8 ms·

> I don't understand why they recommend against it. I guess the monetary costs don't outweigh the benefits, but that's only if you care more about saving money

> I don't understand why they recommend against it. I guess the monetary costs don't outweigh the benefits, but that's only if you care more about saving money than potentially preventing cancer. It's not like the vaccine going to hurt you. All vaccines have a nonzero risk of adverse outcomes. That can be as simple as the risk of physical injury due to incorrect administration of the needle. That's weighed against the risk of nonvaccination. In almost all cases, the balance is so extremely skewed that it's safe to issue general recommendations in favor of vaccination. For HPV, the issue is that there's literally zero benefit after exposure, and it's difficult/infeasible to test for exposure, but from epidemiological data we know that most people over the age of 25 have already been exposed. > In my opinion men should also be vaccinated for it The recommendation is for all genders, and has been for well over a decade.

logicchains 3y ago
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- ceejayoz 3y ago
  > It's still the riskiest pharmaceutical product the average young person will take. That'll almost certainly be Tylenol. > No other pharmaceutical product has been deemed so risky that it couldn't exist unless people were prevented from suing its manufacturers. That's not why the program exists. It was deemed risky for the national security of the United States to lose its ability to manufacture vaccines because twelve lay people in a jury room decide to bankrupt a drug company. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Vaccine_Injury_Compensation_Program https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Vaccine_Injury_Compen... "The National Vaccine Injury Compensation Program (VICP or NVICP) was established by the 1986 National Childhood Vaccine Injury Act (NCVIA), passed by the United States Congress in response to a threat to the vaccine supply due to a 1980s scare over the DPT vaccine. Despite the belief of most public health officials that claims of side effects were unfounded, large jury awards had been given to some plaintiffs, most DPT vaccine makers had ceased production, and officials feared the loss of herd immunity."
  - fwungy 3y ago
    I don't let my children do either. Imagine trading a low risk in the distant future for a low risk in the present for a healthy child? Any business person knows things that potentially happen in the distant future are to be heavily discounted, while present day risks carry full values.
    - ceejayoz 3y ago
      > Any business person knows things that potentially happen in the distant future are to be heavily discounted, while present day risks carry full values. Any parent knows that a business folding and a child dying aren't quite the same thing.
      - fwungy 3y ago
        Your child isn't going to die from cervical cancer. Kids don't get it. Your child may die or be seriously injured by HPV vaccines. There are about 80 open class action lawsuits in process over it. We took most of the other vaccines, but my partner and I decided the HPV vaccine was too dangerous right now, while we have happy healthy kids, to worry about the small chance that an unproven cervical cancer vaccine will work thirty years from now.
        ceejayoz 3y ago
        > Your child isn't going to die from cervical cancer. Kids don't get it. This is remarkably ignorant. The vaccine prevents HPV infection. Kids absolutely do get that. HPV infection can lead to cervical cancer, and we're on an article about how it's thus most effective if administered before the age of 14.
- snakeyjake 3y ago
  > It's still the riskiest pharmaceutical product the average young person will take. Acetaminophen is the riskiest pharmaceutical product the average young person will take. It's so risky that EMS and ED staff are extremely well attuned to detecting and deploying effective interventions so that even when one doesn't die due to the entire scientific might of medicine being thrown at them, about a third of people who overdose and survive will have kidney and stomach problems for the rest of their (quite frankly, miserable) lives. The antivax morons would be better served by being antiaceta.
volkl48 3y ago
Noted in my other comment, but mentioned here as well: - Exposure to a strain is not the same as exposure to all strains. Few are likely to have been infected with all of the strains that the vaccine protects against, and infection by multiple strains is not a rare event. - There's research being done on if the vaccine can reduce symptoms to people who already have HPV. Early results seem promising. Certainly nothing large enough for the CDC to be making recommendations on yet (that I know of/could find from a quick search), but worth noting - there may well turn out to be a significant benefit to the vaccine even after exposure, we just seem to be relatively early in that research. - https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6541142/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6541142/ - https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/38068369/ https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/38068369/

logicchains 3y ago

[flagged]

ceejayoz 3y ago
> It's still the riskiest pharmaceutical product the average young person will take. That'll almost certainly be Tylenol. > No other pharmaceutical product has been deemed so risky that it couldn't exist unless people were prevented from suing its manufacturers. That's not why the program exists. It was deemed risky for the national security of the United States to lose its ability to manufacture vaccines because twelve lay people in a jury room decide to bankrupt a drug company. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Vaccine_Injury_Compensation_Program https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Vaccine_Injury_Compen... "The National Vaccine Injury Compensation Program (VICP or NVICP) was established by the 1986 National Childhood Vaccine Injury Act (NCVIA), passed by the United States Congress in response to a threat to the vaccine supply due to a 1980s scare over the DPT vaccine. Despite the belief of most public health officials that claims of side effects were unfounded, large jury awards had been given to some plaintiffs, most DPT vaccine makers had ceased production, and officials feared the loss of herd immunity."
- fwungy 3y ago
  I don't let my children do either. Imagine trading a low risk in the distant future for a low risk in the present for a healthy child? Any business person knows things that potentially happen in the distant future are to be heavily discounted, while present day risks carry full values.
  - ceejayoz 3y ago
    > Any business person knows things that potentially happen in the distant future are to be heavily discounted, while present day risks carry full values. Any parent knows that a business folding and a child dying aren't quite the same thing.
    - fwungy 3y ago
      Your child isn't going to die from cervical cancer. Kids don't get it. Your child may die or be seriously injured by HPV vaccines. There are about 80 open class action lawsuits in process over it. We took most of the other vaccines, but my partner and I decided the HPV vaccine was too dangerous right now, while we have happy healthy kids, to worry about the small chance that an unproven cervical cancer vaccine will work thirty years from now.
      - ceejayoz 3y ago
        > Your child isn't going to die from cervical cancer. Kids don't get it. This is remarkably ignorant. The vaccine prevents HPV infection. Kids absolutely do get that. HPV infection can lead to cervical cancer, and we're on an article about how it's thus most effective if administered before the age of 14.
snakeyjake 3y ago
> It's still the riskiest pharmaceutical product the average young person will take. Acetaminophen is the riskiest pharmaceutical product the average young person will take. It's so risky that EMS and ED staff are extremely well attuned to detecting and deploying effective interventions so that even when one doesn't die due to the entire scientific might of medicine being thrown at them, about a third of people who overdose and survive will have kidney and stomach problems for the rest of their (quite frankly, miserable) lives. The antivax morons would be better served by being antiaceta.

volkl48 3y ago

Noted in my other comment, but mentioned here as well: - Exposure to a strain is not the same as exposure to all strains. Few are likely to have been infected with all of the strains that the vaccine protects against, and infection by multiple strains is not a rare event. - There's research being done on if the vaccine can reduce symptoms to people who already have HPV. Early results seem promising. Certainly nothing large enough for the CDC to be making recommendations on yet (that I know of/could find from a quick search), but worth noting - there may well turn out to be a significant benefit to the vaccine even after exposure, we just seem to be relatively early in that research. - https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6541142/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6541142/ - https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/38068369/ https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/38068369/