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Electric Cars Are Suddenly Becoming Affordable
- nehagup 2y agoThey aren't suddenly becoming affordable. They have been gradually becoming affordable over the last decade due to lower supply chain costs and higher demand.
- gjsman-1000 2y ago$40K, "affordable," shows what a bubble NYTimes is living in. Let's remember that the median income in the US is $37,585. Half of people make less. Don't spend more than you make in a year on a new vehicle.
- legitster 2y agoMedian income is not an accurate measure of affordability. That includes every person who isn't working - stay at home moms, retirees, etc. The federal reserve's calculation of household income is probably more useful at $74k: https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/MEHOINUSA672N https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/MEHOINUSA672N And I have never paid more than $5k for a car personally, but the average new car in America is ~$47k so $40k is not actually out of alignment with what most people are buying.
- JohnFen 2y agoMost people don't buy new cars (in the US, anyway, twice as many used cars than new are sold.)
- zht 2y agokind of goes against having Ford F-150 be the highest selling vehicle in the US
- timbo1642 2y agoNo, its not even close. They claim the whole "F" group is the best selling, not the F150 alone. With that said, the Tesla Y and 3 are the best selling cars in the US. Please check your 5 year old info before posting.
- 83 2y agoFwiw I can't find any data to back up your claim. Looks like in 2023 numerous models outsold Tesla Y and 3 (CRV/Rav4/Ram/Silverado). While Ford doesn't seem to release individual F-150/250/350/450 data, given the huge lead I'd bet the F-150 would still beat model Y even if split out.
- bdcravens 2y agoThe average new car in the US is $48k. https://www.caranddriver.com/news/a43611570/average-new-car-price-down-still-high/ https://www.caranddriver.com/news/a43611570/average-new-car-... You are correct that people shouldn't spend so much on new cars, but the status quo is that they are. Reporting on prices isn't a bubble as much as just a statement of what's going on.
- maxsilver 2y ago> $40K, "affordable," shows what a bubble NYTimes is living in. Did we read the same article? NYTimes is claiming that "$20k" (or rather, $20k after up to $7500 in federal rebates) is affordable. Which, it kind of is? That's a brand new fully electric for like $400/month. And we're seeing it in the used market as well. (2019/2020 Chevy Bolts are now going for like $15k or ~$350/month which puts them well into affordability for people around a $40k/yr income.
- Arnt 2y agoThe average purchase price in the US in the recent years is >$40k, and you're saying that $40k is not affordable. Yours is not a majority opinion.
- tomcar288 2y agoabsolutely. the standard of living is in decline: there are now fewer new cars sold per capita than decades past.
- hedora 2y agoFrom the article: > Recently, Mr. Lawrence said, customers have been snapping up used Teslas for a little over $20,000, after applying a $4,000 federal tax credit. ... > Carmakers including Tesla, Ford, General Motors and Stellantis, the owner of Jeep, have announced plans for electric vehicles that would sell new for as little as $25,000.
- slayerjain 2y agoBecause the EV industry has reached a new maturation stage in which companies lower prices to capture market share.
- slayerjain 2y agoOnly because they know Chinese EV will take 100% of the market if they do not come up with cheaper EV.
- dragontamer 2y agoThe opposite. Chinese EVs are dumping because China's economy is collapsing, forcing them to dump prices because there's not enough Chinese demand. China is now exporting all of their excess inventory to Europe and beginning to make plans to export all this inventory to the USA. And USA is rejecting it. China has overbuilt their EV market, and continues to over-invest and builld too many EVs. USA is already pissed off at this turn of events, and European politics are beginning to grow more protective as they are also seeing this ridiculous amount of inventories come over to their countries. China bet too much on exports and has begun to piss off everyone else.
- toomuchtodo 2y agoChina's economy isn't collapsing, but it is contracting, and it is simply smart economic policy to stoke production vs unnecessary consumer demand domestically. Global light vehicle market is almost 90 million units/pa. Ship every unit you can to every market that will accept those units (Tesla does this today, recalibrating exports as demand and incentives change; China built units are currently being offloaded in Canada due to demand sag). Of course you're going to have less sophisticated economies (who did not prioritize rapid investment in building EV manufacturing capacity up) upset you made prudent supply chain and manufacturing investments while they allowed their domestic concerns focus instead on profits (see: near term historical developed automaker share buyback volumes). If the US and Europe close their markets to Chinese EVs, Chinese EVs will consume any overseas TAM US and Europe automakers had a chance at (Mexico, Central and South America, parts of Asia and Africa, etc). Global factory to the world being the factory to the world and the unsophisticated are all surprised pikachu. US economy is only ~18M units/pa, Europe ~10.5M units/pa, the rest of the world (~60M units/pa) is for the taking under strong trade protectionism regimes. This ignores the potential global TAM increase due to lower cost EVs inducing previously unaccounted for demand.
- keploy 2y agoThey should really define "affordable".
- bdcravens 2y agoProbably based on averages compared to other new cars/trucks. Average new vehicle price is $48k, but that's of course skewed by very high priced vehicles like pickups.
- panda888888 2y agoIt depends on where you live. Where I live on the west coast, you can find lots of used Nissan Leafs on craigslist for less than 6-7k. That's actually affordable. And there are some for under 4k, junk car territory. Granted, they're 10+ year old cars and can only go ~50 miles on a charge (originally 80 miles but the battery degrades). But if you want a cheap car and live in a city or a close suburb, especially if you can charge your car at work, it's a doable option. These fully electric cars require less maintenance so they actually are cheap to run.
- nicodemus26 2y agohttps://archive.ph/SDOIP https://archive.ph/SDOIP
- slackfan 2y agoAbout as affordable as living in new york. Reminder that your taxes pay for the subsidies that make the prices on EVs even anywhere near that "affordable" range.
- rini17 2y agoReminder that oil is heavily subsidised too.
- slackfan 2y agoSo is medicine, so is air travel, so is farming...
- rini17 2y agoSure, everyone loves 1. to have stabilized supply and prices 2. be the first to ramp up the production of new tech and reap benefits of scale 3. to complain about taxes used as above :)
- Detrytus 2y agoMaybe that's the US thing? In my country I'm not aware of any subsidies towards oil companies, on the contrary, more than a half of retail gas price is taxes.
- bdcravens 2y agoMany EVs don't qualify for subsidies (for example, Hyundai/Kia EVs that are financed, and not leased).
- _fat_santa 2y agoThey might be more affordable now but accessibility I think is still low because of charging infrastructure. I live around a bunch of apartment complexes, probably 1,200 units between 3-4 properties, and none of them have charges available. I always say the issue is not getting homeowners to adopt electric cars because they largely have garage spaces where they can install chargers, the issue will be getting adoption to folks living in apartments and other places where you cant just install a charger. How will those folks charge their cars?
- IneffablePigeon 2y agoI own an electric car and no home charger. I charge at work, mostly. It works well for me. The solution will involve a range of options for a range of circumstances- what I do wouldn’t work for everyone but that’s ok.
- jarbus 2y agoWhat would you do if you had to change jobs to a company that didn’t have a charger?
- jjtheblunt 2y agoi've driven electric (bmw) since 2014; charging at home at 120v overnight was always adequate if driving less than about 70 miles the following day. if i had to drive more, an hour on a 240v L2 charger would cover it. there's a HUGE amount of fear-uncertainty-doubt in the news which looks conspicuously like propaganda, and one can guess where it originates. it sure doesn't originate in those of us nerds who are 10 years into pure electric, and absolutely not for those with 240v at home. btw in just shy of 80,000 miles, the maintenance costs on the first ev was all of about 200 dollars, and that's a bmw. had to buy tires too, so not counting that, since everyone buys tires.
- jarbus 2y agoThe question was aimed at a person with no charger at home who relied on a charger at work. I don’t have a home to charge at and don’t want to risk relying on a company
- gtmitchell 2y agoI’m reading this more like “New York Times reporter discovers used electric vehicles exist, cost less than new ones.” Used EVs have been affordable for years. In fact, cars like the Nissan Leaf have depreciated so quickly that they’re a downright bargain (as long as your use case lines up with the limited range).
- hedora 2y agoYou have to be careful with used Leaf's. The ones close to $10K usually need a new (unavailable) battery. Initially, they shipped them without charge / active battery temperature management, so the old ones ate batteries. This isn't true of newer Leafs. You can easily find a decent used one closer to $20K.
- steelframe 2y agoI'm aware that car prices are falling across the board, but I see EVs being hit harder than ICEs. I've heard from some local dealerships I visited recently that new EVs are sitting on the lot for longer too. My I-PACE cost me over $80k when it was a one-of-a-kind vehicle, an EV from a mature car manufacturer with a luxury interior, sporty performance, hatchback, AWD, and heat pump. It won the 2019 World Car of the Year award (https://www.worldcarawards.com/web/2019_results.asp https://www.worldcarawards.com/web/2019_results.asp). It can easily make it the 150 miles from Seattle to Yakima over the PNW Cascade mountain pass in driving snow without needing to stop to charge. It was a bit of a stretch for me to spend that much on a car, but to me it was -- and still is -- a great car. It wasn't too long before some other EVs with similar characteristics entered the marketplace, and at lower prices. Probably the biggest differences include slightly more splashy range on the spec sheet, although I would argue Jaguar is being more conservative than they really need to be with their advertised specs, and a faster charge rate. In other words, the newer EVs can get from point A to point B with less time spent at the rapid chargers. Therefore my I-PACE's auction value is almost down to $20k, in spite of being low mileage and in excellent condition. I still get as much range out of it as I did the day I bought it. There are a few reasons for the precipitous price drop, but I suspect the overriding one is that nobody wants an EV that charges at 80kW. Personally I use my gas car when doing road trips that would otherwise require a rapid charging stop, and I exclusively charge the I-PACE overnight in my garage. So I guess it's still worth a heck of a lot more than $20k to me, which is why I don't think I'll part ways with it until something really expensive breaks on it. Meanwhile those who have EVs that don't use Tesla's supercharger network are stuck with the likes of Electrify America when they're road tripping. In that case I'm not sure your overall experience is going to be all that better whether your car is capable of pulling 80kW or 150kW at 35% SoC. I imagine people in 6-figure Taycans capable of pulling 270kW sitting in the same line as the $15k used Bolts capable of pulling 50kW for one of only 2 functioning chargers at an Electrify America site in a rural Walmart parking lot to open up, and then the charger ends up only being able to put out 100kW if you're lucky. The charging capabilities of your EV don't mean much if you can't take advantage of them. Maybe the "unwashed masses" are starting to hear about the horror show that non-Tesla charging networks are as non-enthusiasts are suckered into buying one off the lot without the dealership being completely forthright with them about the true state of things, and that's being reflected in the relative price of used EVs.
- black_13 2y ago[dead]