8 ms·

"There will always be people with more time than money" - doesn't that mean "so-called pirates will always exist"? If that's the case, why should the rest of u

by bediger 15y ago

"There will always be people with more time than money" - doesn't that mean "so-called pirates will always exist"? If that's the case, why should the rest of us pay money for enforcement actions (in the form of taxes) and why should the rest of us allow a few Giant Immoral Corporations to distort our society and culture? Shouldn't our elected representatives patiently explain the economics to the crybaby corporations, and then politely tell them to go pound sand? This is a control issue, plain and simple. The market for "content" is changing from a very cozy oligopoly to a one where no single firm or cartel has very much monopoly power. It's our sacred duty as Americans and Free Market Advocates to cause a transition to a market that can better serve the needs of consumers. Mercantilism in the form of "DRM" or "Intellectual Property" must not stand!

paulhauggis 15y ago
It's pretty easy: stop buying DRM/protected products (and stop pirating them too). If there was no piracy and you just stopped buying, big companies would lower the price/do something different. But, now that they don't really know why, they will continue to add more protections. But, most people don't have that kind of commitment or discipline and the rest are just part of the movement because they want free stuff.
- bediger 15y ago
  If there's a legal (or standards-organization) mandate for DRM (and there have been legislative pushes for such in the past: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Consumer_Broadband_and_Digital_Television_Promotion_Act http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Consumer_Broadband_and_Digital_... , http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Content_Protection_for_Recordable_Media http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Content_Protection_for_Recordab... to note just two such efforts) then nothing I can do will move the market. But beyond all that, the whole "Piracy!" excuse doesn't take into account whether the proposed problem actually merits a solution, whether the proposed solution actually cures the problem, and whether the proposed solution causes more problems than it cures. "But, but, Piracy!" is just a way to whip up a confusing semantic fog around an issue, demonize a set of viewpoints, and use that demonization to pursue some kind of agenda that hardly anyone would go along with without the associated confusing and witchhunts. You're doing it yourself, subtly, by implying that I habitually "pirate" stuff, when nothing could be farther from the truth. Although I'm not a church-goer any more, I'm a citizen, and a taxpayer. I don't cuss, I obey the Law of the Sea, Canon Law, and the Laws of Thermodynamics. I do not advocate the violent overthrow of the government, and I have no conflicts of interest.
- CodeMage 15y ago
  Why do people always resort to the same argument ("stop buying") as if it were a solution? Isn't it obvious by now that it's not a solution and it's not going to happen? Voting with your wallet works when you can stop paying one company and go to its competitor. But if they all get together and decide that you have to do it their way or you're screwed, then guess what's going to happen? The majority will find the best way to procure what they need under the circumstances and the minority will fight to change the situation. It just happens that it in this particular situation the best way to procure what people need is not by choosing the least evil of the providers, but you have a choice to copy stuff for free, instead. Let's make things clear: this doesn't make it legal to pirate stuff. On the other hand, "legal", "correct", "practical" and "optimal" are never the same thing. Just as no amount of arguing will change the fact that piracy is (still) illegal, no amount of arguing will change the fact that the industry needs to evolve.
  - paulhauggis 15y ago
    "Why do people always resort to the same argument ("stop buying") as if it were a solution? Isn't it obvious by now that it's not a solution and it's not going to happen?" Whenever we have discussions about companies violating the GNU and people say "just don't use GNU software", I say the same thing. But the funny thing is, the same people that are fine with pirating are against essentially the same thing with the GNU license. What a world we live in. I'm going to keep bringing up these points until they stick. "Voting with your wallet works when you can stop paying one company and go to its competitor. But if they all get together and decide that you have to do it their way or you're screwed," You don't need music or movies to live. If they all decide to do it, just stop buying all together. This isn't new. I saw this same "movement" 10 years ago with Napster and it's nothing more than an excuse to get movies, music, and software for free. Music is so cheap. All of the original demands 10 years ago have been met. Guess what? piracy is worse than ever. It reminds me why you never negotiate with terrorists.
    - Natsu 15y ago
      > But the funny thing is, the same people that are fine with pirating are against essentially the same thing with the GNU license. They could be against it because it hinders sharing, not because it violates copyright.

by bediger 15y ago

paulhauggis 15y ago

It's pretty easy: stop buying DRM/protected products (and stop pirating them too). If there was no piracy and you just stopped buying, big companies would lower the price/do something different. But, now that they don't really know why, they will continue to add more protections. But, most people don't have that kind of commitment or discipline and the rest are just part of the movement because they want free stuff.

bediger 15y ago
If there's a legal (or standards-organization) mandate for DRM (and there have been legislative pushes for such in the past: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Consumer_Broadband_and_Digital_Television_Promotion_Act http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Consumer_Broadband_and_Digital_... , http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Content_Protection_for_Recordable_Media http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Content_Protection_for_Recordab... to note just two such efforts) then nothing I can do will move the market. But beyond all that, the whole "Piracy!" excuse doesn't take into account whether the proposed problem actually merits a solution, whether the proposed solution actually cures the problem, and whether the proposed solution causes more problems than it cures. "But, but, Piracy!" is just a way to whip up a confusing semantic fog around an issue, demonize a set of viewpoints, and use that demonization to pursue some kind of agenda that hardly anyone would go along with without the associated confusing and witchhunts. You're doing it yourself, subtly, by implying that I habitually "pirate" stuff, when nothing could be farther from the truth. Although I'm not a church-goer any more, I'm a citizen, and a taxpayer. I don't cuss, I obey the Law of the Sea, Canon Law, and the Laws of Thermodynamics. I do not advocate the violent overthrow of the government, and I have no conflicts of interest.
CodeMage 15y ago
Why do people always resort to the same argument ("stop buying") as if it were a solution? Isn't it obvious by now that it's not a solution and it's not going to happen? Voting with your wallet works when you can stop paying one company and go to its competitor. But if they all get together and decide that you have to do it their way or you're screwed, then guess what's going to happen? The majority will find the best way to procure what they need under the circumstances and the minority will fight to change the situation. It just happens that it in this particular situation the best way to procure what people need is not by choosing the least evil of the providers, but you have a choice to copy stuff for free, instead. Let's make things clear: this doesn't make it legal to pirate stuff. On the other hand, "legal", "correct", "practical" and "optimal" are never the same thing. Just as no amount of arguing will change the fact that piracy is (still) illegal, no amount of arguing will change the fact that the industry needs to evolve.
- paulhauggis 15y ago
  "Why do people always resort to the same argument ("stop buying") as if it were a solution? Isn't it obvious by now that it's not a solution and it's not going to happen?" Whenever we have discussions about companies violating the GNU and people say "just don't use GNU software", I say the same thing. But the funny thing is, the same people that are fine with pirating are against essentially the same thing with the GNU license. What a world we live in. I'm going to keep bringing up these points until they stick. "Voting with your wallet works when you can stop paying one company and go to its competitor. But if they all get together and decide that you have to do it their way or you're screwed," You don't need music or movies to live. If they all decide to do it, just stop buying all together. This isn't new. I saw this same "movement" 10 years ago with Napster and it's nothing more than an excuse to get movies, music, and software for free. Music is so cheap. All of the original demands 10 years ago have been met. Guess what? piracy is worse than ever. It reminds me why you never negotiate with terrorists.
  - Natsu 15y ago
    > But the funny thing is, the same people that are fine with pirating are against essentially the same thing with the GNU license. They could be against it because it hinders sharing, not because it violates copyright.