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Yet another chapter in these pathetic cry-bullies' lives. What a waste of your life to be so dedicated to "defending" a forum to meticulously document and mock

Yet another chapter in these pathetic cry-bullies' lives. What a waste of your life to be so dedicated to "defending" a forum to meticulously document and mock the existence of people that they find distasteful. To pretend this is a crusade for free speech is laughable.

dmatech 4y ago
On the contrary. This whole episode is a test to see if we're ruled by codified principles or by angry people. While I loathe that site, it's pretty clear that it's an example of legal speech between willing participants. The notion that we can somehow make the world a better place by preventing speech from being heard is a very dangerous (but sadly common) notion.
- dmamills 4y ago
  > This whole episode is a test to see if we're ruled by codified principles or by angry people. Here's the thing: No it isn't. This isn't a test, a crusade, the last dying breaths of free speech, or any other hyperbolic pearl clutching nonsense. This is about a man having a hard time getting someone to consistently host his racist, homophobic, and downright deplorable content.
  - hatefulmoron 4y ago
    You write as if the forum is simply Moon writing to himself on alternate accounts. There are tens of thousands of willing participants discussing legally with eachother.
    - dmamills 4y ago
      Are ten thousand homophobic racists posters supposed to be more valuable than one? What is zero times ten thousand?
      - hatefulmoron 4y ago
        If you think racist/homophobic people are in some sense "worth" zero, you're too far gone.
        dmamills 4y ago
        It's lovely of you to suggest that I'm "too far gone". That me, or people like me, might actually be the issue here. I suppose it's one of your only options at this point? What are you going to do? Actually defend the "legally discussed" content at the heart of this conversation? I certainly believe that racist and homophobic content has absolutely zero value, and the people that produce it are diminishing their own self-worth. I believe spending your finite existence to disparage others for things they can't control is not a worthy use of time. If that is the definition of too far gone, then I'm happy to be here.
        hatefulmoron 4y ago
        > I suppose it's one of your only options at this point? What are you going to do? Actually defend the "legally discussed" content at the heart of this conversation? What is the implication here? That I can't meaningfully defend someone's ability to discuss their ideas with other willing participants if I don't actually agree with the content of their message? Interesting stuff. > I certainly believe that racist and homophobic content has absolutely zero value To be clear, your original comment implied that the people themselves are of zero value. Regardless, if person A wants to listen to what person B has to say about race or sexuality, why does your opinion even matter? I don't give a fuck what you, or the relevant ISP thinks. There are plenty of websites on the internet that cater to your sensibilities. Reddit, for instance. Perhaps you should go back.
        dmamills 4y ago
        > That I can't meaningfully defend someone's ability to discuss their ideas with other willing participants if I don't actually agree with the content of their message? Not exactly. The implication is that it is all you can do. You have to wrap up all this hateful content and cover it in a blanket of "free speech" so that it is palatable for you to defend. There is no defending the actual content, just the abstract idea that should be allowed to be said. Forgive me for not making my context clear in the original comment. I believe every human has value, I believe producing hateful content diminishes that value, and is not a productive activity. I'm not sure what to say about the last bit of your comment. My opinion certainly doesn't matter. The legal rights of the companies' that are being asked to host this content is what matters. In section 2.6.7 and 2.7 of Zayo's Acceptable Use policy, they use open ended language so they can express their right to control what customers they do business with. https://www.zayo.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/05/zayo-acceptable-use-policy.pdf https://www.zayo.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/05/zayo-accepta...
  - cowtools 4y ago
    He seems to be hosting it himself, it's just that his counterparts on the other end of political extremism have campaigned to yank the cables out from under him. The internet is built on peering relationships at the end of the day. Alice doesn't get to see Bob's website unless the intermediaries agree. In this case, the intermediaries are being made to disagree with Alice and Bob.
    - dmamills 4y ago
      The internet is certainly built on "peering" relationships. So when someone finds out that you host a website where you spray your "white replacement theories", or your forum members spend a near decade documenting and mocking the existence of dozens of human beings. You shouldn't be surprised when people don't want to be in a relationship with you anymore, or do business with you anymore.

dmatech 4y ago

On the contrary. This whole episode is a test to see if we're ruled by codified principles or by angry people. While I loathe that site, it's pretty clear that it's an example of legal speech between willing participants. The notion that we can somehow make the world a better place by preventing speech from being heard is a very dangerous (but sadly common) notion.

dmamills 4y ago
> This whole episode is a test to see if we're ruled by codified principles or by angry people. Here's the thing: No it isn't. This isn't a test, a crusade, the last dying breaths of free speech, or any other hyperbolic pearl clutching nonsense. This is about a man having a hard time getting someone to consistently host his racist, homophobic, and downright deplorable content.
- hatefulmoron 4y ago
  You write as if the forum is simply Moon writing to himself on alternate accounts. There are tens of thousands of willing participants discussing legally with eachother.
  - dmamills 4y ago
    Are ten thousand homophobic racists posters supposed to be more valuable than one? What is zero times ten thousand?
    - hatefulmoron 4y ago
      If you think racist/homophobic people are in some sense "worth" zero, you're too far gone.
      - dmamills 4y ago
        It's lovely of you to suggest that I'm "too far gone". That me, or people like me, might actually be the issue here. I suppose it's one of your only options at this point? What are you going to do? Actually defend the "legally discussed" content at the heart of this conversation? I certainly believe that racist and homophobic content has absolutely zero value, and the people that produce it are diminishing their own self-worth. I believe spending your finite existence to disparage others for things they can't control is not a worthy use of time. If that is the definition of too far gone, then I'm happy to be here.
        hatefulmoron 4y ago
        > I suppose it's one of your only options at this point? What are you going to do? Actually defend the "legally discussed" content at the heart of this conversation? What is the implication here? That I can't meaningfully defend someone's ability to discuss their ideas with other willing participants if I don't actually agree with the content of their message? Interesting stuff. > I certainly believe that racist and homophobic content has absolutely zero value To be clear, your original comment implied that the people themselves are of zero value. Regardless, if person A wants to listen to what person B has to say about race or sexuality, why does your opinion even matter? I don't give a fuck what you, or the relevant ISP thinks. There are plenty of websites on the internet that cater to your sensibilities. Reddit, for instance. Perhaps you should go back.
        dmamills 4y ago
        > That I can't meaningfully defend someone's ability to discuss their ideas with other willing participants if I don't actually agree with the content of their message? Not exactly. The implication is that it is all you can do. You have to wrap up all this hateful content and cover it in a blanket of "free speech" so that it is palatable for you to defend. There is no defending the actual content, just the abstract idea that should be allowed to be said. Forgive me for not making my context clear in the original comment. I believe every human has value, I believe producing hateful content diminishes that value, and is not a productive activity. I'm not sure what to say about the last bit of your comment. My opinion certainly doesn't matter. The legal rights of the companies' that are being asked to host this content is what matters. In section 2.6.7 and 2.7 of Zayo's Acceptable Use policy, they use open ended language so they can express their right to control what customers they do business with. https://www.zayo.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/05/zayo-acceptable-use-policy.pdf https://www.zayo.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/05/zayo-accepta...
- cowtools 4y ago
  He seems to be hosting it himself, it's just that his counterparts on the other end of political extremism have campaigned to yank the cables out from under him. The internet is built on peering relationships at the end of the day. Alice doesn't get to see Bob's website unless the intermediaries agree. In this case, the intermediaries are being made to disagree with Alice and Bob.
  - dmamills 4y ago
    The internet is certainly built on "peering" relationships. So when someone finds out that you host a website where you spray your "white replacement theories", or your forum members spend a near decade documenting and mocking the existence of dozens of human beings. You shouldn't be surprised when people don't want to be in a relationship with you anymore, or do business with you anymore.