "is". Should: Society should respect those with different beliefs. Religions should spread by converting their opponents, not by killing them. Is: He lives in a country that executes people for blasphemy. Regardless of any "shoulds", that is the reality of the country he lives in. There's a place for saying, on the one hand, that his country shouldn't be like that, and on the other hand, that there's a place for being wise about the environment you live in.
  - lucianbr 2y ago
    Is this supposed to be an argument why he "should" have kept his keyboard shut? Because it does not seem coherent.
    - AnimalMuppet 2y ago
      All right, let me try saying this in a different way. Morally, Pakistan is wrong here. Pakistan should change. Practically, you live in the environment (including social and political) you live in, and you usually can't change it much except at the margins. If you act like you live in a different environment, that usually bites you in one way or another. Consider a different situation. Let's say I walk through a bad part of town with $100 bills visibly hanging out of my pocket. I get mugged. The muggers are morally (and legally) wrong for mugging me. But in a world where muggers exist in the bad part of town, that wasn't very smart of me. Most people only talk about one aspect of this and ignore the other. They focus on the moral "should" (Pakistan should allow freedom of thought, muggers should stop attacking people), or else they focus on the practical wisdom (don't post stuff that's going to get you in trouble, don't walk down the street with visible money on you). Both are simultaneously true. Pakistan is morally wrong. They should change. And if you live there, things currently are the way they are, and if you ignore that, you will run into problems.
th0masfrancis 2y ago
Seems like majority opinion is against your post OP. Guess it is your turn to go to court
mangamadaiyan 2y ago
Belief doesn't merit respect, action does. If certain beliefs result in the believers thereof taking action that is unfair to (a set of) humans - whether that be slavery, witch trials, demolition of places of worship, pogroms, aerial bombardment of a hospital, or what have you - those beliefs do not deserve respect.
deleted 2y ago
[deleted]

Damn, why get into this in the first place anyway? Seems like looking for trouble. I feel sorry for the guy but still, respect the beliefs of the people you are living with.

going_north 2y ago

This kind of thinking is very dangerous.

bilbo0s 2y ago
All kinds of thinking are dangerous. If you want a lack of thought danger, I'm afraid you'd need a world filled with people who don't think at all. Consider, your kind of thinking is dangerous... to someone. (Probably millions of someones.) So is my kind of thinking. So is everyone else' kind of thinking.

mysterydip 2y ago

Wouldn't that result in zero change? We'd still have segregation or slavery, no women voting, etc.

bilbo0s 2y ago
Meh, even with change, in the future, we may still have segregation, or slavery, or no women voting. (Most probably, all three.) Change, simply "is". It's not "good" or "bad" in and of itself. We shouldn't be using it as the basis of an argument for or against some particular thing. We should, instead, argue the specific merits of that particular thing. Killing people for thought crime is "bad", in my opinion, because the person may not have intended to commit any crime. He might have said, "John should not have torn pages from the quran." And at the same time had no intention of an angry mob descending on John's home to burn John and his family to death. But for a lot of crimes, in the legal codes of many places, it's not necessary to prove "intent".

pavel_lishin 2y ago

[flagged]

pipes 2y ago

You mean because he belongs to a minority group he should respect the majority belief? Does this always hold true, no matter what the majority believes? Does a death sentence for disrespecting seem like a fair punishment?

AnimalMuppet 2y ago
Let's talk "should" and "is". Should: Society should respect those with different beliefs. Religions should spread by converting their opponents, not by killing them. Is: He lives in a country that executes people for blasphemy. Regardless of any "shoulds", that is the reality of the country he lives in. There's a place for saying, on the one hand, that his country shouldn't be like that, and on the other hand, that there's a place for being wise about the environment you live in.
- lucianbr 2y ago
  Is this supposed to be an argument why he "should" have kept his keyboard shut? Because it does not seem coherent.
  - AnimalMuppet 2y ago
    All right, let me try saying this in a different way. Morally, Pakistan is wrong here. Pakistan should change. Practically, you live in the environment (including social and political) you live in, and you usually can't change it much except at the margins. If you act like you live in a different environment, that usually bites you in one way or another. Consider a different situation. Let's say I walk through a bad part of town with $100 bills visibly hanging out of my pocket. I get mugged. The muggers are morally (and legally) wrong for mugging me. But in a world where muggers exist in the bad part of town, that wasn't very smart of me. Most people only talk about one aspect of this and ignore the other. They focus on the moral "should" (Pakistan should allow freedom of thought, muggers should stop attacking people), or else they focus on the practical wisdom (don't post stuff that's going to get you in trouble, don't walk down the street with visible money on you). Both are simultaneously true. Pakistan is morally wrong. They should change. And if you live there, things currently are the way they are, and if you ignore that, you will run into problems.

th0masfrancis 2y ago

Seems like majority opinion is against your post OP. Guess it is your turn to go to court

mangamadaiyan 2y ago

Belief doesn't merit respect, action does. If certain beliefs result in the believers thereof taking action that is unfair to (a set of) humans - whether that be slavery, witch trials, demolition of places of worship, pogroms, aerial bombardment of a hospital, or what have you - those beliefs do not deserve respect.

deleted 2y ago

[deleted]