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I'm not the type to hate on capitalism but Reddit's management is truly capitalism gone wrong. Ruining a public service for the profits of a few. What a waste.

by saiojd 3y ago

treeman79 3y ago
This is a prime example of why capitalism is good. If Reddit was state owned or equivalent with regulatory capture, then nothing could be done about it. Doesn’t matter how bad it is. Like the DMV. Now since Reddit is determined to shoot itself in the foot, new competitors can rise up and replace them. Reddit did the same to its predecessors. Capitalism punishes harshly companies that decide to be stupid.
- deleted 3y ago
  [deleted]
- lockhouse 3y ago
  Purely anecdotal, but I’ve already started to see noticeably less activity in a few of the subs I follow. It’s still a long way from dying, but it’s a promising start.
- dopidopHN 3y ago
  Yes, like BP. Such punishment.
- lesuorac 3y ago
  > Like the DMV. Whens the last time you've been to the DMV? The second MD started doing appointments it was 100x better. Even before appointments for simple things like returning plates there were people with ipads you could just checkout with.
  - kjghkjghkjgh 3y ago
    The last time I was at the DMV, I waited 4 hours for a 10 minute appointment.
    - Sohcahtoa82 3y ago
      DMV experiences vary wildly from state to state.
  - philwelch 3y ago
    Last year, I moved to Texas. Texas has a DMV, but most of its functions are semi-privatized so you can get your license plates from a private agency, which is super convenient. In contrast, I had to get my drivers license at the DPS, which was booked months out.
    - HeyLaughingBoy 3y ago
      Same in MN. Typically I'm in and out in less than 10 minutes. Just don't go at the end of the month!
- rainonmoon 3y ago
  "If x was state owned... nothing could be done about it." Is this fatalism or is the American disease truly that your democracy has inexorably evaporated? Theoretically you have much more input over state-owned functions than private ones. However that assumes you don't live in a dystopian oligarchy ruled by capital that has completely supplanted the function of your government. If that was the case though, surely that'd be a prime example of why capitalism is NOT good?
  - Sohcahtoa82 3y ago
    America has a huge problem with voter turnout.
- saiojd 3y ago
  That's a fair point about allowing competition. But frankly, it just sucks that Reddit choses to purposefully hurt its service. With social media, there's also a strong moating effect that is fundamentally anti-competitive.
- PhasmaFelis 3y ago
  If Reddit was state-owned, they wouldn't be desperately scrabbling for profitability and none of these problems would have happened in the first place. That's not to say they wouldn't have other problems, or that state-owned social media is a good idea at all, but this particular argument doesn't work.
WatchDog 3y ago
Apparently reddit isn’t profitable, so the current management aren’t exactly good capitalists.
- rchaud 3y ago
  Theyre not trying to be profitable, theyre trying to grow and earn a high company valuation. I agree that they have not done well on that front either, relative to the size of their user base.
  - randomdata 3y ago
    That is how they were operating, but with investors growing cold towards tech their old "Just secure another round of funding" they have leaned on has fallen short. Nobody is going to take a chance on a company that hasn't managed to reach that kind of growth after nearly 20 years when safe investments like CDs are paying 5%+. Long gone is the low interest rate environment where investing in places like Reddit was the only hope you had of seeing returns. The world has changed significantly in the last year or so. Today, Reddit is clamouring at anything to try and turn profitability around in order to keep the lights on. The runway only lasts so long.
randomdata 3y ago
I'm not sure that is the case. Reddit's problem is that they have consistently used up more value to run the service than they have been able to deliver in return. Now they are running around like chickens with their heads cut off desperately trying to find some way to increase the value provided/decrease the value needed to stave off certain death. A socially owned organization operated in the same manner would be suffering the same fate right now. The idea that exchanging parties expect trade of equal value is not a feature of capitalism. It is the basis of all economic systems; at least those which do not depend on an imagined post-scarcity world.
- lotsoweiners 3y ago
  > A socially owned organization operated in the same manner would be suffering the same fate right now. The thing is I don’t think a socially owned organization would have operated the same way. The core Reddit product of Reddit, text and links to images, is still valid today and what the long time users want. The expensive part: development/maintenance of new features like live streaming, mobile apps, recommendations algorithms, etc are all driven by profits and IPO hopes.
  - randomdata 3y ago
    > are all driven by profits and IPO hopes. If that is all that drove them, why did they not dig random holes on the Reddit campus instead? I think you will find that there was a belief that these features would provide the missing value. It is likely fair to say that it failed, but such is life. The socially owned telephone company in my neck of the woods, of which I and the rest of my community are members, once spent big to enter the cell phone market. It too failed to deliver on the necessary value and we eventually had to back away from offering the service. The operations manager has said it was the biggest mistake the organization has ever made. Being socially owned doesn't mean value will magically present itself. After all, beneath it all is still humans and all of their faults. In a similar vein, the original Reddit, Usenet, may not be strictly socially owned but shares a lot in common with social ownership. It too has, for all intents and purposes, failed. The core product is there: Text, links, and images, but it seems that's not enough. Few are willing to give up anything for those things. They really don't hold much, if any, value. The humans that lie beneath to keep it all working want something in return. And that something in return is what Reddit is, now desperately, trying to find. They took to try and find it, but one can only hold out on giving back for so long and the clock is ticking. Again, this is not something of capitalism. People not wanting to keep giving to people who won't give back in return has been around since the dawn of mankind, long before capitalism was invented. The laggard who always sleeps all day, offering nothing to the community, while the rest of the tribe works tirelessly has never been welcome and no economic system can change that fundamental truth.

I'm not the type to hate on capitalism but Reddit's management is truly capitalism gone wrong. Ruining a public service for the profits of a few. What a waste.

by saiojd 3y ago

I'm not the type to hate on capitalism but Reddit's management is truly capitalism gone wrong. Ruining a public service for the profits of a few. What a waste.

treeman79 3y ago

This is a prime example of why capitalism is good. If Reddit was state owned or equivalent with regulatory capture, then nothing could be done about it. Doesn’t matter how bad it is. Like the DMV. Now since Reddit is determined to shoot itself in the foot, new competitors can rise up and replace them. Reddit did the same to its predecessors. Capitalism punishes harshly companies that decide to be stupid.

deleted 3y ago
[deleted]
lockhouse 3y ago
Purely anecdotal, but I’ve already started to see noticeably less activity in a few of the subs I follow. It’s still a long way from dying, but it’s a promising start.
dopidopHN 3y ago
Yes, like BP. Such punishment.
lesuorac 3y ago
> Like the DMV. Whens the last time you've been to the DMV? The second MD started doing appointments it was 100x better. Even before appointments for simple things like returning plates there were people with ipads you could just checkout with.
- kjghkjghkjgh 3y ago
  The last time I was at the DMV, I waited 4 hours for a 10 minute appointment.
  - Sohcahtoa82 3y ago
    DMV experiences vary wildly from state to state.
- philwelch 3y ago
  Last year, I moved to Texas. Texas has a DMV, but most of its functions are semi-privatized so you can get your license plates from a private agency, which is super convenient. In contrast, I had to get my drivers license at the DPS, which was booked months out.
  - HeyLaughingBoy 3y ago
    Same in MN. Typically I'm in and out in less than 10 minutes. Just don't go at the end of the month!
rainonmoon 3y ago
"If x was state owned... nothing could be done about it." Is this fatalism or is the American disease truly that your democracy has inexorably evaporated? Theoretically you have much more input over state-owned functions than private ones. However that assumes you don't live in a dystopian oligarchy ruled by capital that has completely supplanted the function of your government. If that was the case though, surely that'd be a prime example of why capitalism is NOT good?
- Sohcahtoa82 3y ago
  America has a huge problem with voter turnout.
saiojd 3y ago
That's a fair point about allowing competition. But frankly, it just sucks that Reddit choses to purposefully hurt its service. With social media, there's also a strong moating effect that is fundamentally anti-competitive.
PhasmaFelis 3y ago
If Reddit was state-owned, they wouldn't be desperately scrabbling for profitability and none of these problems would have happened in the first place. That's not to say they wouldn't have other problems, or that state-owned social media is a good idea at all, but this particular argument doesn't work.

WatchDog 3y ago

Apparently reddit isn’t profitable, so the current management aren’t exactly good capitalists.

rchaud 3y ago
Theyre not trying to be profitable, theyre trying to grow and earn a high company valuation. I agree that they have not done well on that front either, relative to the size of their user base.
- randomdata 3y ago
  That is how they were operating, but with investors growing cold towards tech their old "Just secure another round of funding" they have leaned on has fallen short. Nobody is going to take a chance on a company that hasn't managed to reach that kind of growth after nearly 20 years when safe investments like CDs are paying 5%+. Long gone is the low interest rate environment where investing in places like Reddit was the only hope you had of seeing returns. The world has changed significantly in the last year or so. Today, Reddit is clamouring at anything to try and turn profitability around in order to keep the lights on. The runway only lasts so long.

randomdata 3y ago

I'm not sure that is the case. Reddit's problem is that they have consistently used up more value to run the service than they have been able to deliver in return. Now they are running around like chickens with their heads cut off desperately trying to find some way to increase the value provided/decrease the value needed to stave off certain death. A socially owned organization operated in the same manner would be suffering the same fate right now. The idea that exchanging parties expect trade of equal value is not a feature of capitalism. It is the basis of all economic systems; at least those which do not depend on an imagined post-scarcity world.

lotsoweiners 3y ago
> A socially owned organization operated in the same manner would be suffering the same fate right now. The thing is I don’t think a socially owned organization would have operated the same way. The core Reddit product of Reddit, text and links to images, is still valid today and what the long time users want. The expensive part: development/maintenance of new features like live streaming, mobile apps, recommendations algorithms, etc are all driven by profits and IPO hopes.
- randomdata 3y ago
  > are all driven by profits and IPO hopes. If that is all that drove them, why did they not dig random holes on the Reddit campus instead? I think you will find that there was a belief that these features would provide the missing value. It is likely fair to say that it failed, but such is life. The socially owned telephone company in my neck of the woods, of which I and the rest of my community are members, once spent big to enter the cell phone market. It too failed to deliver on the necessary value and we eventually had to back away from offering the service. The operations manager has said it was the biggest mistake the organization has ever made. Being socially owned doesn't mean value will magically present itself. After all, beneath it all is still humans and all of their faults. In a similar vein, the original Reddit, Usenet, may not be strictly socially owned but shares a lot in common with social ownership. It too has, for all intents and purposes, failed. The core product is there: Text, links, and images, but it seems that's not enough. Few are willing to give up anything for those things. They really don't hold much, if any, value. The humans that lie beneath to keep it all working want something in return. And that something in return is what Reddit is, now desperately, trying to find. They took to try and find it, but one can only hold out on giving back for so long and the clock is ticking. Again, this is not something of capitalism. People not wanting to keep giving to people who won't give back in return has been around since the dawn of mankind, long before capitalism was invented. The laggard who always sleeps all day, offering nothing to the community, while the rest of the tribe works tirelessly has never been welcome and no economic system can change that fundamental truth.