6 ms·

So you want to raise children without gender?

kQq9oHeAz6wLLS 4y ago
That sound you hear is OPs point flying over your head
omgomgomgomg 4y ago
Well, I sometimes wish I was born an eagle because I like travelling, flying and chasing the sun. I am not going to try to have a surgery to make it happen. There is nobody with no gender, there are rarities with natural double gender features, but strictly speaking, nature assigns a gender during early pregnancy. All the ideas about gender changes occur to people later on and based on personal feelings/factors. The mind is something that develops by education and experience, not genetic urges as far I am aware. If schools and parents would educate kids saying theres no such thing like gender and you get to choose and society lets the promoters of such go rampant, I imagine this would not lead to a net positive outcome.
- simonsaysso 4y ago
  You are using gender to mean both sex and gender. You are assigned a biological sex by… biology. You get to choose your own gender.
  - omgomgomgomg 4y ago
    Well, fair enough, that concept has never been discussed during my education(that ended 20 years ago), so I am not in the loop except from what I have seen online about it. It seems it got a bit traction in the US, in Europe is relatively unheard of as of yet.
- flangola7 4y ago
  There are nonbinary people, such as myself. Public Universal Friend is another notable nonbinary person from history.
  - omgomgomgomg 4y ago
    Thanks for the heads up, please keep in mind I have never heard of that term until recently. In Europe this used to be called brashly scheduled cross dressing or something along the lines.
bauruine 4y ago
I'm from Switzerland so I may get "gender" wrong but yeah that is the progressive take here since the 2000s or so. That just means that you shouldn't force gender stereotypes on children. Let boys play with Barbies and wear pink if the like it and stuff like that. But nobody thought about their gender because of this, they are still boys. Nowadays, at least from what I read online, it feels like your gender depends on these sterotypes and if you don't conform to them you're trans.
- deanCommie 4y ago
  Those don't even need to be gender stereotypes. There is nothing (or there SHOULDN'T be) masculine about liking Trucks or Barbies. But there are things that at least today still fairly strongly tied to gender Expression. Wearing skirts. Painting nails. There used to be more such things! Wearing pants. Having a labour-based job. Feminism enabled women to pick and choose aspects of things gendered masculine and incorporate them as needed. The reverse hasn't caught up - mostly because of misogyny, honestly. It's reasonable that "Women want to be more like men". It's demeaning when men want to be more like women. But this is all still gender expression, not identity. Where does expression end and identity begins? The answer is actually very difficult to establish. This line is constantly shifting, but it takes decades. Is it possible that if we completely removed all social stigma on any kind of "gendered" expression, and allowed everyone to behave exactly how they want, would there be any gender binary remaining except biological? Would the majority of people end up some sort of "non-binary" and there would be no more reason to "transition"? It's possible. But that will take decades, and meanwhile there are people today, in today's society, who are suffering. And this is just me taking a very shallow look at the problem that is sympathetic to people who say things like "This transition thing doesn't make ay sense, just act how you act, you don't need hormones or surgery for that". There is another layer which is dysphoria, and then we get into a question of innate gender identity. I suspect a part of it remains. The only way we find out the reality of what humans are like, and how they belong in our society, is by being accepting, and welcoming, and believing those that are trying to tell us what they want and need. Unfortunately, to a lot of people, someone being "accepting" of an idea they disagree with, sounds like "encouragement" of the idea. So now you have all these stories of teachers grooming children to believe they're trans. And it's just b.s.

That sound you hear is OPs point flying over your head

Well, I sometimes wish I was born an eagle because I like travelling, flying and chasing the sun. I am not going to try to have a surgery to make it happen. There is nobody with no gender, there are rarities with natural double gender features, but strictly speaking, nature assigns a gender during early pregnancy. All the ideas about gender changes occur to people later on and based on personal feelings/factors. The mind is something that develops by education and experience, not genetic urges as far I am aware. If schools and parents would educate kids saying theres no such thing like gender and you get to choose and society lets the promoters of such go rampant, I imagine this would not lead to a net positive outcome.

simonsaysso 4y ago
You are using gender to mean both sex and gender. You are assigned a biological sex by… biology. You get to choose your own gender.
- omgomgomgomg 4y ago
  Well, fair enough, that concept has never been discussed during my education(that ended 20 years ago), so I am not in the loop except from what I have seen online about it. It seems it got a bit traction in the US, in Europe is relatively unheard of as of yet.
flangola7 4y ago
There are nonbinary people, such as myself. Public Universal Friend is another notable nonbinary person from history.
- omgomgomgomg 4y ago
  Thanks for the heads up, please keep in mind I have never heard of that term until recently. In Europe this used to be called brashly scheduled cross dressing or something along the lines.

bauruine 4y ago

I'm from Switzerland so I may get "gender" wrong but yeah that is the progressive take here since the 2000s or so. That just means that you shouldn't force gender stereotypes on children. Let boys play with Barbies and wear pink if the like it and stuff like that. But nobody thought about their gender because of this, they are still boys. Nowadays, at least from what I read online, it feels like your gender depends on these sterotypes and if you don't conform to them you're trans.

deanCommie 4y ago
Those don't even need to be gender stereotypes. There is nothing (or there SHOULDN'T be) masculine about liking Trucks or Barbies. But there are things that at least today still fairly strongly tied to gender Expression. Wearing skirts. Painting nails. There used to be more such things! Wearing pants. Having a labour-based job. Feminism enabled women to pick and choose aspects of things gendered masculine and incorporate them as needed. The reverse hasn't caught up - mostly because of misogyny, honestly. It's reasonable that "Women want to be more like men". It's demeaning when men want to be more like women. But this is all still gender expression, not identity. Where does expression end and identity begins? The answer is actually very difficult to establish. This line is constantly shifting, but it takes decades. Is it possible that if we completely removed all social stigma on any kind of "gendered" expression, and allowed everyone to behave exactly how they want, would there be any gender binary remaining except biological? Would the majority of people end up some sort of "non-binary" and there would be no more reason to "transition"? It's possible. But that will take decades, and meanwhile there are people today, in today's society, who are suffering. And this is just me taking a very shallow look at the problem that is sympathetic to people who say things like "This transition thing doesn't make ay sense, just act how you act, you don't need hormones or surgery for that". There is another layer which is dysphoria, and then we get into a question of innate gender identity. I suspect a part of it remains. The only way we find out the reality of what humans are like, and how they belong in our society, is by being accepting, and welcoming, and believing those that are trying to tell us what they want and need. Unfortunately, to a lot of people, someone being "accepting" of an idea they disagree with, sounds like "encouragement" of the idea. So now you have all these stories of teachers grooming children to believe they're trans. And it's just b.s.