6 ms·

No there is not. This is drivel. Laughable nonsense. You're worked up about the current manufactured bogeyman of the present. This too shall pass.

monero-xmr 3y ago
[flagged]
- PaulDavisThe1st 3y ago
  Please define what you mean by "large" in this context.
  - monero-xmr 3y ago
    Tens of thousands of people organizing to discuss the life-destroying issue seems pretty large. Considering ranitidine (Zantac) was recalled for a small potential of causing cancer, it's odd that such documented negative experiences has not resulted in a banning of procedures (at least for children) until far more research is conducted. But hey, that's what happens when politics overtakes science.
- Timon3 3y ago
  Such stories exist for literally all medical interventions. Do you know how many elderly people deeply regret elective surgeries like hip or knee replacements? How many have tragic stories and want to make sure others don't fall into the same trap? The major difference between these cases is that the regret rate for transitioning is way, way lower than almost all other medical interventions. This is because we have a long process before anything permanent is done. If you wish to pay so much attention to de-transitioners, will you also look at the data and pay attention to the many, many more people who regret other medical interventions? Should we ban knee and hip replacements?
  - badpun 3y ago
    For reference, can you give rough percentages of regret after a sex change vs an average medical intervention?
    - Timon3 3y ago
      The NIH has done a meta-analysis of studies and came up with a regret rate of around 1% with a 95% confidence interval: > The pooled prevalence of regret among the TGNB population after GAS was 1% (95% Confidence interval [CI] <1%–2%; I2 = 75.1%) (Fig. (Fig.2).2). The prevalence for transmasculine surgeries was <1% (CI <1%–<1%, I2 = 28.8%), and for transfemenine surgeries, it was 1% (CI <1%–2%, I2 = 75.5%) (Fig. (Fig.3).3). The prevalence of regret after vaginoplasty was of 2% (CI <1%–4%, I2 = 41.5%) and that after mastectomy was <1% (CI <1–<1%, I2 = 21.8%) (Fig. (Fig.44). https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8099405/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8099405/ As a comparison, this study (which is not a meta-analysis, I couldn't quickly find one of those) for knee replacement surgery regret after one year had around 18%: > Total knee arthroplasty (TKA) is a common and effective procedure that is expected to be performed in increasing numbers in the future [1, 2]. Previous studies have shown 6–30% of patients are dissatisfied after the surgery, both in the presence and in the absence of postoperative complications [3–12]. In Sweden, about 8% of patients without documented complications are non-satisfied [13–15]. > Of the 348 patients who responded to a letter asking if they were satisfied or dissatisfied with their surgery, 61 (18%) reported discontent. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6961288/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6961288/ The latter number is of course a lot less reliable, but you'll find something similar - definitely above 1% - for most interventions.
      - froh 3y ago
        yes! and of that 1% more than 90% report that the unhappiness is driven by societal factors: rejection and oppression by their families or their faith communities or both, or at the workplace. no. the "DeTrAnSiTiNinG" narrative is a bogeyman narrative to narrowly get above the 50% needed in first past the post votes, with fake "concern" about "parental rights" which are purportedly "taken from concerned Christian parents". That subreddit is an artificial cesspool to feed that narrative in a context which is much less restrictive in its policies than HN. the trans communities in the US are in panicking paralysis for becoming the scapegoat. the reality is that treatment of gender dysphoria according to current standards of care is nothing less than a blessing for those few adolescents who happen to fall into that narrow diagnostic corridor. And they get _no_ surgeries if treated in a responsible setting. they get puberty blockers. the adolescent is reviewed and accompanied in the whole family situation to assess for potential psychopathologies (emotional abuse, munchausen by proxy, in simple terms: is this real or are the parents nuts) and _only then_ and after a long period of confidence building the adolescent grows into making permanent decisions about their life, as a then young adult. https://www.wpath.org/soc8 https://www.wpath.org/soc8 those adolescents who are lucky enough to receive such treatment at an early age have the chance to transition into a new life in their identified-with gender as completely inconspicuous well integrated happy adults. for gender dysphoric youths it's the best thing since sliced bread.

monero-xmr 3y ago

[flagged]

PaulDavisThe1st 3y ago
Please define what you mean by "large" in this context.
- monero-xmr 3y ago
  Tens of thousands of people organizing to discuss the life-destroying issue seems pretty large. Considering ranitidine (Zantac) was recalled for a small potential of causing cancer, it's odd that such documented negative experiences has not resulted in a banning of procedures (at least for children) until far more research is conducted. But hey, that's what happens when politics overtakes science.
Timon3 3y ago
Such stories exist for literally all medical interventions. Do you know how many elderly people deeply regret elective surgeries like hip or knee replacements? How many have tragic stories and want to make sure others don't fall into the same trap? The major difference between these cases is that the regret rate for transitioning is way, way lower than almost all other medical interventions. This is because we have a long process before anything permanent is done. If you wish to pay so much attention to de-transitioners, will you also look at the data and pay attention to the many, many more people who regret other medical interventions? Should we ban knee and hip replacements?
- badpun 3y ago
  For reference, can you give rough percentages of regret after a sex change vs an average medical intervention?
  - Timon3 3y ago
    The NIH has done a meta-analysis of studies and came up with a regret rate of around 1% with a 95% confidence interval: > The pooled prevalence of regret among the TGNB population after GAS was 1% (95% Confidence interval [CI] <1%–2%; I2 = 75.1%) (Fig. (Fig.2).2). The prevalence for transmasculine surgeries was <1% (CI <1%–<1%, I2 = 28.8%), and for transfemenine surgeries, it was 1% (CI <1%–2%, I2 = 75.5%) (Fig. (Fig.3).3). The prevalence of regret after vaginoplasty was of 2% (CI <1%–4%, I2 = 41.5%) and that after mastectomy was <1% (CI <1–<1%, I2 = 21.8%) (Fig. (Fig.44). https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8099405/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8099405/ As a comparison, this study (which is not a meta-analysis, I couldn't quickly find one of those) for knee replacement surgery regret after one year had around 18%: > Total knee arthroplasty (TKA) is a common and effective procedure that is expected to be performed in increasing numbers in the future [1, 2]. Previous studies have shown 6–30% of patients are dissatisfied after the surgery, both in the presence and in the absence of postoperative complications [3–12]. In Sweden, about 8% of patients without documented complications are non-satisfied [13–15]. > Of the 348 patients who responded to a letter asking if they were satisfied or dissatisfied with their surgery, 61 (18%) reported discontent. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6961288/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6961288/ The latter number is of course a lot less reliable, but you'll find something similar - definitely above 1% - for most interventions.
    - froh 3y ago
      yes! and of that 1% more than 90% report that the unhappiness is driven by societal factors: rejection and oppression by their families or their faith communities or both, or at the workplace. no. the "DeTrAnSiTiNinG" narrative is a bogeyman narrative to narrowly get above the 50% needed in first past the post votes, with fake "concern" about "parental rights" which are purportedly "taken from concerned Christian parents". That subreddit is an artificial cesspool to feed that narrative in a context which is much less restrictive in its policies than HN. the trans communities in the US are in panicking paralysis for becoming the scapegoat. the reality is that treatment of gender dysphoria according to current standards of care is nothing less than a blessing for those few adolescents who happen to fall into that narrow diagnostic corridor. And they get _no_ surgeries if treated in a responsible setting. they get puberty blockers. the adolescent is reviewed and accompanied in the whole family situation to assess for potential psychopathologies (emotional abuse, munchausen by proxy, in simple terms: is this real or are the parents nuts) and _only then_ and after a long period of confidence building the adolescent grows into making permanent decisions about their life, as a then young adult. https://www.wpath.org/soc8 https://www.wpath.org/soc8 those adolescents who are lucky enough to receive such treatment at an early age have the chance to transition into a new life in their identified-with gender as completely inconspicuous well integrated happy adults. for gender dysphoric youths it's the best thing since sliced bread.