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> Instead, Jaynes claims, these poems originated in the unconscious right hemisphere and were blindly recited by those who could not ignore the metered, schizop

> Instead, Jaynes claims, these poems originated in the unconscious right hemisphere and were blindly recited by those who could not ignore the metered, schizophrenic prose forced upon them by their bicameral mind. There is nothing 'unconscious' about creating a long epic. It takes conscious effort especially if you expect it to be coherent and enjoyable. Besides, is there a connection between schizophrenia and metered speech? Wouldn't a schizophrenic epic be unmetered?

sdwr 2y ago
I kinda buy it. If you go back to Freud, he describes how impulses and desires are repressed and sublimated while the mind is functioning normally. Tourette's is an example of the barrier between impulse and physical action being weakened. Schizophrenia can be seen as the weakening of the barrier between impulse and belief. Telling an epic story off-the-cuff requires weakening the barrier between your subconscious and speech Personally, I think it's more likely that there was a collection of oral stories passed down by healthy people, each illustrating a specific real-life lesson, that got collected by one guy and stitched together. In the same way modern showrunners borrow scenes and references. Like Achilles' heel is a warning against pride/arrogance, and the Cyclops and the sheep is a fun way to expose kids to possessive anger
- beezlewax 2y ago
  Freud "decided" a lot of things, and a lot of them are pure inventions of his fairly unique mind
- andoando 2y ago
  Why would you give me any credit to any of Freuds ideas? Im honestly astonished the guy has any kind of credibility.
  - bllguo 2y ago
    this is quite hyperbolic. he has too complicated a legacy to dismiss this easily. some of the concepts he pioneered include talk therapy, transference, significance of early childhood on psychological development, the influence of the unconscious on behavior - all of which we accept today
    - andoando 2y ago
      Was Freud really the first person to suggest talking to people about your problems can be therapeutic, or that the way you raise children affects them dramatically? As far as I am aware, the actual contents of the therapy he proposed, psychoanalysis, is complete bunk and no more effective than other forms of therapy. I have a whole gripe with the "unconscious", unless all we mean by it is "past events affect who you are and affect your behavior" in which case I cant imagine Freud is the first person to have believed this.

sdwr 2y ago

I kinda buy it. If you go back to Freud, he describes how impulses and desires are repressed and sublimated while the mind is functioning normally. Tourette's is an example of the barrier between impulse and physical action being weakened. Schizophrenia can be seen as the weakening of the barrier between impulse and belief. Telling an epic story off-the-cuff requires weakening the barrier between your subconscious and speech Personally, I think it's more likely that there was a collection of oral stories passed down by healthy people, each illustrating a specific real-life lesson, that got collected by one guy and stitched together. In the same way modern showrunners borrow scenes and references. Like Achilles' heel is a warning against pride/arrogance, and the Cyclops and the sheep is a fun way to expose kids to possessive anger

beezlewax 2y ago
Freud "decided" a lot of things, and a lot of them are pure inventions of his fairly unique mind
andoando 2y ago
Why would you give me any credit to any of Freuds ideas? Im honestly astonished the guy has any kind of credibility.
- bllguo 2y ago
  this is quite hyperbolic. he has too complicated a legacy to dismiss this easily. some of the concepts he pioneered include talk therapy, transference, significance of early childhood on psychological development, the influence of the unconscious on behavior - all of which we accept today
  - andoando 2y ago
    Was Freud really the first person to suggest talking to people about your problems can be therapeutic, or that the way you raise children affects them dramatically? As far as I am aware, the actual contents of the therapy he proposed, psychoanalysis, is complete bunk and no more effective than other forms of therapy. I have a whole gripe with the "unconscious", unless all we mean by it is "past events affect who you are and affect your behavior" in which case I cant imagine Freud is the first person to have believed this.