7 ms·

Dear Rupert Murdoch: Let’s Talk Piracy & “The Simpsons”

95 points by prsimp 15y ago

spdy 15y ago
It`s 2012. I can get live footage of every event over the world within an hour good or bad (Youtube / Twitter / TV ) but cant watch my favorite tv-shows when i want. There are a total of 6 - The Walt Disney Company - Sony Pictures Entertainment - Paramount Pictures - Twentieth Century Fox - Universal Studios - Warner Bros. remaining movie studios who control the rights to nearly every popular movie / tv-show. What is mind blowing for me they rather sue mothers who torrent some music files then get their act together and create an iTunes Store for themselves. It could be so easy for them to create a joint venture and buy Netflix and Spotify. Those companies, given the right tools, can easily figure out a consumer model that would work for the majority of us. But no, they rather witch hunt for over a decade now and lobby more and more censorship laws in every country. I finally want to get to the point where i can watch what i want when i want.
froo 15y ago
This isn't a new argument. It's one we've been having in Australia (and presumably the rest of the world) for years now. These distribution issues become even worse for us as there are time where content isn't even available when you want to go actually pay for it. Then we have problems where content isn't available for months after its release. In a world where we are being involved in conversations that happen worldwide (eg, via Twitter), having to wait several months for that content to even become available (that's if it is available at all) is problematic at best and utterly stupid at worst. EDIT - because of spoilers Pirating content is just so much more convenient (which I'd imagine is at least part of the reason why its rampant). It shouldn't be easier to get content for free than to pay for it. Once you've paid for content, you shouldn't be made to feel like a criminal or have a reduced experience, which is what we are experiencing now with those "Pirating is stealing" unskippable ads at the beginning of those region locked DVD's they're so happy to sell us. No wonder they think they're losing, its because they are - and its their own damn fault.
philwelch 15y ago
I think Rupert Murdoch's myopia can be summed up by the name of one of his many businesses: "20th Century Fox".
fedd 15y ago
so when leasing airwaves Mr Murdoch is paying the OP? or i missed smth
- dangrossman 15y ago
  It's a bit of a mental stretch, but... the airwaves our "ours" because we pay taxes to fund the FCC to regulate them that way.
  - fedd 15y ago
    i thought vice versa, we pay taxes to operate/regulate anything that is in public domain ("ours" already), not that we buy it with our taxes from someone.
bricestacey 15y ago
I am not sure if it's possible on Roku, but on Boxee you could get around these lame restrictions by spoofing your user-agent.
- dangrossman 15y ago
  That worked on Google TV boxes for a week or two, years ago. Then they blocked it by the Flash player ID string embedded in the browser, so user agent spoofing doesn't work anymore.
MikeKusold 15y ago
Content not being able to be played through my Xbox is half the reason I didn't end up paying for Hulu when my free trial expired. The other half was that there was still ads, but that's an argument for a different day.
aresant 15y ago
I thought he was leading up to "convenience", the du jour argument for piracy. But buried at the end of the article he says: "Now, if I really wanted to watch last week’s episode, on my TV. . . I could buy it from Amazon or Apple iTunes. But don’t you think paying four times for the same content is a bit much?" Which I think is the more honest argument. Yah, we'll pay for it if it's easy. But not as much as you're asking, especially for network TV that you maybe forgot to TIvo.
tnuc 15y ago
Shouldn't a content provider have choice as to how you get to watch something? By making it so you can only watch it on demand through your cable TV channel Fox gets money from you in a number of different ways; The ads that screen before and during the show. The money the cable provider has to pay Fox to have the channel. The money the provider has to give Fox for the on demand service. Plus it stops the majority of armchair hackers from putting it up on youtube etc. If it was made available on the web, then Fox would only get a very small percentage of the ad money. And of course you wouldn't have to watch it when it's on TV. The aim is to keep you watching your TV and taking your money. People watching on the web don't pay as much attention to the ads. Fox doesn't promote piracy as much as it promotes getting you to sit on your couch most the evening, watching ads, eating Doritos and getting your daily dose of "Fair and Balanced" news. So DirectTV isn't listed as an on demand provider? Then change your provider to one that pays Fox what they demand. So don't forget to set your calender for next weeks episode. p.s. Life is better without a TV.
- DanBC 15y ago
  > Shouldn't a content provider have choice as to how you get to watch something? Yes. But when they make bad choices good people (who want to pay for the content) will mention those bad choices. And bad people (who don't want to pay for the content) will just pirate, sometimes using the bad choice as a justification. > Fox gets money from you in a number of different ways I don't know how it works so maybe I get this next part wrong, but limiting the ways that people can pay you is not a way to maximise income. > Plus it stops the majority of armchair hackers from putting it up on youtube etc I don't understand what you're saying; plenty of on-demand cable only content is available on torrents. Technical restrictions cause inconvenience to paying customers but have little to no affect on pirates.
- randomdata 15y ago
  Shouldn't a content provider have choice as to how you get to watch something? I'm not sure. Copyright exists for the sole purpose of providing incentive for people to create works for the rest of the population to enjoy. If the population cannot reasonably access that work, the intent of copyright protection is lost.
GigabyteCoin 15y ago
All of my friends pay $120/month for satellite/digital TV... I pay $120/month towards expanding my personal data storage space. Up to about 7 terabytes now..
hncommenter13 15y ago
I'm sorry but this is a classic episode of WMFS syndrome (aka, "where's my free shit?"). You can't have exactly what you want, when you want it for free, so it's someone else's fault. If you wanted the show, you could watch it right now. But you don't want it $3.99 (?) worth, or whatever iTunes/AMZN charges for it. Since you didn't avail yourself of the opportunity to watch it the first few times you had the chance, you pay for the privilege. You might not like it, but that's how it goes. You can't walk up to an airline and buy the same seat at the same price the day before it leaves, either, so this sort of price discrimination is hardly remarkable. First, as you say, you did have the chance to watch the over-the-air broadcast (for which Murdoch should pay you/the gov't for use of the airwaves; if you don't like the current financial arrangement, write your Congressman). You didn't avail yourself of that opportunity. Next, you could have DVRd it, as you say. But you didn't, for whatever reason. Now you are upset that Hulu Plus doesn't have it. Do you yell and scream when the public library doesn't happen to have purchased the book you want? Because you pay for those books too. Go get a refund from Hulu Plus, if you're unhappy, but it's an economic decision not to make it available on Hulu Plus or on Fox's website. The fact is, you had several chances to watch without paying more out of pocket. You missed them, so now you have to pay, if it's important to you. That is no one's fault but your own. Update: formatting
- sullivandanny 15y ago
  $125 per month for DirecTV. $7 per month for Hulu Plus. $7 per month for Netflix. Where do you see me saying I wanted it for free? The fact is, I can have it on demand and for free if I want to watch it through my computer. Or hook my computer up to my TV. Fox provides it this way. But if I want to watch it through a Roku or Google TV, from the same exact web site, from the same exact data stream, then I can't. And I can't, because, Fox is afraid that if they do it that way, I won't pay all the money I'm already paying to DirecTV in the first place. So lesson learned? I shouldn't bother with any of the payment options in the first place.
  - tnuc 15y ago
    >I shouldn't bother with any of the payment options in the first place. Many people on HN don't pay for any content. It's no secret how they do it but there is probably something in the rules that would see me stopped.
resnamen 15y ago
Murdoch just knows that post-Season 8 Simpsons isn't worth streaming. ;)
smoody 15y ago
"Blocking TV Devices Promotes The Piracy You Hate" That's like saying the high price of Porsches promotes car jacking. People are pro-theft or anti-theft. I'll never download copyrighted content without permission. It doesn't matter what anyone does. Having the Simpsons is a privilege, not a right. It wasn't that long ago that shows would air once and never be seen again (as far as audiences knew at the time) and I don't remember people rioting or breaking into studios to steal the original tapes because shows only aired a single time. When you steal copyrighted content, that's exactly what you're doing, even if you aren't busting down physical doors and rummaging through physical storage rooms. Just my two cents.
- aaronmoodie 15y ago
  "Having the Simpsons is a privilege, not a right" A $120+ a month privilege? If I was paying that much for TV, I'd be expecting to watch what I want when I want.
- thebooktocome 15y ago
  Ah, the "You wouldn't download a car" argument. The analogy is horrifically broken, because while it takes a non-trivial amount of effort to copy a Porsche (not 'steal' it, because piracy doesn't destroy the original -- but you knew that, right?) it takes a trivial amount of effort to copy digital media.
- prof_hobart 15y ago
  >It wasn't that long ago that shows would air once and never be seen again And it wasn't that long ago that no-one paid £120/month+ for their TV. >I don't remember people rioting or breaking into studios to steal the original tapes because shows only aired a single time. Firstly, can you not tell the difference between taking physical objects from someone thus depriving them of that object, and making a digital copy of an object that doesn't deprive anyone of anything? How is Rupert Murdoch worse off by someone downloading last week's episode from a torrent site than he would have been if they'd gone onto the official website and watched it there? Secondly, I'm pretty sure there was a fairly large amount of video lending/copying back in the day - obviously far less than today's copying, but it was a hell of a lot less convenient to do it back then than it is now.
Tim-Boss 15y ago
Rupert Murdoch loved MySpace and had no problem whatsoever with it's own piracy ('unauthorised' music on profiles, music videos constantly ripped etc)...until it failed!

95 points by prsimp 15y ago

spdy 15y ago

It`s 2012. I can get live footage of every event over the world within an hour good or bad (Youtube / Twitter / TV ) but cant watch my favorite tv-shows when i want. There are a total of 6 - The Walt Disney Company - Sony Pictures Entertainment - Paramount Pictures - Twentieth Century Fox - Universal Studios - Warner Bros. remaining movie studios who control the rights to nearly every popular movie / tv-show. What is mind blowing for me they rather sue mothers who torrent some music files then get their act together and create an iTunes Store for themselves. It could be so easy for them to create a joint venture and buy Netflix and Spotify. Those companies, given the right tools, can easily figure out a consumer model that would work for the majority of us. But no, they rather witch hunt for over a decade now and lobby more and more censorship laws in every country. I finally want to get to the point where i can watch what i want when i want.

froo 15y ago

This isn't a new argument. It's one we've been having in Australia (and presumably the rest of the world) for years now. These distribution issues become even worse for us as there are time where content isn't even available when you want to go actually pay for it. Then we have problems where content isn't available for months after its release. In a world where we are being involved in conversations that happen worldwide (eg, via Twitter), having to wait several months for that content to even become available (that's if it is available at all) is problematic at best and utterly stupid at worst. EDIT - because of spoilers Pirating content is just so much more convenient (which I'd imagine is at least part of the reason why its rampant). It shouldn't be easier to get content for free than to pay for it. Once you've paid for content, you shouldn't be made to feel like a criminal or have a reduced experience, which is what we are experiencing now with those "Pirating is stealing" unskippable ads at the beginning of those region locked DVD's they're so happy to sell us. No wonder they think they're losing, its because they are - and its their own damn fault.

philwelch 15y ago

I think Rupert Murdoch's myopia can be summed up by the name of one of his many businesses: "20th Century Fox".

fedd 15y ago

so when leasing airwaves Mr Murdoch is paying the OP? or i missed smth

dangrossman 15y ago
It's a bit of a mental stretch, but... the airwaves our "ours" because we pay taxes to fund the FCC to regulate them that way.
- fedd 15y ago
  i thought vice versa, we pay taxes to operate/regulate anything that is in public domain ("ours" already), not that we buy it with our taxes from someone.

bricestacey 15y ago

I am not sure if it's possible on Roku, but on Boxee you could get around these lame restrictions by spoofing your user-agent.

dangrossman 15y ago
That worked on Google TV boxes for a week or two, years ago. Then they blocked it by the Flash player ID string embedded in the browser, so user agent spoofing doesn't work anymore.

MikeKusold 15y ago

Content not being able to be played through my Xbox is half the reason I didn't end up paying for Hulu when my free trial expired. The other half was that there was still ads, but that's an argument for a different day.

aresant 15y ago

I thought he was leading up to "convenience", the du jour argument for piracy. But buried at the end of the article he says: "Now, if I really wanted to watch last week’s episode, on my TV. . . I could buy it from Amazon or Apple iTunes. But don’t you think paying four times for the same content is a bit much?" Which I think is the more honest argument. Yah, we'll pay for it if it's easy. But not as much as you're asking, especially for network TV that you maybe forgot to TIvo.

tnuc 15y ago

Shouldn't a content provider have choice as to how you get to watch something? By making it so you can only watch it on demand through your cable TV channel Fox gets money from you in a number of different ways; The ads that screen before and during the show. The money the cable provider has to pay Fox to have the channel. The money the provider has to give Fox for the on demand service. Plus it stops the majority of armchair hackers from putting it up on youtube etc. If it was made available on the web, then Fox would only get a very small percentage of the ad money. And of course you wouldn't have to watch it when it's on TV. The aim is to keep you watching your TV and taking your money. People watching on the web don't pay as much attention to the ads. Fox doesn't promote piracy as much as it promotes getting you to sit on your couch most the evening, watching ads, eating Doritos and getting your daily dose of "Fair and Balanced" news. So DirectTV isn't listed as an on demand provider? Then change your provider to one that pays Fox what they demand. So don't forget to set your calender for next weeks episode. p.s. Life is better without a TV.

DanBC 15y ago
> Shouldn't a content provider have choice as to how you get to watch something? Yes. But when they make bad choices good people (who want to pay for the content) will mention those bad choices. And bad people (who don't want to pay for the content) will just pirate, sometimes using the bad choice as a justification. > Fox gets money from you in a number of different ways I don't know how it works so maybe I get this next part wrong, but limiting the ways that people can pay you is not a way to maximise income. > Plus it stops the majority of armchair hackers from putting it up on youtube etc I don't understand what you're saying; plenty of on-demand cable only content is available on torrents. Technical restrictions cause inconvenience to paying customers but have little to no affect on pirates.
randomdata 15y ago
Shouldn't a content provider have choice as to how you get to watch something? I'm not sure. Copyright exists for the sole purpose of providing incentive for people to create works for the rest of the population to enjoy. If the population cannot reasonably access that work, the intent of copyright protection is lost.

GigabyteCoin 15y ago

All of my friends pay $120/month for satellite/digital TV... I pay $120/month towards expanding my personal data storage space. Up to about 7 terabytes now..

hncommenter13 15y ago

I'm sorry but this is a classic episode of WMFS syndrome (aka, "where's my free shit?"). You can't have exactly what you want, when you want it for free, so it's someone else's fault. If you wanted the show, you could watch it right now. But you don't want it $3.99 (?) worth, or whatever iTunes/AMZN charges for it. Since you didn't avail yourself of the opportunity to watch it the first few times you had the chance, you pay for the privilege. You might not like it, but that's how it goes. You can't walk up to an airline and buy the same seat at the same price the day before it leaves, either, so this sort of price discrimination is hardly remarkable. First, as you say, you did have the chance to watch the over-the-air broadcast (for which Murdoch should pay you/the gov't for use of the airwaves; if you don't like the current financial arrangement, write your Congressman). You didn't avail yourself of that opportunity. Next, you could have DVRd it, as you say. But you didn't, for whatever reason. Now you are upset that Hulu Plus doesn't have it. Do you yell and scream when the public library doesn't happen to have purchased the book you want? Because you pay for those books too. Go get a refund from Hulu Plus, if you're unhappy, but it's an economic decision not to make it available on Hulu Plus or on Fox's website. The fact is, you had several chances to watch without paying more out of pocket. You missed them, so now you have to pay, if it's important to you. That is no one's fault but your own. Update: formatting

sullivandanny 15y ago
$125 per month for DirecTV. $7 per month for Hulu Plus. $7 per month for Netflix. Where do you see me saying I wanted it for free? The fact is, I can have it on demand and for free if I want to watch it through my computer. Or hook my computer up to my TV. Fox provides it this way. But if I want to watch it through a Roku or Google TV, from the same exact web site, from the same exact data stream, then I can't. And I can't, because, Fox is afraid that if they do it that way, I won't pay all the money I'm already paying to DirecTV in the first place. So lesson learned? I shouldn't bother with any of the payment options in the first place.
- tnuc 15y ago
  >I shouldn't bother with any of the payment options in the first place. Many people on HN don't pay for any content. It's no secret how they do it but there is probably something in the rules that would see me stopped.

resnamen 15y ago

Murdoch just knows that post-Season 8 Simpsons isn't worth streaming. ;)

smoody 15y ago

"Blocking TV Devices Promotes The Piracy You Hate" That's like saying the high price of Porsches promotes car jacking. People are pro-theft or anti-theft. I'll never download copyrighted content without permission. It doesn't matter what anyone does. Having the Simpsons is a privilege, not a right. It wasn't that long ago that shows would air once and never be seen again (as far as audiences knew at the time) and I don't remember people rioting or breaking into studios to steal the original tapes because shows only aired a single time. When you steal copyrighted content, that's exactly what you're doing, even if you aren't busting down physical doors and rummaging through physical storage rooms. Just my two cents.

aaronmoodie 15y ago
"Having the Simpsons is a privilege, not a right" A $120+ a month privilege? If I was paying that much for TV, I'd be expecting to watch what I want when I want.
thebooktocome 15y ago
Ah, the "You wouldn't download a car" argument. The analogy is horrifically broken, because while it takes a non-trivial amount of effort to copy a Porsche (not 'steal' it, because piracy doesn't destroy the original -- but you knew that, right?) it takes a trivial amount of effort to copy digital media.
prof_hobart 15y ago
>It wasn't that long ago that shows would air once and never be seen again And it wasn't that long ago that no-one paid £120/month+ for their TV. >I don't remember people rioting or breaking into studios to steal the original tapes because shows only aired a single time. Firstly, can you not tell the difference between taking physical objects from someone thus depriving them of that object, and making a digital copy of an object that doesn't deprive anyone of anything? How is Rupert Murdoch worse off by someone downloading last week's episode from a torrent site than he would have been if they'd gone onto the official website and watched it there? Secondly, I'm pretty sure there was a fairly large amount of video lending/copying back in the day - obviously far less than today's copying, but it was a hell of a lot less convenient to do it back then than it is now.

Tim-Boss 15y ago

Rupert Murdoch loved MySpace and had no problem whatsoever with it's own piracy ('unauthorised' music on profiles, music videos constantly ripped etc)...until it failed!