7 ms·

The second a wifi 6e (6ghz) router is supported I'll be on the openwrt train again. Until then, I'm stuck with my ISP router because it has faster wireless spee

by Snuupy 3y ago

The second a wifi 6e (6ghz) router is supported I'll be on the openwrt train again. Until then, I'm stuck with my ISP router because it has faster wireless speeds than the openwrt routers available. DIY is an option but also way more expensive. See below for why I care so much about 6ghz.

slabity 3y ago
> DIY is an option but also way more expensive. This has recently become far cheaper over the past few years. You can now get quite powerful fanless computers that come with 4-6x 2.5GBe ports, and they typically have a slot on the board that you can put whatever Wifi card you want in. Yes, they are still more expensive at around $200-300 for the computer (even without memory, storage, or wifi card), but considering a few years ago you'd need to spend nearly twice that for a similar system (and usually with only 1GBe), it's becoming a much more attractive offer to start a home-lab with. Serve The Home has some excellent videos on these mini-computers that I highly recommend: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6rtRwKlJTgU https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6rtRwKlJTgU https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=58nVTNYrJ3E https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=58nVTNYrJ3E
- hinkley 3y ago
  And no one is selling a turnkey version of these yet?
- tetris11 3y ago
  Are there any setups which can act as a modem too (coax in?)
  - denkmoon 3y ago
    Not really. Put your coax modem into bridge mode. There aren't any DOCSIS 3+ pcie cards afaik, and these devices don't usually have pcie slots available (maybe nvme, but that would require an adapter and a new chassis)
- fullstop 3y ago
  I have a qotom 5 port mini-pc and it's fantastic. Openwrt x86 is wonderful.
- Snuupy 3y ago
  In order to replicate the functionality of an access point, the device needs to support all 3 bands (2.4/5/6), not just have a slot for whichever single band I want to support. That DIY setup has a lot more compute for routing, but actually does worse in trying to be used as an actual (wireless) access point (and still costs more).
  - slabity 3y ago
    > In order to replicate the functionality of an access point, the device needs to support all 3 bands (2.4/5/6), not just have a slot for whichever single band I want to support. Many cards support multiple bands concurrently. Some of these devices have multiple slots as well, and if it doesn't you can get an NVMe to mPCIe adapter to enable a second slot. I personally use a Mediatek card for dual-band 2.4GHz + 6GHz and a USB adapter for the 5GHz band (mostly because I don't have an adapter for fitting more than 4 antennae). > That DIY setup has a lot more compute for routing, but actually does worse in trying to be used as an actual (wireless) access point (and still costs more). You don't need a lot of compute for routing packets, especially if you are able to set up flowtables and bypass most of that processing anyways. The extra compute is excellent for other services that you might set up on it though, which is why I explicitly mentioned it's a good starting point for a home lab. All that aside, the real cost of DIY isn't the dollar amount. It's the time and effort required to set it up and maintain it. The only point I mentioned about cost is that it's significantly cheaper than it was a few years ago. If all you want is to reduce cost then it's unlikely you can beat recycling an old desktop computer with an additional 6E card thrown in.
orev 3y ago
The nature of open source community projects is they’re generally slower to get hardware support than commercial developers. That’s not a knock against openwrt (or any project), just the reality. 6E support will probably land once WiFi 7 is on the horizon, so if you approach things like this, you’ll always be waiting. Is 6E that much better (in applications where openwrt is typically used) than 6 to justify waiting for 6E?
- Snuupy 3y ago
  Yes. 6 GHz spectrum has 7 channels that are 160 MHz wide. Contrast that to the 5 GHz spectrum which only has 2 channels that are 80 MHz wide (excluding DFS). DFS is not an option in many places, and even the US only gets 1 channel that is 160 MHz wide (also DFS). 5 GHz spectrum is almost always congested and gets half the spectrum width. See: https://www.duckware.com/tech/wifi-in-the-us.html#wifi6e https://www.duckware.com/tech/wifi-in-the-us.html#wifi6e

by Snuupy 3y ago

slabity 3y ago

> DIY is an option but also way more expensive. This has recently become far cheaper over the past few years. You can now get quite powerful fanless computers that come with 4-6x 2.5GBe ports, and they typically have a slot on the board that you can put whatever Wifi card you want in. Yes, they are still more expensive at around $200-300 for the computer (even without memory, storage, or wifi card), but considering a few years ago you'd need to spend nearly twice that for a similar system (and usually with only 1GBe), it's becoming a much more attractive offer to start a home-lab with. Serve The Home has some excellent videos on these mini-computers that I highly recommend: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6rtRwKlJTgU https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6rtRwKlJTgU https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=58nVTNYrJ3E https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=58nVTNYrJ3E

hinkley 3y ago
And no one is selling a turnkey version of these yet?
tetris11 3y ago
Are there any setups which can act as a modem too (coax in?)
- denkmoon 3y ago
  Not really. Put your coax modem into bridge mode. There aren't any DOCSIS 3+ pcie cards afaik, and these devices don't usually have pcie slots available (maybe nvme, but that would require an adapter and a new chassis)
fullstop 3y ago
I have a qotom 5 port mini-pc and it's fantastic. Openwrt x86 is wonderful.
Snuupy 3y ago
In order to replicate the functionality of an access point, the device needs to support all 3 bands (2.4/5/6), not just have a slot for whichever single band I want to support. That DIY setup has a lot more compute for routing, but actually does worse in trying to be used as an actual (wireless) access point (and still costs more).
- slabity 3y ago
  > In order to replicate the functionality of an access point, the device needs to support all 3 bands (2.4/5/6), not just have a slot for whichever single band I want to support. Many cards support multiple bands concurrently. Some of these devices have multiple slots as well, and if it doesn't you can get an NVMe to mPCIe adapter to enable a second slot. I personally use a Mediatek card for dual-band 2.4GHz + 6GHz and a USB adapter for the 5GHz band (mostly because I don't have an adapter for fitting more than 4 antennae). > That DIY setup has a lot more compute for routing, but actually does worse in trying to be used as an actual (wireless) access point (and still costs more). You don't need a lot of compute for routing packets, especially if you are able to set up flowtables and bypass most of that processing anyways. The extra compute is excellent for other services that you might set up on it though, which is why I explicitly mentioned it's a good starting point for a home lab. All that aside, the real cost of DIY isn't the dollar amount. It's the time and effort required to set it up and maintain it. The only point I mentioned about cost is that it's significantly cheaper than it was a few years ago. If all you want is to reduce cost then it's unlikely you can beat recycling an old desktop computer with an additional 6E card thrown in.

orev 3y ago

The nature of open source community projects is they’re generally slower to get hardware support than commercial developers. That’s not a knock against openwrt (or any project), just the reality. 6E support will probably land once WiFi 7 is on the horizon, so if you approach things like this, you’ll always be waiting. Is 6E that much better (in applications where openwrt is typically used) than 6 to justify waiting for 6E?

Snuupy 3y ago
Yes. 6 GHz spectrum has 7 channels that are 160 MHz wide. Contrast that to the 5 GHz spectrum which only has 2 channels that are 80 MHz wide (excluding DFS). DFS is not an option in many places, and even the US only gets 1 channel that is 160 MHz wide (also DFS). 5 GHz spectrum is almost always congested and gets half the spectrum width. See: https://www.duckware.com/tech/wifi-in-the-us.html#wifi6e https://www.duckware.com/tech/wifi-in-the-us.html#wifi6e