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Mandelbrot set calculation is a curious intersection of math and computer science. I went down that rabbit hole once :) Naive implementation is easy, but there

Mandelbrot set calculation is a curious intersection of math and computer science. I went down that rabbit hole once :) Naive implementation is easy, but there are many ways to improve performance.

tantalor 3y ago
Strange thing to say since CS is a sub-field of math.
- Etheryte 3y ago
  I wouldn't really say that's a universally held notion, especially in the modern world. Historically, yes, but these days it stands more on its own. In similar vein, you could say biology is a subfield of physics, but most people don't think of them that way.
- ks2048 3y ago
  Of course these terms aren’t well-defined, but some (me) would say both math and CS are subfields of “formal systems” (but “formal systems” could be named CS, which would put it at the top of the hierarchy)
  - anthk 3y ago
    The Joy computer language and Scheme with SICP are prime examples. Reading SICP it's the 'easy way' and the Joy docs plus trying to code even simple as a quadratic eqn solver it's a deep, hard task which requires lots of knowledge on cathegory theory.
- couchand 3y ago
  All fields are subfields of polymathy.
  - MrYellowP 3y ago
    I thought you're joking, but nope. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polymath https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polymath
- adonovan 3y ago
  To a librarian, Computer Science and Library Science are just different aspects of information systems, which are (a librarian need hardly tell HN) humanity's highest calling, thus justifying their shared Dewey classification of 0.
  - DougBTX 3y ago
    Interesting! And "Science" is all the way down in Class 500. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Dewey_Decimal_classes https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Dewey_Decimal_classes
  - AlienRobot 3y ago
    That's so nice, it brings a tear to the eye. I hope we live up to librarians' expectations.
- hedora 3y ago
  Software engineering has as much to do with sociology as it does with math. Systems software has to deal with a lot of physics and engineering stuff (speed of light, power, heat, mean time to component failure, etc, etc.)
  - yunwal 3y ago
    Software Engineering and Computer Science don't necessarily mean the same thing (even though at this point, most schools with CS programs just teach software engineering anyway).
- ant6n 3y ago
  …and I thought math branched off from computing science sometime in the 19th century. Before that, what was called „math“ was mostly algorithms to compute stuff.
- vouaobrasil 3y ago
  It's not really philosophically, though. As a pure mathematician, I would not consider CS a subfield of math. The spirit of math is really studying abstract axiomatic systems, and while CS in theory is sort of like that, in actual practice, CS is too tied and focused on the actual instantiation of computers to really have the spirit of math.
  - mayd 3y ago
    Many would disagree with your characterisation of pure mathematics, computer science, or both. And I am certain that computer science yields nothing to pure mathematics in her pursuit of abstraction.
    - vouaobrasil 3y ago
      All I know is that when I read computer science, it doesn't feel like math at all. Other people can characterize it however they choose.
  - gwbas1c 3y ago
    Most CS in practice is really software engineering
- gwbas1c 3y ago
  I think that statement held true before widespread availability of computing; when most computer science was really theoretical. I once skimmed a few chapters of a graduate-level textbook on Category Theory and realized that it was the foundation of object-oriented programming. The biggest issue is that a lot of "Computer Science" is really applied software engineering; much like confusing physics and mechanical engineering. Or, a different way to say it: Most students studying "Computer Science" really should be studying "Software Engineering." More practically, I have a degree in Computer Science. When I was in school, it was clear that most of my professors couldn't program their way out of a paper bag, nor did they understand how to structure a large software program. It was the blind leading the blind.
  - mrguyorama 3y ago
    Meanwhile at my ABET acredited, 2nd rate state school, my Computer Science college professors were talented people who had been doing this shit for decades and clearly understood what they were talking about. I had ONE class that was about Software engineering. Meanwhile I had an entire years worth of curriculum that was just "Go take various unrelated science and math classes so you have a strong understanding of the fundamentals in both science and math" People so often generalize their very specific college experience to the entire world. Meanwhile you'd be lucky to find a consistent college experience just from crossing state lines.

Mandelbrot set calculation is a curious intersection of math and computer science. I went down that rabbit hole once :) Naive implementation is easy, but there are many ways to improve performance.

tantalor 3y ago

Strange thing to say since CS is a sub-field of math.

Etheryte 3y ago
I wouldn't really say that's a universally held notion, especially in the modern world. Historically, yes, but these days it stands more on its own. In similar vein, you could say biology is a subfield of physics, but most people don't think of them that way.
ks2048 3y ago
Of course these terms aren’t well-defined, but some (me) would say both math and CS are subfields of “formal systems” (but “formal systems” could be named CS, which would put it at the top of the hierarchy)
- anthk 3y ago
  The Joy computer language and Scheme with SICP are prime examples. Reading SICP it's the 'easy way' and the Joy docs plus trying to code even simple as a quadratic eqn solver it's a deep, hard task which requires lots of knowledge on cathegory theory.
couchand 3y ago
All fields are subfields of polymathy.
- MrYellowP 3y ago
  I thought you're joking, but nope. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polymath https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polymath
adonovan 3y ago
To a librarian, Computer Science and Library Science are just different aspects of information systems, which are (a librarian need hardly tell HN) humanity's highest calling, thus justifying their shared Dewey classification of 0.
- DougBTX 3y ago
  Interesting! And "Science" is all the way down in Class 500. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Dewey_Decimal_classes https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Dewey_Decimal_classes
- AlienRobot 3y ago
  That's so nice, it brings a tear to the eye. I hope we live up to librarians' expectations.
hedora 3y ago
Software engineering has as much to do with sociology as it does with math. Systems software has to deal with a lot of physics and engineering stuff (speed of light, power, heat, mean time to component failure, etc, etc.)
- yunwal 3y ago
  Software Engineering and Computer Science don't necessarily mean the same thing (even though at this point, most schools with CS programs just teach software engineering anyway).
ant6n 3y ago
…and I thought math branched off from computing science sometime in the 19th century. Before that, what was called „math“ was mostly algorithms to compute stuff.
vouaobrasil 3y ago
It's not really philosophically, though. As a pure mathematician, I would not consider CS a subfield of math. The spirit of math is really studying abstract axiomatic systems, and while CS in theory is sort of like that, in actual practice, CS is too tied and focused on the actual instantiation of computers to really have the spirit of math.
- mayd 3y ago
  Many would disagree with your characterisation of pure mathematics, computer science, or both. And I am certain that computer science yields nothing to pure mathematics in her pursuit of abstraction.
  - vouaobrasil 3y ago
    All I know is that when I read computer science, it doesn't feel like math at all. Other people can characterize it however they choose.
- gwbas1c 3y ago
  Most CS in practice is really software engineering
gwbas1c 3y ago
I think that statement held true before widespread availability of computing; when most computer science was really theoretical. I once skimmed a few chapters of a graduate-level textbook on Category Theory and realized that it was the foundation of object-oriented programming. The biggest issue is that a lot of "Computer Science" is really applied software engineering; much like confusing physics and mechanical engineering. Or, a different way to say it: Most students studying "Computer Science" really should be studying "Software Engineering." More practically, I have a degree in Computer Science. When I was in school, it was clear that most of my professors couldn't program their way out of a paper bag, nor did they understand how to structure a large software program. It was the blind leading the blind.
- mrguyorama 3y ago
  Meanwhile at my ABET acredited, 2nd rate state school, my Computer Science college professors were talented people who had been doing this shit for decades and clearly understood what they were talking about. I had ONE class that was about Software engineering. Meanwhile I had an entire years worth of curriculum that was just "Go take various unrelated science and math classes so you have a strong understanding of the fundamentals in both science and math" People so often generalize their very specific college experience to the entire world. Meanwhile you'd be lucky to find a consistent college experience just from crossing state lines.