8 ms·

Chicago resident here. The city making more from parking tickets is not exactly a selling point if you're the one paying them. Before the deal we had 20-year-o

Chicago resident here. The city making more from parking tickets is not exactly a selling point if you're the one paying them. Before the deal we had 20-year-old meters which were generally 25 cents or 50 cents per hour (quarters only). Lakefront parking was generally free outside downtown. After the deal, rates quadrupled or more and many more meters went up, including at the lakefront. Now there is always a worry about whether you're paid up enough to finish a picnic. At least we can pay with credit/debit cards through an app (progress!). The deal was a con from the beginning to help fill a budget shortfall and every resident who drives felt the effects, and will for the rest of their lives.

scythe 3y ago
What seems to be an economic innovation is also often a political innovation. If Chicago was losing money on parking, they have the obvious remedy of raising the price. But they would face significant political blowback. So instead they "sell" the parking revenue to a "private" operator who then raises the price. The service provided by the metering company is not just operating the meters but also taking the blame for the cost of parking. This way the city government — i.e. the people in the city government — get to throw up their hands and point at their predecessors. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Principal–agent_problem http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Principal–agent_problem The incentive structure affecting the politicians is the root cause.
- HDThoreaun 3y ago
  I don't even think this would be a bad thing if negotiated properly without corruption. Honestly seems like a good solution to the political parking problem
- nobodyandproud 3y ago
  Perhaps the solution is that all government contracts must be renewed, when the executive leadership is re-elected. No contractual, perpetual hostage holding. It would require an act of Congress+, so I don’t see this ever happening.
- pfannkuchen 3y ago
  Straight out of the Ticketmaster playbook.
adrianh 3y ago
(Former Chicago resident here) Higher parking rates means fewer people driving, which is a long-term win. I highly doubt this was the top priority for the people who set the Chicago parking rates, but it's actually a good thing for the city. Yes, you can argue "it just means parking is for rich people" -- to which I'd respond "keep increasing the parking rates, along with some other tactics, and even rich people will turn to other means of transportation." Here in Amsterdam, the city government is deliberately doing things like raising parking rates, closing streets to car traffic and removing street parking -- all in an effort to reduce car usage.
- outworlder 3y ago
  > Higher parking rates means fewer people driving, which is a long-term win. Only if they have decent alternatives.
  - HDThoreaun 3y ago
    There are many in Chicago
  - rubymancer 3y ago
    Indeed. Our elevated trains are excellent (even though everyone complains) but even with recent expansions they don't serve huge swaths of the city. https://www.transitchicago.com/assets/1/6/ctamap_Lsystem.png https://www.transitchicago.com/assets/1/6/ctamap_Lsystem.png If you're on the NW or SW sides in particular, you're going to need a car. We're getting more and more bike lanes but they're also very unequally distributed and biking is...not great for winter.
- steveBK123 3y ago
  Two issue - US is incapable of building transit infra. We should be able, but the last 50 years have shown otherwise. Making driving harder and praying that somehow makes transit good is not a solution, though many cities are now trying that. I think a lot of Euros misunderestimate (to quote Dubya) how much more extreme North American city climates are. Using wikipedia data, Amsterdam's lowest mean temperature month is January at 3.8C, and highest mean temperature month is July at 18.1C. Chicago has 3 months below 3.8C per year, in fact it's below 0C for 3 months. Plus 4 months above 18.1C. Some of our climates just aren't terribly comfortable for biking here. NYC is not much better either.
Symbiote 3y ago
That seems shockingly cheap. Was it really with paying someone to collect the coins and maintain the meters? In the center of Copenhagen parking during the daytime is $6/hour!
- rubymancer 3y ago
  25 cents/hour was indeed shockingly and delightfully cheap. I miss those days. I suppose it still is, compared to $6/hour.
- bragr 3y ago
  The metered street parking right now in LA is usually $0.50-$2.00/hour depending on the area so that seems quite normal to me. Our meters are pretty good too and you can pay in coins or card: https://ladotparking.org/parking-meters/single-multi-space-meters/ https://ladotparking.org/parking-meters/single-multi-space-m...
  - Symbiote 3y ago
    That meter costs about $700 plus installation costs! http://www.mapc.org/wp-content/uploads/2018/03/IPS-MAPC-2018-Parking-Meter-Pricing-Matrix.pdf http://www.mapc.org/wp-content/uploads/2018/03/IPS-MAPC-2018... Though I suppose it makes the money back quickly enough. In much of Europe, rather than cheap 50¢/hr or whatever parking, it's more common to have no fee but still a time limit. (Or, in city centres, a high fee and a time limit.)
Etrnl_President 3y ago
It's not true privatization, if the taxpayer covers losses and enforcement, nor if taxes previously collected for the service aren't reduced. It's a merger of corporation and state, which is somethig Sorel advocated.
gok 3y ago
Free/cheap parking is a driving subsidy. In fact the old prices were even worse than that; the prices were not high enough to actually keep spaces available, so it ended up being more like a lottery system. The correct solution would have been to just raise prices and fix enforcement, but the city dug themselves into such a financial and political hole that it wasn't feasible to do without the sale.

scythe 3y ago

What seems to be an economic innovation is also often a political innovation. If Chicago was losing money on parking, they have the obvious remedy of raising the price. But they would face significant political blowback. So instead they "sell" the parking revenue to a "private" operator who then raises the price. The service provided by the metering company is not just operating the meters but also taking the blame for the cost of parking. This way the city government — i.e. the people in the city government — get to throw up their hands and point at their predecessors. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Principal–agent_problem http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Principal–agent_problem The incentive structure affecting the politicians is the root cause.

HDThoreaun 3y ago
I don't even think this would be a bad thing if negotiated properly without corruption. Honestly seems like a good solution to the political parking problem
nobodyandproud 3y ago
Perhaps the solution is that all government contracts must be renewed, when the executive leadership is re-elected. No contractual, perpetual hostage holding. It would require an act of Congress+, so I don’t see this ever happening.
pfannkuchen 3y ago
Straight out of the Ticketmaster playbook.

adrianh 3y ago

(Former Chicago resident here) Higher parking rates means fewer people driving, which is a long-term win. I highly doubt this was the top priority for the people who set the Chicago parking rates, but it's actually a good thing for the city. Yes, you can argue "it just means parking is for rich people" -- to which I'd respond "keep increasing the parking rates, along with some other tactics, and even rich people will turn to other means of transportation." Here in Amsterdam, the city government is deliberately doing things like raising parking rates, closing streets to car traffic and removing street parking -- all in an effort to reduce car usage.

outworlder 3y ago
> Higher parking rates means fewer people driving, which is a long-term win. Only if they have decent alternatives.
- HDThoreaun 3y ago
  There are many in Chicago
- rubymancer 3y ago
  Indeed. Our elevated trains are excellent (even though everyone complains) but even with recent expansions they don't serve huge swaths of the city. https://www.transitchicago.com/assets/1/6/ctamap_Lsystem.png https://www.transitchicago.com/assets/1/6/ctamap_Lsystem.png If you're on the NW or SW sides in particular, you're going to need a car. We're getting more and more bike lanes but they're also very unequally distributed and biking is...not great for winter.
steveBK123 3y ago
Two issue - US is incapable of building transit infra. We should be able, but the last 50 years have shown otherwise. Making driving harder and praying that somehow makes transit good is not a solution, though many cities are now trying that. I think a lot of Euros misunderestimate (to quote Dubya) how much more extreme North American city climates are. Using wikipedia data, Amsterdam's lowest mean temperature month is January at 3.8C, and highest mean temperature month is July at 18.1C. Chicago has 3 months below 3.8C per year, in fact it's below 0C for 3 months. Plus 4 months above 18.1C. Some of our climates just aren't terribly comfortable for biking here. NYC is not much better either.

Symbiote 3y ago

That seems shockingly cheap. Was it really with paying someone to collect the coins and maintain the meters? In the center of Copenhagen parking during the daytime is $6/hour!

rubymancer 3y ago
25 cents/hour was indeed shockingly and delightfully cheap. I miss those days. I suppose it still is, compared to $6/hour.
bragr 3y ago
The metered street parking right now in LA is usually $0.50-$2.00/hour depending on the area so that seems quite normal to me. Our meters are pretty good too and you can pay in coins or card: https://ladotparking.org/parking-meters/single-multi-space-meters/ https://ladotparking.org/parking-meters/single-multi-space-m...
- Symbiote 3y ago
  That meter costs about $700 plus installation costs! http://www.mapc.org/wp-content/uploads/2018/03/IPS-MAPC-2018-Parking-Meter-Pricing-Matrix.pdf http://www.mapc.org/wp-content/uploads/2018/03/IPS-MAPC-2018... Though I suppose it makes the money back quickly enough. In much of Europe, rather than cheap 50¢/hr or whatever parking, it's more common to have no fee but still a time limit. (Or, in city centres, a high fee and a time limit.)

Etrnl_President 3y ago

It's not true privatization, if the taxpayer covers losses and enforcement, nor if taxes previously collected for the service aren't reduced. It's a merger of corporation and state, which is somethig Sorel advocated.

gok 3y ago

Free/cheap parking is a driving subsidy. In fact the old prices were even worse than that; the prices were not high enough to actually keep spaces available, so it ended up being more like a lottery system. The correct solution would have been to just raise prices and fix enforcement, but the city dug themselves into such a financial and political hole that it wasn't feasible to do without the sale.