PHP offers a lot of things that other languages provide trough the means of a framework. So I don't think it is unfair to compare it to a framework. The use of

PHP offers a lot of things that other languages provide trough the means of a framework. So I don't think it is unfair to compare it to a framework. The use of frameworks seems to be condoned. On my search for a template engine I passed by many articles of PHP developers saying they were unnecessary as PHP would provide all you could need. Flask doesn't do much. But that's exactly the point. Even though it's so simple it offers enough to write an application that shouldn't have to hide because it's amateurish. > From the rest of the post, it seems like the problem isn't that PHP is bad, but that you don't know (even remotely) how to write good PHP. That may be true. But it could also be true that writing good PHP requires far more skill and time. Skill I might not have. But I'm not someone blindly following tutorials or someone who tries to whip out a lousy program as fast as possible. Nor do I think PHP is a bad language is such. But I had a hard time.