9 ms·

John Oliver did an eye opening bit on homeschooling: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lzsZP9o7SlI&pp=ygUVam9uIG9saXZlciBob21lc2Nob29s https://www.youtube.com/wat

by rbobby 3y ago

John Oliver did an eye opening bit on homeschooling: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lzsZP9o7SlI&pp=ygUVam9uIG9saXZlciBob21lc2Nob29s https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lzsZP9o7SlI&pp=ygUVam9uIG9sa... The lack of regulation is concerning. What's truly disturbing is how easily it is for children to fall through the cracks when there are no teachers to report possible abuse. Frightening.

nvahalik 3y ago
> The lack of regulation is concerning. You should go talk to some teachers at large school districts. "Regulation" can be both a blessing and a curse. There is plenty of bullying, drug use, etc. at large schools where nobody wants to deal with it.
- millzlane 3y ago
  But at least at large schools a kid has an opportunity to snitch on their abusers. Or there is someone there to spot the signs.
  - teitoklien 3y ago
    Those kids can snitch to much more competent people who are well trained and respond more quickly than schools which are notorious for suspending children who stand up to their bullies or call the police on kids just because they got into a little fight. It’s called calling 911 and calling CPS, or going to your nearest healthcare place. There are tons of ways, to checkup on kids, even just a annual mandatory children checkup is enough, or neighbours keeping an eye out and reporting issues. School neglect is often the very thing that lead children to failures, abuse from their peers, suicidal thoughts, gun violence, you name it. Not sure if modern schools are the messiah. I’m anti homeschool tho, i think parents are mostly incompetent at raising kids well, and if their children do not pass certain academic exams at grade 2,5 and 7 then they should be banned from homeschooling, an entire nation’s future depends on it. Schools should also be less politicised, all this lgbtq , critical race theory, math is racist, etc should be removed from schools, I understand it’s meaningful in some ways and well intentioned, that children learn their history, that kids learn to be more tolerant of others, but these are all values that their parents should teach them, not schools. Gutting out of advanced classes from school because too many white and asian kids got into it, instead of trying to improve outcomes for black and hispanic children, they just destroyed the advanced classes in major schools, and worsened the outcomes for EVERYBODY (I meant kids of masses, rich folks and politicians kids will still get top tier education at private school) Schools != Parents Too many schools tried to become the parent Now parents are starting to remove schools altogether. This will be bad for everyone in this country, but it was schools and government who started this mess in the first place. Now they just wanna blame parents.
    - nvahalik 3y ago
      > This will be bad for everyone in this country Whole heartedly disagree. It will be very good for some people and for others it will not be good. We have been homeschooling for the last 8 years. Our kids are more mature and far exceed anything public school would have done for them. However, we see home schooling as a vocation and something we have to put effort into—not just something we sign up for on a website and then let our kid do all the work online. Given the right reasons, homeschool will always be superior because the student/teacher ratio is so low. Plus you know your kids better and can adapt to their needs. Given the wrong reasons, sure, it will fail people. But arguably those folks are already failing—and being propped up by a system which tries to support them but ultimately cannot.
    - no_wizard 3y ago
      >It’s called calling 911 and calling CPS, or going to your nearest healthcare place. Who is suppose to do this exactly? If you're raised in an abusive household, it is not entirely likely you are aware you can do these things, or even if you are there is alot of fear and psychological manipulation to overcome in situations of abuse. With no outside party to intervene, it is extremely difficult for abuse to be overcome. This is why, for example in California (and other states that have this law), if a there is a domestic dispute call, it is mandatory by law that the police separate the people involved for at least 24, even if the victim does not press charges at that time. This gives room for a victim to stand up for themselves once the threat has been removed. Not perfect by any means, but this has saved countless lives and improved countless others. With children, an even more vulnerable population, removing them out of public school with no recourse for checking in with that child in a safe setting, you will exacerbate child abuse further than it already exists. I think the trade off of home school being that there is child safety checks routinely built in over the school age of the child, would be something parents could weigh as a trade off.
- rayiner 3y ago
  Also gang recruitment: https://foxbaltimore.com/news/local/baltimore-co-police-warn-parents-of-gang-recruitment-in-schools https://foxbaltimore.com/news/local/baltimore-co-police-warn...
millzlane 3y ago
Yea, If you were abusing your kids, It would be easy as hell to do it if you home schooled. That's the secret, don't take them to a place where there are mandated reporters.
- bell-cot 3y ago
  Maybe you should talk to an old social worker or few, about the huge number of kids who are both abused, and attending public schools. "Teachers are mandated reporters" is nothing resembling a magical fix, even in school districts where the teachers are not already stretched to burn-out by all the other demands placed upon them.
  - marcinzm 3y ago
    > Maybe you should talk to an old social worker or few, about the huge number of kids who are both abused, and attending public schools. Social workers being aware of abused kids at schools seems exactly the thing we want. Most abusers are parents or relatives. Hiding the problem in home schooling and then saying it doesn't exist because social workers never hear about it seems the utterly wrong viewpoint.
    - Whoppertime 3y ago
      The question is are they doing anything about it? If the abuse doesn't stop, it doesn't matter if you are attending public school private school or home school
rayiner 3y ago
On the other side of the ledger, schools are a place for kids with troubled home lives to abuse all the other kids who have loving, supportive parents.
goalieca 3y ago
I'm watching kids fall through the cracks of the public school system here in Canada. There's quite a violence problem with even teachers and staff being seriously injured and powerless to deal with it. But there is also functional literacy issues since 1/3 in my province are not meeting basic competency requirements. In this environment, i can see why home schooling is a thing if you can't afford to send your kids to private school. John Oliver is entertaining but he's also very strongly biased and misrepresents the situation. He talks fast and yells and mocks people to give the illusion of confidence and authority.
- Whoppertime 3y ago
  He loves to Cherry pick as well I can guarantee you if he has kids they weren't doing ZOOM classes since March 2020 like some kids.
rufus_foreman 3y ago
>> The lack of regulation is concerning "lack of regulation" means freedom. That's what people find concerning? Looking at the current situation, I would prefer more freedom to less. To me lack of regulation is typically a good thing.
- nerdjon 3y ago
  Did you watch the linked video? Your "freedom" is allowing kids to be abused since they don't have the checks of other adults being able to see them. A bare minimum "are the kids physically ok" doesn't remove any of your freedom unless you consider starving and beating your kids a "Freedom" you care about.
  - rufus_foreman 3y ago
    For any type of education, you can point to instances of abuse. For home schooling, for public schools, for private schools, for religious schools, for universities. Kids are regularly shot to death in numbers in public schools, for example. People have been beaten and abused in private schools. What they are trying to do is to use scare stories about home schooling to scare people into giving up their freedom. It's the same tactic that's used all the time to get people to give up their rights, to get us into wars, and so on. I want more freedom, not less. I won't let authoritarian fear tactics change that.
    - nerdjon 3y ago
      [flagged]
      - Turing_Machine 3y ago
        > So you want to starve and beat your kids, got it. thank you for confirming that. The OP said nothing of the sort. You're being dishonest here. I'm sorry, but there's no other way it can be characterized.
        3y ago
nerdjon 3y ago
That thing was incredibly frightening to see and just how much power the home school lobbying group has. I am sure that what is shown here is in the severe minority, but I don't understand how we don't have some basic requirements in place. (well I understand how, but I can't think of a better phrasing)
- Whoppertime 3y ago
  Do you consider the power of the teacher's unions to shut down in person education for years in response to covid "incredibly frightening to see and just how much power the teachers Union lobbying group has"?
d4v3 3y ago
John Oliver's ostentatious display of concern and commentary frequently veers into the realm of exaggerated and borderline hysteria-inducing theatrics. Consequently, I approach his statements with a considerable dose of skepticism.
Whoppertime 3y ago
Does he address how many schools have run from March of 2020 to today despite the regulations? Reading Math and other test scores have plummeted across multiple states at their public schools.

by rbobby 3y ago

nvahalik 3y ago

> The lack of regulation is concerning. You should go talk to some teachers at large school districts. "Regulation" can be both a blessing and a curse. There is plenty of bullying, drug use, etc. at large schools where nobody wants to deal with it.

millzlane 3y ago
But at least at large schools a kid has an opportunity to snitch on their abusers. Or there is someone there to spot the signs.
- teitoklien 3y ago
  Those kids can snitch to much more competent people who are well trained and respond more quickly than schools which are notorious for suspending children who stand up to their bullies or call the police on kids just because they got into a little fight. It’s called calling 911 and calling CPS, or going to your nearest healthcare place. There are tons of ways, to checkup on kids, even just a annual mandatory children checkup is enough, or neighbours keeping an eye out and reporting issues. School neglect is often the very thing that lead children to failures, abuse from their peers, suicidal thoughts, gun violence, you name it. Not sure if modern schools are the messiah. I’m anti homeschool tho, i think parents are mostly incompetent at raising kids well, and if their children do not pass certain academic exams at grade 2,5 and 7 then they should be banned from homeschooling, an entire nation’s future depends on it. Schools should also be less politicised, all this lgbtq , critical race theory, math is racist, etc should be removed from schools, I understand it’s meaningful in some ways and well intentioned, that children learn their history, that kids learn to be more tolerant of others, but these are all values that their parents should teach them, not schools. Gutting out of advanced classes from school because too many white and asian kids got into it, instead of trying to improve outcomes for black and hispanic children, they just destroyed the advanced classes in major schools, and worsened the outcomes for EVERYBODY (I meant kids of masses, rich folks and politicians kids will still get top tier education at private school) Schools != Parents Too many schools tried to become the parent Now parents are starting to remove schools altogether. This will be bad for everyone in this country, but it was schools and government who started this mess in the first place. Now they just wanna blame parents.
  - nvahalik 3y ago
    > This will be bad for everyone in this country Whole heartedly disagree. It will be very good for some people and for others it will not be good. We have been homeschooling for the last 8 years. Our kids are more mature and far exceed anything public school would have done for them. However, we see home schooling as a vocation and something we have to put effort into—not just something we sign up for on a website and then let our kid do all the work online. Given the right reasons, homeschool will always be superior because the student/teacher ratio is so low. Plus you know your kids better and can adapt to their needs. Given the wrong reasons, sure, it will fail people. But arguably those folks are already failing—and being propped up by a system which tries to support them but ultimately cannot.
  - no_wizard 3y ago
    >It’s called calling 911 and calling CPS, or going to your nearest healthcare place. Who is suppose to do this exactly? If you're raised in an abusive household, it is not entirely likely you are aware you can do these things, or even if you are there is alot of fear and psychological manipulation to overcome in situations of abuse. With no outside party to intervene, it is extremely difficult for abuse to be overcome. This is why, for example in California (and other states that have this law), if a there is a domestic dispute call, it is mandatory by law that the police separate the people involved for at least 24, even if the victim does not press charges at that time. This gives room for a victim to stand up for themselves once the threat has been removed. Not perfect by any means, but this has saved countless lives and improved countless others. With children, an even more vulnerable population, removing them out of public school with no recourse for checking in with that child in a safe setting, you will exacerbate child abuse further than it already exists. I think the trade off of home school being that there is child safety checks routinely built in over the school age of the child, would be something parents could weigh as a trade off.
rayiner 3y ago
Also gang recruitment: https://foxbaltimore.com/news/local/baltimore-co-police-warn-parents-of-gang-recruitment-in-schools https://foxbaltimore.com/news/local/baltimore-co-police-warn...

millzlane 3y ago

Yea, If you were abusing your kids, It would be easy as hell to do it if you home schooled. That's the secret, don't take them to a place where there are mandated reporters.

bell-cot 3y ago
Maybe you should talk to an old social worker or few, about the huge number of kids who are both abused, and attending public schools. "Teachers are mandated reporters" is nothing resembling a magical fix, even in school districts where the teachers are not already stretched to burn-out by all the other demands placed upon them.
- marcinzm 3y ago
  > Maybe you should talk to an old social worker or few, about the huge number of kids who are both abused, and attending public schools. Social workers being aware of abused kids at schools seems exactly the thing we want. Most abusers are parents or relatives. Hiding the problem in home schooling and then saying it doesn't exist because social workers never hear about it seems the utterly wrong viewpoint.
  - Whoppertime 3y ago
    The question is are they doing anything about it? If the abuse doesn't stop, it doesn't matter if you are attending public school private school or home school

rayiner 3y ago

On the other side of the ledger, schools are a place for kids with troubled home lives to abuse all the other kids who have loving, supportive parents.

goalieca 3y ago

I'm watching kids fall through the cracks of the public school system here in Canada. There's quite a violence problem with even teachers and staff being seriously injured and powerless to deal with it. But there is also functional literacy issues since 1/3 in my province are not meeting basic competency requirements. In this environment, i can see why home schooling is a thing if you can't afford to send your kids to private school. John Oliver is entertaining but he's also very strongly biased and misrepresents the situation. He talks fast and yells and mocks people to give the illusion of confidence and authority.

Whoppertime 3y ago
He loves to Cherry pick as well I can guarantee you if he has kids they weren't doing ZOOM classes since March 2020 like some kids.

rufus_foreman 3y ago

>> The lack of regulation is concerning "lack of regulation" means freedom. That's what people find concerning? Looking at the current situation, I would prefer more freedom to less. To me lack of regulation is typically a good thing.

nerdjon 3y ago
Did you watch the linked video? Your "freedom" is allowing kids to be abused since they don't have the checks of other adults being able to see them. A bare minimum "are the kids physically ok" doesn't remove any of your freedom unless you consider starving and beating your kids a "Freedom" you care about.
- rufus_foreman 3y ago
  For any type of education, you can point to instances of abuse. For home schooling, for public schools, for private schools, for religious schools, for universities. Kids are regularly shot to death in numbers in public schools, for example. People have been beaten and abused in private schools. What they are trying to do is to use scare stories about home schooling to scare people into giving up their freedom. It's the same tactic that's used all the time to get people to give up their rights, to get us into wars, and so on. I want more freedom, not less. I won't let authoritarian fear tactics change that.
  - nerdjon 3y ago
    [flagged]
    - Turing_Machine 3y ago
      > So you want to starve and beat your kids, got it. thank you for confirming that. The OP said nothing of the sort. You're being dishonest here. I'm sorry, but there's no other way it can be characterized.
      - 3y ago

nerdjon 3y ago

That thing was incredibly frightening to see and just how much power the home school lobbying group has. I am sure that what is shown here is in the severe minority, but I don't understand how we don't have some basic requirements in place. (well I understand how, but I can't think of a better phrasing)

Whoppertime 3y ago
Do you consider the power of the teacher's unions to shut down in person education for years in response to covid "incredibly frightening to see and just how much power the teachers Union lobbying group has"?

d4v3 3y ago

John Oliver's ostentatious display of concern and commentary frequently veers into the realm of exaggerated and borderline hysteria-inducing theatrics. Consequently, I approach his statements with a considerable dose of skepticism.

Whoppertime 3y ago

Does he address how many schools have run from March of 2020 to today despite the regulations? Reading Math and other test scores have plummeted across multiple states at their public schools.