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Ah yes, and the Internet is just a series of tubes.

GaggiX 4y ago
I don't know what your strange definition of the internet has to do with my comment, but just to stay on topic, the internet is also a tool we used, to communicate or inform ourselves, we are talking about the relationship between thing X and humans, not its definition.
- programmarchy 4y ago
  It’s a metaphor (a bad one) made famous by a US Senator. I used it to invoke the importance of metaphor. We absolutely need metaphors (good ones) to explain technology to not only the public, but also to the people who legislate. The Internet is not just a tool in the same way that a hammer or a dishwasher is a tool because it has had a totally transformative effect on humanity. It’s on the level of fire, gun powder, or the printing press. And there are inklings that the same argument could be made for AI. So your comment is just completely missing the point. “The medium is the message.”
  - GaggiX 4y ago
    One should use good (hopefully) metaphors to explain technology as you said, this is done all the time, but here we want to define the relationship between humans and thing X, and I would say there is no difference in the relationship with AIs as with all other tools, I would not treat a hammer differently from a printing press because it has less transformative effect on humanity.
    - programmarchy 4y ago
      > I would not treat a hammer differently from a printing press because it has less transformative effect on humanity Total nonsense. There’s a reason the first amendment says nothing about hammers. To use a metaphor, it’s like saying there’s no reason to treat 1.5 and pi differently, because they’re both just numbers.
      - GaggiX 4y ago
        Tools are tools, their importance in history doesn't change the relationship we have with them, you can say it change the relationship between humans when a particular tool is used, but it feels kinda delusional believing that somehow I will have a different relationship between two inanimate objects like an hammer or a printing press. I also noticed that your arguments are always centered on the United States. EDIT: you added an edit with a metaphor that talks about numbers, but also no, I would not have a different relationship between two abstract concepts like 1.5 or pi, I would use them when necessary.
koheripbal 4y ago
I always thought the criticism of that quote was misplaced. In networking it's extremely common for us to refer to connections as "Pipes". It's even embedded in many of the programming languages exactly as such. It's also important to note, that he never used the word "just" - that's a misquote.

I don't know what your strange definition of the internet has to do with my comment, but just to stay on topic, the internet is also a tool we used, to communicate or inform ourselves, we are talking about the relationship between thing X and humans, not its definition.

programmarchy 4y ago
It’s a metaphor (a bad one) made famous by a US Senator. I used it to invoke the importance of metaphor. We absolutely need metaphors (good ones) to explain technology to not only the public, but also to the people who legislate. The Internet is not just a tool in the same way that a hammer or a dishwasher is a tool because it has had a totally transformative effect on humanity. It’s on the level of fire, gun powder, or the printing press. And there are inklings that the same argument could be made for AI. So your comment is just completely missing the point. “The medium is the message.”
- GaggiX 4y ago
  One should use good (hopefully) metaphors to explain technology as you said, this is done all the time, but here we want to define the relationship between humans and thing X, and I would say there is no difference in the relationship with AIs as with all other tools, I would not treat a hammer differently from a printing press because it has less transformative effect on humanity.
  - programmarchy 4y ago
    > I would not treat a hammer differently from a printing press because it has less transformative effect on humanity Total nonsense. There’s a reason the first amendment says nothing about hammers. To use a metaphor, it’s like saying there’s no reason to treat 1.5 and pi differently, because they’re both just numbers.
    - GaggiX 4y ago
      Tools are tools, their importance in history doesn't change the relationship we have with them, you can say it change the relationship between humans when a particular tool is used, but it feels kinda delusional believing that somehow I will have a different relationship between two inanimate objects like an hammer or a printing press. I also noticed that your arguments are always centered on the United States. EDIT: you added an edit with a metaphor that talks about numbers, but also no, I would not have a different relationship between two abstract concepts like 1.5 or pi, I would use them when necessary.

koheripbal 4y ago

I always thought the criticism of that quote was misplaced. In networking it's extremely common for us to refer to connections as "Pipes". It's even embedded in many of the programming languages exactly as such. It's also important to note, that he never used the word "just" - that's a misquote.