7 ms·

Earlier today I sent my SO a long string of text messages about a problem that I was having, including one of them that said "I feel like garbage." I was feelin

Earlier today I sent my SO a long string of text messages about a problem that I was having, including one of them that said "I feel like garbage." I was feeling really down. They didn't respond to any of the text messages; when they got home, I asked them about it, and it seemed like they just sort of skimmed them and they didn't notice that one in particular. I didn't mention it; I just let it go. Do I "not understand how I feel" because I feel lonely right now? Or is communication not a one way street? Most of the time when I miscommunicate with someone, I find it's as much about their not wanting to understand as it is about my being unclear. As a man, I have lots of people in my life who love me, but they consistently fail to take notice of my emotional needs. When I express that I have emotional needs, all I get in response is a "deer in the headlights" look, from other men, from women, from parents, from friends, from my SO. So usually I just keep them to myself because I don't see the point in asking for something that someone can't offer me - a tremendously lonely experience. Do I "not understand myself?" Am I not speaking clearly enough? No, the idea that I might need something from the people who rely on me terrifies them, and they freeze up and stutter and generally are unable to offer me any assistance. And of course, I'm sure all of us experienced during the pandemic the loneliness of not having access to other people or being able to fulfill your social needs - distinct from the loneliness of being with people who don't understand you.

RHSman2 4y ago
How are they doing? Perhaps they have stuff going on that you don’t see? A SO is just like you and the hard part is being able to share and open up. Because sometimes it isn’t right in a relationship and you can feel even lonelier.
Fauntleroy 4y ago
You might need to surround yourself with more compassionate people, if you truly feel that no one is willing to consider your emotional wants and needs.
- throwaway11823 4y ago
  They are lovely and compassionate people, they're simply unable to extend that to me, partly because they're blinded by societal expectations of men (they often don't really see me as an emotional creature), partly because they lean on me for support, and so the idea that I might not be an unshakable pillar is terrifying for them. When I go to them for support, it's not that they don't want to provide it, it's that they fail to. I'm sure that somewhere out there is a person (or hundreds or thousands of people) who would be a perfect friend to me, but I doubt I'll ever meet them. It's pretty difficult to make friends as an adult, and every friendship I have made as an adult has been fleeting and fairly shallow. It's bearable. Therapists exist for a reason.
  - Remnant44 4y ago
    I feel this one deeply. I was in a similar situation in a past relationship; The traditional male role of "unshakeable pillar" meant that support was a one directional flow only, and any mention of feeling down or bad would cause a huge fight or fear response. Unfortunately I don't have any great advice to solve this, except that therapy can be really helpful here, if just to provide a compassionate person to talk to.
  - whstl 4y ago
    I can relate. I actually had a friend tell me "if you ever think of killing yourself, get in touch with me" after an acquaintance committed suicide. Well, I did have a depressive episode and got in touch for help, but got radio silence. Soon after the friendship was dead, he lost interest and couldn't hang out. Now I rely on therapy only.
    - bittercynic 4y ago
      I don't want to excuse your ex-friend's behavior, but I'm afraid a lot of people have no idea how to be of use to a friend who's going through such an episode. Suggestions to those who don't know what to do: Can I take you out to lunch? I found a new spot I think you might like. Want to go to <nearby park> and take a walk? Want to play catch? Want to come over for dinner? I was hung up for a long time because I don't know how to solve any serious personal problems, so I thought I couldn't be of any use. But just being there for someone, inviting them to something nice, and being a good listener can help. And it might be enjoyable for you, too.
- HardlyCurious 4y ago
  It isn't a choice for most men to just surround themselves with compassionate people. It's hard to find them for one, and often you won't really know until you have gotten to know them a bit. And this assumes they are even interested in exploring a friendship with you.
deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
fleddr 4y ago
"As a man, I have lots of people in my life who love me, but they consistently fail to take notice of my emotional needs." Although every man's circles are different, your experience is highly common. I'm going to intentionally dramatize a little to get the point across efficiently. Men effectively live in an emotional desert. Showing emotion, vulnerability or dependency is discouraged, dismissed or even ridiculed. Men lack a support system. They're often the last buck and there's nothing or nobody to back them up. This is why to many men, their relation with their mother is holy. It's often the only source of genuine unconditional love and a safe place to be vulnerable. Of course, you can't even have that, this too is to be ridiculed, hence the many "your mum" jokes. When men get sick, they're ridiculed for being such a baby. Here too a rare sign of vulnerability expressed is to be laughed at. Men are judged by utility. Society doesn't care about men's needs or problems. They are willingly sacrificed in war, work, homeless on the streets, and in suicide without this even being a topic of mainstream interest. The handful of reasonable feminists spotting how this complete indifference is a problem are shouted down by their radical counterparts, that have seized the movement. Not only is there no mainstream culture to care about men, it's openly hostile to men in general. If I were to post my little lecture on a social network, I'd be piled on with: "oh you poor man, you have it sooooo bad lmao!!!" Anyway, I know none of this helps, but I just wanted to share that your experience in many ways is the experience of many if not most men. And I think you analyzed the situation very well with the "deer in the headlights" remark.
- throwaway11823 4y ago
  Thank you for sharing. It is definitely underappreciated how the patriarchy simultaneously oppresses and privileges men. I'm sorry if you've had bad experiences with online dog-piling, but I'll note that understanding intersectional feminism has been important for my own personal understanding of my gender and the ways it negatively impacts my life (or positively for that matter). I think dog-piling is universal and a product of unhealthy discourse and the way online spaces erases nuance.
  - fleddr 4y ago
    The female part of the patriarchy (a word I hate) is not to be underestimated. The idea that men should be more in touch with their emotions is nothing but a narrative, reality is exactly opposite to it. Women do not select for emotional men. They select for status, wealth, attractiveness. Only when those qualities are met FIRST, perhaps you may also share some feelings here and there, but do keep that shit in check. The above sounds brutal and primitive, but every social study and dating research confirms it. And it makes perfect sense as it 100% aligns with biological incentives, as much as we want to deny those.
kipple 4y ago
> I sent my SO a long string of text messages about a problem that I was having, including one of them that said "I feel like garbage." Is it possible you buried the lede? I'm a fellow sender of long strings of text messages. I've found that not everyone appreciates my potentially sprawling/parallel communication style. They don't always have the time or capacity to pick through all my words and respond thoughtfully to each point. I used to take it personally, until I realized I was just being overwhelming. Now, if one thing in particular matters to me, I focus on communicating that one thing. I leave the rest on the back burner for more casual conversation.
- throwaway11823 4y ago
  I think that's more or less what happened, I don't blame them. Just demonstrating that understanding yourself and expressing yourself clearly are necessary but not sufficient to be understood and to feel seen.
  - 121789 4y ago
    Well the truth is that you didn’t express yourself effectively. My SO has done something similar, and being on the other side of an emotional text barrage feels like someone is thoughtlessly unloading their issues onto you. Get a therapist and some friends for casual “therapeutic” complaining and save any real issues you have to more appropriate mediums like a call or face to face.
    - mise_en_place 4y ago
      I was going to chime in with the same advice. It’s difficult to respond to walls of text. My cousin is notorious for sending these kinds of walls of text and it is impossible to parse correctly and quickly. Text isn’t a great medium for that, in person or a call would be better suited for it.
    - deleted 4y ago
      [deleted]
    - throwaway11823 4y ago
jimkleiber 4y ago
> it seemed like they just sort of skimmed them and they didn't notice that one in particular. I didn't mention it; I just let it go. I sometimes wonder if I feel more lonely when I "let it go" aka suppress how I'm feeling. I imagine if it were me, I may have felt annoyed or sad or confused that they didn't see the "I feel like garbage" part and didn't reply to it, and when I"m feeling courageous, sometimes I'll say that to them. I think I've noticed that when people have that deer in the headlights look, I can slowly start to suppress more and more things about how I'm feeling and then sometimes feel stuck, wanting to go deeper and also trying to respect that they may already feel overwhelmed. I don't know if there's an answer in any of what I wrote above, just wanted to share how I can struggle with this as well.
HardlyCurious 4y ago
It's a shitty situation, and it seems all too common for men. The usual knee jerk response is to blame the men for being unable to communicate effectively. I think the sad truth is that not everyone is cared about equally, and sometimes it is everyone else's fault. But it isn't like you can get mad about it. That is just going to push people away and make them bitter toward you.
vorpalhex 4y ago
One way we can help people help us is to give them an ask - "I feel like garbage. Can you deal with dinner?" or "I feel like garbage. Do you have time to chat with me?" People need scripts and many people struggle to provide active support to someone they view as supportive. Giving them a script can help.
cat_plus_plus 4y ago
It's very hard to deal with unactionable bad news. You need to be in a good place yourself, because this will bring you down with no obvious means of relief. Then you need to be free from all distractions and commitments to figure out how to respond, either by doing something or even just the kind of active listening that requires concentration and emotional commitment. If you ask for something specific and especially something your partner will not totally hate doing, you will make it easier for them to be there for you. "Can you make me my favorite comfort food for dinner tonight?"
someone11823 4y ago
I have gone through literally this exact same scenario. I'll send my partner texts during the day and they'll ignore them even through their lunch/breaks, or skim them and miss something important. I get to the point sometimes where I have to stop texting them, even about unrelated topics or important updates, because I know the number of texts will build up too much and when they see it they won't read any of them. As is common, my partner is dependent on me. I am her rock and the breadwinner for our family. She doesn't provide enough emotional support, I have to constantly hold back my emotional needs. Maybe she is emotionally underdeveloped. Like hell, I have to remind her to say caring things to me, and even then sometimes they don't know what to say even with a prompt. I'm curious how many of these other things you relate to or you have in common with me. I'm also curious, does your partner have ADHD?
- klohto 4y ago
  Chiming in, same experience. Partner has ADHD, but I feel like it’s so common nowadays it can be cause of everything. You have rock solid support system elsewhere I see. I’m curious how do you feel about them ignoring the texts? Would you feel different, perhaps even insecure if the your partner wasn’t dependent on you?
_rs 4y ago
I wonder if this is related to "bids for attention" in a way (see https://www.gottman.com/blog/turn-toward-instead-of-away/ https://www.gottman.com/blog/turn-toward-instead-of-away/) - you reaching out to your partner hoping for acknowledgement and not getting any response
throwaway223145 4y ago
You mentioned that you're not sure about how to improve the one-sided empathy situation with your SO. So I thought it might be helpful to share some pertinent info that I've come across on HN in the past. I feel that the article and comment discussion on the "Intentionally making close friends" post (https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=33774353 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=33774353) may offer some actionable advice. Also, see the authors other post specifically on "debugging others" (https://www.neelnanda.io/blog/30-debugging-others https://www.neelnanda.io/blog/30-debugging-others). My own advice is to be direct with your SO about your needs / expectations not being met. I went through the same thing with my SO. We went to couples therapy for many years with no improvement, until eventually they realized it was serious enough of a problem to lead to the end of the relationship, prompting them to put in the necessary effort to change. Another poster mentioned Gottman "bids for attention" which is spot on as well. Both partners in the relationship need to show up for each other to provide emotional support. Some people are simply more used to receiving support and don't know how / aren't used to providing it. It should be made clear that this is unacceptable and needs to change, but also that you are willing to give it time and work with your SO to help them gradually improve their empathetic capacity so that they can be a better partner to you (and better person in general) and keep your relationship healthy. I think it's also important to note that balance is key. You need to be mindful not to overload the other person's empathetic capacity by venting so much that they never have a chance to vent to you or to relax / recharge. If your SO is dealing with a lot of emotional distress themselves, they simply won't have bandwidth for you. We can never be perfect emotional support for each other, because each person deals with their own emotional distress / stressful events which temporarily limits their available empathetic capacity.
- someone11823 4y ago
  > It should be made clear that this is unacceptable and needs to change, but also that you are willing to give it time and work with your SO to help them gradually improve their empathetic capacity so that they can be a better partner to you (and better person in general) and keep your relationship healthy. When I wrote my sibling comment it didn't come to mind, but this is exactly part of what I'm feeling as well - a strong lack of empathy on the part of my partner. It could be due to an underdeveloped insula or orbitofrontal cortexes from some of the reading I've done. This falls in line with my understanding of them having an avoidant attachment style, too, which generally I've heard is also due to being underdeveloped, compared to avoidant and securely attached individuals. I also likely exhibit "too much" empathy myself, which is a heck of a pairing. It's not easy for me to feel like I need to "tune down" how receptive I am to my partners every little issue or negative expression and try to be there for them - but it is just so unequal otherwise, sometimes to both of our detriment. I am guessing also I need to give them space to feel negative feelings before jumping in so quickly. I have been direct with my partner in the past about my needs not being met, as you suggest, but I think the conversation needs to happen again (and again?) as reminders and check-ins maybe? It doesn't feel good to have to do this though, especially during moments of distress when I really need them. > We went to couples therapy for many years with no improvement, until eventually they realized it was serious enough of a problem to lead to the end of the relationship, prompting them to put in the necessary effort to change In your case, was it truly just a matter of willpower on the part of your partner? How have things been since? Since you seem more well read on the subject than myself: are there exercises or skills to help build someones empathetic capacity? Anything I can do (perhaps without involving/telling my partner directly) to help them? Behaviors of my own that I can change to get us going in the right direction? Can I get this change from my partner without threatening the relationship itself as you had to do? I feel like that would undermine all the effort and reassurance I've put in, that they so badly need to help develop and feel safe.
isthisthingon99 4y ago
I can relate (as a man) and can say it was only when I started hanging around other dudes who would relentlessly mock each other that my feelings improved.
darepublic 4y ago
I feel you. I am separated right now and sometimes I want desperately to be back in a relationship -- forgetting that even within a relationship it's no guarantee to not be lonely. Hope everything is okay with you. I just try to be stoical about everything and be not fight the negative emotions but learn to live with them. It helps.

RHSman2 4y ago

How are they doing? Perhaps they have stuff going on that you don’t see? A SO is just like you and the hard part is being able to share and open up. Because sometimes it isn’t right in a relationship and you can feel even lonelier.

Fauntleroy 4y ago

You might need to surround yourself with more compassionate people, if you truly feel that no one is willing to consider your emotional wants and needs.

throwaway11823 4y ago
They are lovely and compassionate people, they're simply unable to extend that to me, partly because they're blinded by societal expectations of men (they often don't really see me as an emotional creature), partly because they lean on me for support, and so the idea that I might not be an unshakable pillar is terrifying for them. When I go to them for support, it's not that they don't want to provide it, it's that they fail to. I'm sure that somewhere out there is a person (or hundreds or thousands of people) who would be a perfect friend to me, but I doubt I'll ever meet them. It's pretty difficult to make friends as an adult, and every friendship I have made as an adult has been fleeting and fairly shallow. It's bearable. Therapists exist for a reason.
- Remnant44 4y ago
  I feel this one deeply. I was in a similar situation in a past relationship; The traditional male role of "unshakeable pillar" meant that support was a one directional flow only, and any mention of feeling down or bad would cause a huge fight or fear response. Unfortunately I don't have any great advice to solve this, except that therapy can be really helpful here, if just to provide a compassionate person to talk to.
- whstl 4y ago
  I can relate. I actually had a friend tell me "if you ever think of killing yourself, get in touch with me" after an acquaintance committed suicide. Well, I did have a depressive episode and got in touch for help, but got radio silence. Soon after the friendship was dead, he lost interest and couldn't hang out. Now I rely on therapy only.
  - bittercynic 4y ago
    I don't want to excuse your ex-friend's behavior, but I'm afraid a lot of people have no idea how to be of use to a friend who's going through such an episode. Suggestions to those who don't know what to do: Can I take you out to lunch? I found a new spot I think you might like. Want to go to <nearby park> and take a walk? Want to play catch? Want to come over for dinner? I was hung up for a long time because I don't know how to solve any serious personal problems, so I thought I couldn't be of any use. But just being there for someone, inviting them to something nice, and being a good listener can help. And it might be enjoyable for you, too.
HardlyCurious 4y ago
It isn't a choice for most men to just surround themselves with compassionate people. It's hard to find them for one, and often you won't really know until you have gotten to know them a bit. And this assumes they are even interested in exploring a friendship with you.

deleted 4y ago

[deleted]

fleddr 4y ago

"As a man, I have lots of people in my life who love me, but they consistently fail to take notice of my emotional needs." Although every man's circles are different, your experience is highly common. I'm going to intentionally dramatize a little to get the point across efficiently. Men effectively live in an emotional desert. Showing emotion, vulnerability or dependency is discouraged, dismissed or even ridiculed. Men lack a support system. They're often the last buck and there's nothing or nobody to back them up. This is why to many men, their relation with their mother is holy. It's often the only source of genuine unconditional love and a safe place to be vulnerable. Of course, you can't even have that, this too is to be ridiculed, hence the many "your mum" jokes. When men get sick, they're ridiculed for being such a baby. Here too a rare sign of vulnerability expressed is to be laughed at. Men are judged by utility. Society doesn't care about men's needs or problems. They are willingly sacrificed in war, work, homeless on the streets, and in suicide without this even being a topic of mainstream interest. The handful of reasonable feminists spotting how this complete indifference is a problem are shouted down by their radical counterparts, that have seized the movement. Not only is there no mainstream culture to care about men, it's openly hostile to men in general. If I were to post my little lecture on a social network, I'd be piled on with: "oh you poor man, you have it sooooo bad lmao!!!" Anyway, I know none of this helps, but I just wanted to share that your experience in many ways is the experience of many if not most men. And I think you analyzed the situation very well with the "deer in the headlights" remark.

throwaway11823 4y ago
Thank you for sharing. It is definitely underappreciated how the patriarchy simultaneously oppresses and privileges men. I'm sorry if you've had bad experiences with online dog-piling, but I'll note that understanding intersectional feminism has been important for my own personal understanding of my gender and the ways it negatively impacts my life (or positively for that matter). I think dog-piling is universal and a product of unhealthy discourse and the way online spaces erases nuance.
- fleddr 4y ago
  The female part of the patriarchy (a word I hate) is not to be underestimated. The idea that men should be more in touch with their emotions is nothing but a narrative, reality is exactly opposite to it. Women do not select for emotional men. They select for status, wealth, attractiveness. Only when those qualities are met FIRST, perhaps you may also share some feelings here and there, but do keep that shit in check. The above sounds brutal and primitive, but every social study and dating research confirms it. And it makes perfect sense as it 100% aligns with biological incentives, as much as we want to deny those.

kipple 4y ago

> I sent my SO a long string of text messages about a problem that I was having, including one of them that said "I feel like garbage." Is it possible you buried the lede? I'm a fellow sender of long strings of text messages. I've found that not everyone appreciates my potentially sprawling/parallel communication style. They don't always have the time or capacity to pick through all my words and respond thoughtfully to each point. I used to take it personally, until I realized I was just being overwhelming. Now, if one thing in particular matters to me, I focus on communicating that one thing. I leave the rest on the back burner for more casual conversation.

throwaway11823 4y ago
I think that's more or less what happened, I don't blame them. Just demonstrating that understanding yourself and expressing yourself clearly are necessary but not sufficient to be understood and to feel seen.
- 121789 4y ago
  Well the truth is that you didn’t express yourself effectively. My SO has done something similar, and being on the other side of an emotional text barrage feels like someone is thoughtlessly unloading their issues onto you. Get a therapist and some friends for casual “therapeutic” complaining and save any real issues you have to more appropriate mediums like a call or face to face.
  - mise_en_place 4y ago
    I was going to chime in with the same advice. It’s difficult to respond to walls of text. My cousin is notorious for sending these kinds of walls of text and it is impossible to parse correctly and quickly. Text isn’t a great medium for that, in person or a call would be better suited for it.
  - deleted 4y ago
    [deleted]
  - throwaway11823 4y ago

jimkleiber 4y ago

> it seemed like they just sort of skimmed them and they didn't notice that one in particular. I didn't mention it; I just let it go. I sometimes wonder if I feel more lonely when I "let it go" aka suppress how I'm feeling. I imagine if it were me, I may have felt annoyed or sad or confused that they didn't see the "I feel like garbage" part and didn't reply to it, and when I"m feeling courageous, sometimes I'll say that to them. I think I've noticed that when people have that deer in the headlights look, I can slowly start to suppress more and more things about how I'm feeling and then sometimes feel stuck, wanting to go deeper and also trying to respect that they may already feel overwhelmed. I don't know if there's an answer in any of what I wrote above, just wanted to share how I can struggle with this as well.

HardlyCurious 4y ago

It's a shitty situation, and it seems all too common for men. The usual knee jerk response is to blame the men for being unable to communicate effectively. I think the sad truth is that not everyone is cared about equally, and sometimes it is everyone else's fault. But it isn't like you can get mad about it. That is just going to push people away and make them bitter toward you.

vorpalhex 4y ago

One way we can help people help us is to give them an ask - "I feel like garbage. Can you deal with dinner?" or "I feel like garbage. Do you have time to chat with me?" People need scripts and many people struggle to provide active support to someone they view as supportive. Giving them a script can help.

cat_plus_plus 4y ago

It's very hard to deal with unactionable bad news. You need to be in a good place yourself, because this will bring you down with no obvious means of relief. Then you need to be free from all distractions and commitments to figure out how to respond, either by doing something or even just the kind of active listening that requires concentration and emotional commitment. If you ask for something specific and especially something your partner will not totally hate doing, you will make it easier for them to be there for you. "Can you make me my favorite comfort food for dinner tonight?"

someone11823 4y ago

I have gone through literally this exact same scenario. I'll send my partner texts during the day and they'll ignore them even through their lunch/breaks, or skim them and miss something important. I get to the point sometimes where I have to stop texting them, even about unrelated topics or important updates, because I know the number of texts will build up too much and when they see it they won't read any of them. As is common, my partner is dependent on me. I am her rock and the breadwinner for our family. She doesn't provide enough emotional support, I have to constantly hold back my emotional needs. Maybe she is emotionally underdeveloped. Like hell, I have to remind her to say caring things to me, and even then sometimes they don't know what to say even with a prompt. I'm curious how many of these other things you relate to or you have in common with me. I'm also curious, does your partner have ADHD?

klohto 4y ago
Chiming in, same experience. Partner has ADHD, but I feel like it’s so common nowadays it can be cause of everything. You have rock solid support system elsewhere I see. I’m curious how do you feel about them ignoring the texts? Would you feel different, perhaps even insecure if the your partner wasn’t dependent on you?

_rs 4y ago

I wonder if this is related to "bids for attention" in a way (see https://www.gottman.com/blog/turn-toward-instead-of-away/ https://www.gottman.com/blog/turn-toward-instead-of-away/) - you reaching out to your partner hoping for acknowledgement and not getting any response

throwaway223145 4y ago

You mentioned that you're not sure about how to improve the one-sided empathy situation with your SO. So I thought it might be helpful to share some pertinent info that I've come across on HN in the past. I feel that the article and comment discussion on the "Intentionally making close friends" post (https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=33774353 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=33774353) may offer some actionable advice. Also, see the authors other post specifically on "debugging others" (https://www.neelnanda.io/blog/30-debugging-others https://www.neelnanda.io/blog/30-debugging-others). My own advice is to be direct with your SO about your needs / expectations not being met. I went through the same thing with my SO. We went to couples therapy for many years with no improvement, until eventually they realized it was serious enough of a problem to lead to the end of the relationship, prompting them to put in the necessary effort to change. Another poster mentioned Gottman "bids for attention" which is spot on as well. Both partners in the relationship need to show up for each other to provide emotional support. Some people are simply more used to receiving support and don't know how / aren't used to providing it. It should be made clear that this is unacceptable and needs to change, but also that you are willing to give it time and work with your SO to help them gradually improve their empathetic capacity so that they can be a better partner to you (and better person in general) and keep your relationship healthy. I think it's also important to note that balance is key. You need to be mindful not to overload the other person's empathetic capacity by venting so much that they never have a chance to vent to you or to relax / recharge. If your SO is dealing with a lot of emotional distress themselves, they simply won't have bandwidth for you. We can never be perfect emotional support for each other, because each person deals with their own emotional distress / stressful events which temporarily limits their available empathetic capacity.

someone11823 4y ago
> It should be made clear that this is unacceptable and needs to change, but also that you are willing to give it time and work with your SO to help them gradually improve their empathetic capacity so that they can be a better partner to you (and better person in general) and keep your relationship healthy. When I wrote my sibling comment it didn't come to mind, but this is exactly part of what I'm feeling as well - a strong lack of empathy on the part of my partner. It could be due to an underdeveloped insula or orbitofrontal cortexes from some of the reading I've done. This falls in line with my understanding of them having an avoidant attachment style, too, which generally I've heard is also due to being underdeveloped, compared to avoidant and securely attached individuals. I also likely exhibit "too much" empathy myself, which is a heck of a pairing. It's not easy for me to feel like I need to "tune down" how receptive I am to my partners every little issue or negative expression and try to be there for them - but it is just so unequal otherwise, sometimes to both of our detriment. I am guessing also I need to give them space to feel negative feelings before jumping in so quickly. I have been direct with my partner in the past about my needs not being met, as you suggest, but I think the conversation needs to happen again (and again?) as reminders and check-ins maybe? It doesn't feel good to have to do this though, especially during moments of distress when I really need them. > We went to couples therapy for many years with no improvement, until eventually they realized it was serious enough of a problem to lead to the end of the relationship, prompting them to put in the necessary effort to change In your case, was it truly just a matter of willpower on the part of your partner? How have things been since? Since you seem more well read on the subject than myself: are there exercises or skills to help build someones empathetic capacity? Anything I can do (perhaps without involving/telling my partner directly) to help them? Behaviors of my own that I can change to get us going in the right direction? Can I get this change from my partner without threatening the relationship itself as you had to do? I feel like that would undermine all the effort and reassurance I've put in, that they so badly need to help develop and feel safe.

isthisthingon99 4y ago

I can relate (as a man) and can say it was only when I started hanging around other dudes who would relentlessly mock each other that my feelings improved.

darepublic 4y ago

I feel you. I am separated right now and sometimes I want desperately to be back in a relationship -- forgetting that even within a relationship it's no guarantee to not be lonely. Hope everything is okay with you. I just try to be stoical about everything and be not fight the negative emotions but learn to live with them. It helps.