7 ms·

that AGI, instead of benefitting the whole world, in which Musk is a part of, will end up only benefitting Microsoft, which he isn't a part of?

AlbertCory 3y ago
I don't think that qualifies as "standing", but IANAL.
- jlmorton 3y ago
  I think the missing info here is that Musk gave the non-profit the initial $100 million dollars, which they used to develop the technology purportedly for the benefit of the public, and then turned around and added a for-profit subsidiary where all the work is happening.
  - AlbertCory 3y ago
    He has plenty of standing, but the "supposed to benefit all mankind" argument isn't it. If that were enough, everyone not holding stock in MSFT would have standing, and they don't.
- s1artibartfast 3y ago
  He was also a founding donor, so there is that. If I have a non-profit legally chartered save puppies, you give me a million dollars, then I buy myself cars and houses, I would expect you have some standing.
  - AlbertCory 3y ago
    Note that I didn't say he lacks standing. Just that your argument wasn't it.
  - sroussey 3y ago
    No, they spent $1m saving puppies, then raised more funds and did other things. That money Musk donated was spent almost a decade ago. He has a competitor now that is not very good, so he is suing to slow them down.
    - s1artibartfast 3y ago
      It is more complex than that because they cant change what they do on a whim. no-profits have charters and documents of incorporation, which are the rules they will operate by both now and moving forward. Why do you think that money was spent a decade ago? Open AI wasn't even founded 10 years ago. Musk's funding was the lions share of all funding until the Microsoft deal in 2019
      - sroussey 3y ago
        Because it was started 9 years ago and AI research is expensive.
        s1artibartfast 3y ago
        The reality was different. Prior to MSFT, Open AI ran a lean company operating within the the budget of Musk funding, focusing on science and talent. For example, in 2017, their annual compute spend was <$8 million compared to like 450 million for deep mind. Big spend only came after MSFT, which invested $1B and then $10B, primarily in the form of credit for compute.
  - PepperdineG 3y ago
    Disputing the activities under a Delaware charter would seem to fall under the jurisdiction of the Delaware Chancery Court, not the California court Musk went to. Delaware is specifically known for it being easy for non-profits to easily tweak their charters over time: For example, it can mean that a founder’s vision for a private foundation may be modified after his or her death or incapacity despite all intentions to the contrary. We have seen situations where, upon a founder’s death, the charitable purpose of a foundation was changed in ways that were technically legal, but not in keeping with its original intent and perhaps would not have been possible in a state with more restrictive governance and oversight, or given more foresight and awareness at the time of organization. https://www.americanbar.org/groups/business_law/resources/business-law-today/2016-november/the-delaware-advantage/ https://www.americanbar.org/groups/business_law/resources/bu...
dmix 3y ago
"AGI"
WolfeReader 3y ago
This is no AGI. An AGI is supposed to be the cognitive equivalent of a human, right? The "AI" being pushed out to people these days can't even count.
- emodendroket 3y ago
  I would agree but the filing is at pains to argue the opposite (seemingly because such a determination would affect Microsoft's license).
- yaomingite 3y ago
  The AI is multiple programs working together, and they already pass math problems on to a data analyst specialist. There's also an option to use a WolframAlpha plugin to handle math problems. The reason it didn't have math from the start was that it was a solved problem on computers decades ago, and they are specifically demonstrating advances in language capabilities. Machines can handle math, language, graphics, and motor coordination already. A unified interface to coordinate all of those isn't finished, but gluing together different programs isn't a significant engineering problem.
  - riku_iki 3y ago
    > The AI is multiple programs working together, and they already pass math problems on to a data analyst specialist. There's also an option to use a WolframAlpha plugin to handle math problems. is quality of this system good enough to qualify for AGI?..
  - baobabKoodaa 3y ago
    You know what's not a "unified interface" in front of "different programs glued together"? A human. By your own explanation, the current generation of AI is very far from AGI, as it was defined in GP.
    - yaomingite 3y ago
      The brain does have specialized systems that work together.

AlbertCory 3y ago

I don't think that qualifies as "standing", but IANAL.

jlmorton 3y ago
I think the missing info here is that Musk gave the non-profit the initial $100 million dollars, which they used to develop the technology purportedly for the benefit of the public, and then turned around and added a for-profit subsidiary where all the work is happening.
- AlbertCory 3y ago
  He has plenty of standing, but the "supposed to benefit all mankind" argument isn't it. If that were enough, everyone not holding stock in MSFT would have standing, and they don't.
s1artibartfast 3y ago
He was also a founding donor, so there is that. If I have a non-profit legally chartered save puppies, you give me a million dollars, then I buy myself cars and houses, I would expect you have some standing.
- AlbertCory 3y ago
  Note that I didn't say he lacks standing. Just that your argument wasn't it.
- sroussey 3y ago
  No, they spent $1m saving puppies, then raised more funds and did other things. That money Musk donated was spent almost a decade ago. He has a competitor now that is not very good, so he is suing to slow them down.
  - s1artibartfast 3y ago
    It is more complex than that because they cant change what they do on a whim. no-profits have charters and documents of incorporation, which are the rules they will operate by both now and moving forward. Why do you think that money was spent a decade ago? Open AI wasn't even founded 10 years ago. Musk's funding was the lions share of all funding until the Microsoft deal in 2019
    - sroussey 3y ago
      Because it was started 9 years ago and AI research is expensive.
      - s1artibartfast 3y ago
        The reality was different. Prior to MSFT, Open AI ran a lean company operating within the the budget of Musk funding, focusing on science and talent. For example, in 2017, their annual compute spend was <$8 million compared to like 450 million for deep mind. Big spend only came after MSFT, which invested $1B and then $10B, primarily in the form of credit for compute.
- PepperdineG 3y ago
  Disputing the activities under a Delaware charter would seem to fall under the jurisdiction of the Delaware Chancery Court, not the California court Musk went to. Delaware is specifically known for it being easy for non-profits to easily tweak their charters over time: For example, it can mean that a founder’s vision for a private foundation may be modified after his or her death or incapacity despite all intentions to the contrary. We have seen situations where, upon a founder’s death, the charitable purpose of a foundation was changed in ways that were technically legal, but not in keeping with its original intent and perhaps would not have been possible in a state with more restrictive governance and oversight, or given more foresight and awareness at the time of organization. https://www.americanbar.org/groups/business_law/resources/business-law-today/2016-november/the-delaware-advantage/ https://www.americanbar.org/groups/business_law/resources/bu...

dmix 3y ago

"AGI"

WolfeReader 3y ago

This is no AGI. An AGI is supposed to be the cognitive equivalent of a human, right? The "AI" being pushed out to people these days can't even count.

emodendroket 3y ago
I would agree but the filing is at pains to argue the opposite (seemingly because such a determination would affect Microsoft's license).
yaomingite 3y ago
The AI is multiple programs working together, and they already pass math problems on to a data analyst specialist. There's also an option to use a WolframAlpha plugin to handle math problems. The reason it didn't have math from the start was that it was a solved problem on computers decades ago, and they are specifically demonstrating advances in language capabilities. Machines can handle math, language, graphics, and motor coordination already. A unified interface to coordinate all of those isn't finished, but gluing together different programs isn't a significant engineering problem.
- riku_iki 3y ago
  > The AI is multiple programs working together, and they already pass math problems on to a data analyst specialist. There's also an option to use a WolframAlpha plugin to handle math problems. is quality of this system good enough to qualify for AGI?..
- baobabKoodaa 3y ago
  You know what's not a "unified interface" in front of "different programs glued together"? A human. By your own explanation, the current generation of AI is very far from AGI, as it was defined in GP.
  - yaomingite 3y ago
    The brain does have specialized systems that work together.