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Walls are starting to close in for Tesla, let's have a closer look

• leesec 2y ago
  [flagged]
  • intunderflow 2y ago
    Why do you think Elon Musk is the greatest technologist of our time?
    • trgn 2y ago
      Electric cars, space rockets, brain implants, super speed tunnels, ... They're all united by his infatuation for capital T technology, for its own sake. He's been succesful in carving out markets for their application. If SpaceX launches just becomes backround noise 100 years from now, I wouldn't be suprised if Musk will be mentioned in the same breath as Ford today.
    • Arnt 2y ago
      Well, he might well be. But it hardly seems to matter. If Tesla falls apart it won't be because of his insufficient insight into technology, or anything like that. Angering core buyership, firing an entire important team, such things may matter much and have little to do with technology.
  • mepian 2y ago
    Is this sarcasm?
    • taylodl 2y ago
      Right? I get downvoted every time I utter something about Musk having the remotest whiff of negativity!
  • notaustinpowers 2y ago
    You know he's not actually coding the software, designing the cars, or the battery tech, or the rocket trajectories, right? He's a CEO, he's a glorified mid-level manager. The real greatest technologists here are the engineers that have to put up with him. Maybe he should listen to them and we wouldn't have cars that actively tried to drive us into trains! https://qz.com/tesla-full-self-driving-train-1851489554 https://qz.com/tesla-full-self-driving-train-1851489554
    • deleted 2y ago
      [deleted]
  • 0cf8612b2e1e 2y ago
    You can have a rational discussion about a company without it being an attack on the CEO. In absolute numbers, Tesla is underperforming relative to previously. It is worth examining why and understanding if this is a blip or an accelerating trend.
• jonahbenton 2y ago
  Brilliant assembly.
• more_corn 2y ago
  Huh, it’s almost like having a CEO who doesn’t give two shits about public perception, proper behavior, truth, consideration, or loyalty is starting to catch up to them.
  • ceejayoz 2y ago
    A very part-time CEO, no less.
  • WaxProlix 2y ago
    It's not unreasonable to think that those things just don't matter, because for the lifetime of Tesla up until now they kind of didn't. That change is what's just as interesting to me.
  • readthenotes1 2y ago
    It is only the first Quality you mention that seems to matter (managing public perception). The rest of those qualities seem to be fairly widespread.
  • s1mon 2y ago
    Yep. For a long time I assumed my next car would be a Tesla. Seeing how he's destroying Twitter, gutting teams at Tesla, sharing his paranoid delusions, his crazy politics and his beliefs in conspiracy theories - I just can't see supporting him by buying a Tesla. The minute the board removes him, I would gladly reconsider.
    • knodi123 2y ago
      anecdotal, but me too, and several other people I know
• danso 2y ago
  > 29) Not only has Tesla not made any regulatory actions to start robotaxis, but the FSD software continues to pull outright dangerous moves that show it is nowhere near ready and perhaps never will due to hardware limitations. Also if Tesla really was ready to unveil a major robotaxi service, wouldn’t there have been a lot of new hiring, e.g. humans for remote monitoring and servicing, like how Waymo has operators ready to take over when their taxis go awry?
• whoisjuan 2y ago
  I own a Model 3, and I honestly think it is the best car I have ever owned. Despite that, I know people who have ruled out owning a Tesla because they believe the brand mirrors Elon Musk's public persona. They flat-out reject any Tesla product because the brand's visible face is someone they believe doesn't represent their values. I'm unsure he understood the implications of becoming such a polarizing figure. It was totally unnecessary, yet that was his choice.
  • phasnox 2y ago
    Counterpoint: It was 100% necessary. Telling the truth always is.
    • Jgrubb 2y ago
      Which truth are you referring to?
    • WheatMillington 2y ago
      Elon Musk is not famous for honesty.
    • hehdhdjehehegwv 2y ago
      So the "truth" would be his primary base of personal wealth is utterly derived from selling cars to...checking notes...the worst people in the country who deserve to be bullied and ridiculed? And that he has no choice but to educate the world about this truth? Even if it means destroying his personal reputation and businesses? Or - and this is amply documented now - perhaps the "truth" is he's doing way too many drugs (WSJ), making horrible decisions (Supercharger), and per the deeply persuasive data in the linked thread, is killing the company? Like, huh? What?
  • 0cf8612b2e1e 2y ago
    "Republicans buy sneakers, too" It does not take much business acumen that taking a political stance is going to anger someone. Best keep your mouth shut unless you are prepared for the consequences. I doubt Elon’s personal views are much different from any other billionaire CEO. Yet the majority of them are not in the spotlight and drawing attention to themselves.
• bsder 2y ago
  > 35) When you dig deeper there's a range of other peculiarities at Tesla. Unlike every other S&P/OEM company, Tesla uses its own ERP system (vs Microsoft, SAP, Oracle etc) called WARP - which when you consider the accounting / governance issues is worrying erpresearch.com/knowledge/whic… Out of all the things you could pick on, this actually makes Tesla look good. The "standard" ERP systems are steaming dogshit. They are terrible. They make everybody miserable. And they don't do a damn thing to prevent accounting fraud. Every company I have worked for who had their own ERP system thought it was terrible ... and then SAP/Oracle came in and everybody realized that things somehow got so much worse.
  • fmobus 2y ago
    Item 35 though
• hn_throwaway_99 2y ago
  Honestly, Musk's recent moves have me thinking less of "eccentric billionaire who I find annoying AF" to "this man is becoming completely unhinged". The firing of all of the Supercharger team, in what essentially sounded like a fit of rage/spite, is so far outside the norm of what a rational person would do, even if they did think Tesla needed to make a lot of cuts. More importantly, basically all of the current scary state of Tesla can easily be laid at Musk's feet. All EV companies are struggling with reduced demand, but these decisions by Musk were obvious own goals: 1. Most importantly, Musk's incessant bad-mouthing of his biggest customers. Who does he think buys EVs more than anyone else? It's generally the "left coast chardonnay-sipping elite" that he craps on at every turn. 2. It was Musk's decision to handicap self-driving by demanding 100% reliance on cameras only. 3. Cybertruck is going to be/continue to be a disaster for Tesla. The ultimate "boy genius" plaything, Tesla could have easily doubled down on making an affordable truck or SUV but instead went for stainless steel-clad Aztec. 4. The supercharger network was Tesla's crown jewel. I've owned a couple other EVs and the other networks are (at least as of now) dismal compared to the supercharger network. And Musk just canned everyone.
• hn_throwaway_99 2y ago
  To somewhat counter my other comment about Musk, I've seen this statistic a lot but it feels like total bullshit to me: > There's only so far price cuts will go. Tesla has one of the oldest lineup among automakers - with the average age of its models at 9 years (ex-Cybertruck) - Where is the innovation to spur more demand? Tesla famously doesn't release new models by "model years" but just updates them continuously. Putting the Model S release date at June 2011 (despite that vehicle being a very different car from today's Model S), and saying that is somehow comparable to the age of other carmakers' model fleets is totally disingenuous IMO.
  • readthenotes1 2y ago
    It also is kind of laughable because what matters is how it relates to the competition. Outside of china, a lot of the competition seems to be in trouble or quitting the full EV market.
    • ceruleanseas 2y ago
      Hyundai offers better specs at a cheaper price.
  • ceruleanseas 2y ago
    Teslas on the road today all look like they have a stale design compared to new offerings from other manufacturers. I think it’s a fair point even if they are continuously updating the internals.
    • wstrange 2y ago
      The Porsche 911 design goes back to the 1960s. Do you really need to change the body design if you can keep upgrading the internals?
      • rangerelf 2y ago
        Yes, not all customers buy into the original [external] design. Personally I think it's a low-rent imitation of Mazda, so a refresh would have been nice. For all the "but the insides have been upgraded/revamped!!" messaging, it's just confirming that they're too cheap to improve, or just change, the outside.
• wstrange 2y ago
  Tesla needs a new board and a new CEO. Offer Tim Cook double what he is making at Apple (an obscene amount of money, but a bargain compared to Musk). Tesla needs someone like Cook. Someone who knows supply chain management and customer service. Someone who is sane and won't alienate potential customers. [Disclaimer: I own a Model 3. Fantastic car]
  • mrdude42 2y ago
    If Musk wasn't CEO of Tesla, it would turn into Rivian.
    • gwbas1c 2y ago
      Why the downvotes? Vivian, looks like it's run by adults.
    • JojoFatsani 2y ago
      Which would be great.
  • nebula8804 2y ago
    I don't see Tim Cook taking that job given he had a long personal connection to Steve Jobs. He would probably spend the rest of his career working at Apple. Also Tim Cook has the ability to say no and said no he did: he canned the Apple car project because he understood the risks and the costs and decided its not worth it. If Cook were running Tesla he would likely have made the decision that one of the early activist investors tried to push: license the battery and motor tech to other companies and don't get into car building. It took someone with a nearly religious conviction like Musk to get you that Model 3 that you love so much. Where a rational person says no that kind of a person keeps going, to hell with the consequences.
• deleted 2y ago
  [deleted]
• labrador 2y ago
  I don't blame Elon as much as I blame the responsible adults around him. No one appears to be setting any limits. My armchair psychoanalysts observation is that his son transistioning to a woman and his wife Grimes leaving him to date Chelsea Manning (transwoman) seemed to break him. But never mind that, the details of what breaks people don't matter. People have crisis. I assumed we've made progress since the days of Howard Hughes' madness. I'm surprised corporate boards and wise advisors would be able to get him some help and require it actually, since he has so many responibilities but has been blowing it with drug use and erratic behavior. Is he all alone in the world or is it that he won't listen to anyway while he self-destructs?
  • xenospn 2y ago
    I did not know about grimes and manning. Truth is stranger than fiction!
    • labrador 2y ago
      It's only my business because he lashed out at the trans activists on Twitter who were pretty powerful at shaping the conversation at the time. I believe he wanted to destroy their platfrom and that's why he said he'd buy it, then changed his mind and then was made to buy it. I miss the old Twitter but it is nice to be able to tweet knowing a twitter mob of trans allies won't try to character assasinate me for something I unwittingly said. So thanks Elon?
• mrdude42 2y ago
  I dunno. I've been using Full Self Driving v12.3 and it's gotten sooooo much better than v11. I used to rarely use FSD v11 but now I use v12.3 every day driving around town and on the highway. Looking forward to getting v12.4 in my car next week hopefully too.
  • jnericks 2y ago
    +1