7 ms·

Tap water. I can't stop marveling at the fact that we have (mostly) unlimited, clean, drinkable water on demand and virtually for free. But also many other thi

by stncls 3y ago

Tap water. I can't stop marveling at the fact that we have (mostly) unlimited, clean, drinkable water on demand and virtually for free. But also many other things, many of which others have mentioned here (cars, mass housing, garbage collection, electronics). So much so that I feel frustration at the fact that in my job, I do not participate in human society making any of these fascinating things possible; and I have decided that my next career move will have to make me part of the supply chain of one such thing, even if I am just the tiniest of links.

mrmuagi 3y ago
Sewage is interesting too! Having to pump against elevation, making the water usable for other purposes, etc. [1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UpHOkHxpTvQ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UpHOkHxpTvQ
- voiper1 3y ago
  +1 for "Practical Engineering". He has an amazing series on making a new pump station called Practical Construction: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PdcXkmvXXwU&list=PLTZM4MrZKfW92oUPMnzgn__3yttXvWnEY https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PdcXkmvXXwU&list=PLTZM4MrZKf...
wouldbecouldbe 3y ago
Tap water is actually a re-invention. You're supposed to just be able to drink out of the river, but due to our own pollution and the lack of build up to diseases in the water we can't drink it directly anymore.
- perihelions 3y ago
  I prefer "disease-free water" to "water containing unpleasant pathogens that probably won't kill me, because I've already gotten sick from them many times and maintain natural immunity". Also, immunocompromised people deserve life too. Physically weak humans wouldn't survive in the natural-selection world that preceded civilization—the purpose of human civilization is escaping, nullifying, the brutal morality of the natural world and substituting our own. Clean water is a gift of life.
  - wouldbecouldbe 3y ago
    Animals are fine, and so are people who grow up drinking that. It probably strengthens certain parts of the immune system. The main reason we need to purify it is because of the stuff humans put in it.
    - wruza 3y ago
      How do you know that animals are fine?
      - Workaccount2 3y ago
        Because you only see the ones who are doing fine.
        marcosdumay 3y ago
        This. Animals in nature are incredibly healthy. You won't see any with even a deep cut.
        saghm 3y ago
        Isn't that because the ones who aren't healthy die? That sounds like saying we shouldn't bother having modern medicine because it causes us to have a lot more sick people. The problem is we wouldn't have a lot more healthy people that way; we'd have a lot more dead people.
        marcosdumay 3y ago
        That's exactly what the comment I was replying to said. An alternative explanation is that nature is some peaceful place where no animal ever gets hurt, for any reason... What would be a purely comedic exercise if people weren't believing this one all over the thread.
        wruza 3y ago
        It is. This subthread is clearly ironic.
- zild3d 3y ago
  Pretty much since we stopped being nomadic / developed more sedentary agricultural societies
- AlecSchueler 3y ago
  Going to the stream with a bucket is still a lot more effort than turning a tap. And don't forget the hot water that can also come out!
- adverbly 3y ago
  > due to our own pollution and the lack of build up to diseases in the water I'm not sure this is exactly correct. Modern people still need to boil water to safely drink it even if the water comes from a remote area which does not have any pollution or disease. You are right that it is a reinvention though because we used to do this regularly because we had antibodies and other things which could handle whatever was in the water in small quantities. Everything we have now is so pure that our immune and digestive systems can't handle anything that isn't pure anymore.
  - marcosdumay 3y ago
    > Everything we have now is so pure that our immune and digestive systems can't handle anything that isn't pure anymore. Ancient people were just ok with some risk of dying. We can probably cope better with a bit of contamination than almost everybody through history. But we accept even less risk.
  - kwhitefoot 3y ago
    > Modern people still need to boil water to safely drink i Not everywhere. Drinking water in the little town I live in in Norway is merely filtered and a little aluminium sulphate added to precipitate out the solids. You absolutely could have drunk the water before that treatment with no ill effects. That's because it comes from a lake high in the hills above any industrial or agricultural activity.
    - kube-system 3y ago
      Industrial and agricultural pollution are not the only potential pollutants in tap water. There are natural sources of viruses, bacteria, and parasites that exist.
    - pixl97 3y ago
      >That's because it comes from a lake high in the hills above any industrial or agricultural activity. Half correct, but not completely correct.. I'm also assuming it remains very cold or even frozen for a huge portion of the year. The water is never getting to a temperature that allows much of the dangerous things to humans to grow. For example here in Texas you're apt to get amoebas in the 25-35C waters. Also that high in the mountains you're probably getting water off mineral rock that's had very few interactions with the biosphere to accumulate wastes from animals. You don't need industrial or agricultural activity to kill you.
- asia92 3y ago
  You'll get parasites and random organisms if you consume water like that
- knowaveragejoe 2y ago
  "You're supposed to just be able to drink out of the river" seems incorrect at best
- wouldbecouldbe 2y ago
  Note, for those thinking I'm foolish. This an example of the last decades. Amazon Tribes are forced to now use rainwater tanks with "taps"; since the Oil companies came decades ago the water in stream & rivers are not drinkable anymore. https://www.theguardian.com/global-development/2020/feb/28/amazon-people-turn-to-water-tanks-after-environmental-disaster https://www.theguardian.com/global-development/2020/feb/28/a... So that's what I mean with a re-invention, tap-water is mostly needed due to human caused pollution. Now were there pathogen in the rivers, for sure, did they get sick sometimes, most likely. Did it cause higher child mortality, I haven't been able to find data for or against that. But overall they were fine & it's up for debate whether those being exposed to small amounts of pathogens were a win or lose in the long run (some theories suggest our lack of pathogens are connected to auto-immune diseases & allergies) Also our cities of course bring a lot of sewage issues causing another issue with water streams.
ksec 3y ago
>Tap water. I can't stop marveling at the fact that we have (mostly) unlimited, clean, drinkable water on demand and virtually for free. Somewhat unfortunately a lot of Tab Water in even developed countries today aren't drinkable without going through a very decent filter.
- NoMoreNicksLeft 3y ago
  "Isn't palatable" isn't the same as "isn't drinkable".
  - ksec 3y ago
    I am not entirely sure if Lead or other heavy metal content in Water is consider Drinkable.
    - NoMoreNicksLeft 3y ago
      While lead is generally considered to not be drinkable, even in desperation, no one's putting the Brita water filters on their faucets to remove lead, and it's silly to even suggest it.
    - Tagbert 3y ago
      true, but significant lead in the water is a failure mode, not considered a normal state of most drinking water in developed areas. Generally, when found, some action is taken to address the contamination (unless there is some other regulatory failure, such as in Detroit).
  - alephnerd 3y ago
    A lot of developed (HDI greater than 0.8 and GDP per Capita greater than 13k) countries don't have regulations similar to the "Clean Water Act". Turkey, Hungary, Cyprus, the Baltics outside the capital city, Malaysia, and Romania are great example of that.
pixl97 3y ago
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_L._Leal https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_L._Leal Chlorinated water is a pretty recent invention at about 115 years now. Most interestingly it was first done without permission and the only reason Leal wasn't jailed for it was the immediate positive impact on health.
- davis 3y ago
  Wow, that's absolutely fascinating. Thanks for sharing that history
Solvency 2y ago
CLEAN? LOL.

by stncls 3y ago

mrmuagi 3y ago

Sewage is interesting too! Having to pump against elevation, making the water usable for other purposes, etc. [1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UpHOkHxpTvQ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UpHOkHxpTvQ

voiper1 3y ago
+1 for "Practical Engineering". He has an amazing series on making a new pump station called Practical Construction: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PdcXkmvXXwU&list=PLTZM4MrZKfW92oUPMnzgn__3yttXvWnEY https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PdcXkmvXXwU&list=PLTZM4MrZKf...

wouldbecouldbe 3y ago

Tap water is actually a re-invention. You're supposed to just be able to drink out of the river, but due to our own pollution and the lack of build up to diseases in the water we can't drink it directly anymore.

perihelions 3y ago
I prefer "disease-free water" to "water containing unpleasant pathogens that probably won't kill me, because I've already gotten sick from them many times and maintain natural immunity". Also, immunocompromised people deserve life too. Physically weak humans wouldn't survive in the natural-selection world that preceded civilization—the purpose of human civilization is escaping, nullifying, the brutal morality of the natural world and substituting our own. Clean water is a gift of life.
- wouldbecouldbe 3y ago
  Animals are fine, and so are people who grow up drinking that. It probably strengthens certain parts of the immune system. The main reason we need to purify it is because of the stuff humans put in it.
  - wruza 3y ago
    How do you know that animals are fine?
    - Workaccount2 3y ago
      Because you only see the ones who are doing fine.
      - marcosdumay 3y ago
        This. Animals in nature are incredibly healthy. You won't see any with even a deep cut.
        saghm 3y ago
        Isn't that because the ones who aren't healthy die? That sounds like saying we shouldn't bother having modern medicine because it causes us to have a lot more sick people. The problem is we wouldn't have a lot more healthy people that way; we'd have a lot more dead people.
        marcosdumay 3y ago
        That's exactly what the comment I was replying to said. An alternative explanation is that nature is some peaceful place where no animal ever gets hurt, for any reason... What would be a purely comedic exercise if people weren't believing this one all over the thread.
        wruza 3y ago
        It is. This subthread is clearly ironic.
zild3d 3y ago
Pretty much since we stopped being nomadic / developed more sedentary agricultural societies
AlecSchueler 3y ago
Going to the stream with a bucket is still a lot more effort than turning a tap. And don't forget the hot water that can also come out!
adverbly 3y ago
> due to our own pollution and the lack of build up to diseases in the water I'm not sure this is exactly correct. Modern people still need to boil water to safely drink it even if the water comes from a remote area which does not have any pollution or disease. You are right that it is a reinvention though because we used to do this regularly because we had antibodies and other things which could handle whatever was in the water in small quantities. Everything we have now is so pure that our immune and digestive systems can't handle anything that isn't pure anymore.
- marcosdumay 3y ago
  > Everything we have now is so pure that our immune and digestive systems can't handle anything that isn't pure anymore. Ancient people were just ok with some risk of dying. We can probably cope better with a bit of contamination than almost everybody through history. But we accept even less risk.
- kwhitefoot 3y ago
  > Modern people still need to boil water to safely drink i Not everywhere. Drinking water in the little town I live in in Norway is merely filtered and a little aluminium sulphate added to precipitate out the solids. You absolutely could have drunk the water before that treatment with no ill effects. That's because it comes from a lake high in the hills above any industrial or agricultural activity.
  - kube-system 3y ago
    Industrial and agricultural pollution are not the only potential pollutants in tap water. There are natural sources of viruses, bacteria, and parasites that exist.
  - pixl97 3y ago
    >That's because it comes from a lake high in the hills above any industrial or agricultural activity. Half correct, but not completely correct.. I'm also assuming it remains very cold or even frozen for a huge portion of the year. The water is never getting to a temperature that allows much of the dangerous things to humans to grow. For example here in Texas you're apt to get amoebas in the 25-35C waters. Also that high in the mountains you're probably getting water off mineral rock that's had very few interactions with the biosphere to accumulate wastes from animals. You don't need industrial or agricultural activity to kill you.
asia92 3y ago
You'll get parasites and random organisms if you consume water like that
knowaveragejoe 2y ago
"You're supposed to just be able to drink out of the river" seems incorrect at best
wouldbecouldbe 2y ago
Note, for those thinking I'm foolish. This an example of the last decades. Amazon Tribes are forced to now use rainwater tanks with "taps"; since the Oil companies came decades ago the water in stream & rivers are not drinkable anymore. https://www.theguardian.com/global-development/2020/feb/28/amazon-people-turn-to-water-tanks-after-environmental-disaster https://www.theguardian.com/global-development/2020/feb/28/a... So that's what I mean with a re-invention, tap-water is mostly needed due to human caused pollution. Now were there pathogen in the rivers, for sure, did they get sick sometimes, most likely. Did it cause higher child mortality, I haven't been able to find data for or against that. But overall they were fine & it's up for debate whether those being exposed to small amounts of pathogens were a win or lose in the long run (some theories suggest our lack of pathogens are connected to auto-immune diseases & allergies) Also our cities of course bring a lot of sewage issues causing another issue with water streams.

ksec 3y ago

>Tap water. I can't stop marveling at the fact that we have (mostly) unlimited, clean, drinkable water on demand and virtually for free. Somewhat unfortunately a lot of Tab Water in even developed countries today aren't drinkable without going through a very decent filter.

NoMoreNicksLeft 3y ago
"Isn't palatable" isn't the same as "isn't drinkable".
- ksec 3y ago
  I am not entirely sure if Lead or other heavy metal content in Water is consider Drinkable.
  - NoMoreNicksLeft 3y ago
    While lead is generally considered to not be drinkable, even in desperation, no one's putting the Brita water filters on their faucets to remove lead, and it's silly to even suggest it.
  - Tagbert 3y ago
    true, but significant lead in the water is a failure mode, not considered a normal state of most drinking water in developed areas. Generally, when found, some action is taken to address the contamination (unless there is some other regulatory failure, such as in Detroit).
- alephnerd 3y ago
  A lot of developed (HDI greater than 0.8 and GDP per Capita greater than 13k) countries don't have regulations similar to the "Clean Water Act". Turkey, Hungary, Cyprus, the Baltics outside the capital city, Malaysia, and Romania are great example of that.

pixl97 3y ago

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_L._Leal https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_L._Leal Chlorinated water is a pretty recent invention at about 115 years now. Most interestingly it was first done without permission and the only reason Leal wasn't jailed for it was the immediate positive impact on health.

davis 3y ago
Wow, that's absolutely fascinating. Thanks for sharing that history

Solvency 2y ago

CLEAN? LOL.