6 ms·

Largest open dataset of apartment models ever got published

210 points by standfest 4y ago

Oarch 4y ago
As someone who knows Matthias, I can vouch for the engineering effort behind Archilyse's work. I'll admit I was a tiny bit jealous when I first watched their pitch! They have identified an area where they can clearly add significant value and the analysis their software runs on a dwelling is robustly built and incredibly thorough. I wish them well with their expansion beyond Switzerland!
- rubyfan 4y ago
  Can you say more about what Archilyse is doing?
  - standfest 4y ago
    Archilyse provides a SaaS tool to convert floor plans (raster images) into 3d models of buildings (IFC or GeoJSON) with embedded contextual information. the 3d model accuracy gets verified via additional data sources (governmental building hull data, client database entries) and all buildings are geolocated. subsequently, in a 25cm grid multiple simulations (3d view shed analysis, daylight, traffic noise, centrality, discrete metrics) are computed and aggregated into feature vectors. these are used for training AVMs (reducing prediction errors in half), architectural analysis (judging architecture competitions), construction cost estimation, life cycle cost estimation, energy load peak prediction, ... different research groups use this dataset to derive design patterns and to come up with augmented ai workflows for architectural design (like copilot) or as benchmarks for novel fitness/cost functions in MCO strategies.
    - nchudleigh 4y ago
      Really cool thanks for explaining
- cameron4 4y ago
  I'm an architect (of buildings) and mostly lurk here but this is very interesting and had to comment - many designers don't like the idea of quantifying design value through measurable data, but it's most definitely the future. The design time and cost savings that can be had from using datasets or software like Archilyse's will continue to grow, while also (hopefully) ensuring a higher baseline design value of buildings. I'm personally just beginning my journey of coding/programming because of exactly this sort of thing (among other reasons).
  - terminalcommand 4y ago
    Since you're an architect, I have a question. Considering the housing shortage everywhere and the land scarcity, wouldn't it be more logical to build higher apartments? My neighbourhood doesn't allow any apartment building taller than 5 floors for example. Why not grant 30 floors? I live in an earthquake zone sure. But there are residences that high allowed in the area, but for middle-class apartments maximum height is limited with 5 floors. I don't get this. Let's build higher, denser apartments and solve the housing shortage. Am I too optimistic?
    - cameron4 4y ago
      Your logic is correct, or at least most would say so! Denser housing could solve a lot of housing issues. The problem is getting denser housing built, especially in not-so-dense neighborhoods. This could be for any number of reasons - the accusatory voice in my head likes to think it's mostly due to NIMBYs ("not in my backyard!" or folks that don't want to live in higher density neighborhoods) because of their warped perception of these spaces: higher crime, higher traffic, unsafe for children, etc. Some of these views may be true, but it's not a given in every high density neighborhood. Safe, walkable, dense neighborhoods exist in many places already. Another issue can be policy, and specifically zoning, which a lot of NIMBYs fight very hard to control. I'm no expert on zoning, but the general consensus among architects and pro-housing people is that it's holding back a lot of potential homes from being constructed. Check this out for some opinions on zoning: [https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/energy/can-the-us-housing-crisis-be-fixedby-abolishing-zoning/2022/07/31/81a74e6c-10d1-11ed-8482-06c1c84ce8f2_story.html https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/energy/can-the-us-ho...] In my previous city there's a popular type of "middle housing" (not high end single-family, and not small apartments) called a dingbat. They at one point in time were crucial for filling the gap in housing but have now been regulated away. Check this out for info on dingbats: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vlWvcsGlHA4 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vlWvcsGlHA4] For your neighborhood in particular, zoning regulations have likely limited height to 5 floors. Maybe folks in the community lobbied for this regulation to keep density down, or maybe your towns infrastructure can't support a higher density of cars (and this brings up building code and parking requirements that we have in America) - there could be many combinations of reasons for this density limit, but you should look into it! A city's history of zoning policy can be very interesting, as they oftentimes stem from decades old regulations or segregation. Your optimism is valid - optimism is incredibly important for solving problems like these, especially when so many solutions exist! Implementing those solutions is usually the toughest part.
- seleenz 4y ago
  Probably not the kind of comment that’s usually left on HN but whatever, please tell Matthias (and if he could tell his team) that they went CRAZY with this dataset. As a data nerd I d*mn near started BARKING. Can’t stress enough how HARD they went, I hope their bills are ALWAYS paid, I hope they catch EVERY green light they need to, I hope their pasta dishes are NEVER watery. You get the drift by now. Matthias and gang if you’re reading this thanks for all your hard work. BEYONCÉS of data FORREAL.
  - standfest 4y ago
    matthias here. damn ninjas are cutting onions again. thanks a lot for your kind words, it was an incredible team effort over the last years to create this. we simply hope that the community is going crazy with the data. and there is one more, even bigger thing, we will announce soon. so if this data amazed you, buckle up!
    - grapescheesee 4y ago
      Can you work on capital letters in replies. Not being rude here. Very great work!
323 4y ago
One question has been bothering me: why are rooms square? Some say that it's more economical to build this way, and that it causes less problems with aligning furniture to the wall. But that doesn't explain billionaire houses. They certainly love spending money on them, yet despite all kinds of extravaganza, the rooms are also mostly square. So i think it's something deeper, I think it's just too suspicious that across most modern cultures rooms are square. My theory is that it's related to the fact that we have 4 sides, so it's kind of symmetrical that we prefer to live in 4-sided things too.
- sieabahlpark 4y ago
- pottertheotter 4y ago
  You’re thinking too deep and already know the answer. It’s expensive to build non-square rooms. And it sucks for functionality.
- dwater 4y ago
  What 4 sides do you have?
  - twitexplore 4y ago
    seahorses have 4 sided spines. parent poster is of the pipefish family, and their question is not about human housing, but frustratingly rectangular aquariums.
    - lostlogin 4y ago
      But that’s worse. You could leave the top off the aquarium, leaving 5 sides, but getting it down to 4 means the water falls out. M
- alex_young 4y ago
  Furniture is pretty difficult to make for for rooms with odd wall configurations. You have to custom design every piece and wind up losing a bunch of space in a dresser or closet in most cases.
didgetmaster 4y ago
Interesting data set. I am building a new kind of data analysis tool (https://www.Didgets.com https://www.Didgets.com) so I am always looking for good open data sets to download, import into my tool, and see what the data shows and to test out my tool. I downloaded both CSV files (geometry and simulations) and built a couple relational tables with them in a few minutes. I am confused by a few things. There are 42,207 unique values in the 'apartment_id' column. The most common one is d41d8cd98f00b204e9800998ecf8427e which is referenced 1451 times. At first I thought that it might actually be some kind of 'plan_id' where the same plan was used to build multiple apartments (this id is associated with 13 different 'building_id' values) but drilling down to each one reveals some very different features. It is certainly possible that the same plan could be used with slight variations (e.g. one has a tub in the bathroom while another had a shower installed), but some of the features were very unique. For example there are 26 different KITCHEN areas associated with the id, but only 21 LIVING_DINING areas. My tool is great for finding and fixing anomalies in data sets if they exist. This one is a bit confusing about what some elements mean and the site doesn't explain them very well. If the same plan is being used across multiple buildings, it might be interesting to see how the amount of light entering the building differs based on if the same plan was used to build an apartment on the north side of a building vs the south side.
- screature2 4y ago
  I think d41d8cd98f00b204e9800998ecf8427e is the md5 sum of "nothing", e.g. md5 reverse will get you a zero-length stream of characters. (granted this is entirely without looking at the data) but my guess is that they MD5 hashed whatever was in that apartment_id column and if it was empty it spat out d41d8cd98f00b204e9800998ecf8427e
  - tleilaxu 4y ago
    >Ah yes, I recognise that particular md5 hash value from memory. Excellent, I certainly know I am reading HN.
  - Quarrel 4y ago
    Yep:  touch null ~  md5sum null d41d8cd98f00b204e9800998ecf8427e null
schnevets 4y ago
I think the improvements and increased acceptance of prefabricated construction and machine learning can make for an intriguing combination. I am by no means a construction specialist, but if you distill ML to new innovation from historical data sets, architecture certainly has untapped potential. Just imagine being able to input a geolocation and automatically receiving insight about construction that optimizes for usable space, energy efficiency, or even the prospective homeowner's lifestyle (an AI that recommends different layout options for a family of 5, lifelong bachelor, and non-family roommates on identical quarter-acre plots) On a slightly more disruptive angle, imagine an AI that could understand a municipality's building code and optimize the space while complying with the literal requirements. Your town has banned finished attics without two methods of egress? Here is an ideal renovation that will provide that necessary balcony while maintaining budget (and here are 4 other buildings in the town that were approved with the same design).
- hooverd 4y ago
  We can also throw genetic algorithms at the problem and come up with some really unhinged floorplans.
  - m463 4y ago
    I'm sorry, but that makes me think of a trapdoor under the welcome mat for unwanted solicitation.
  - stairlane 4y ago
    if the genetic algorithm was built such that it used simulated traditional building materials and assembly techniques then sure. otherwise most genetic algorithms essentially boil down to calculating local minima and maxima of stresses and strains, and optimizes accordingly. The resulting geometry is generally fine for a manufacturing technique such as 3d printing. Otherwise, despite the material efficiency the labor involved might explode exponentially.
  - joshspankit 4y ago
    Gehry.AI
tiagod 4y ago
This is a nitpick that's not related to the article itself, but I found that sorting by most viewed, the asc/desc dropdown has an effect from what I expected.
rainbringer2000 4y ago
The intersection of architecture and 3d design with ML is an intersect I haven't seen much work in, but it would be fascinating to see what comes from this
6510 4y ago
The way we shape our maze determines our behavior which one could use to design personality. For example, if the kitchen is on the road side you wont see your neighbors as often. Or 2 bathrooms give your grumpy morning mind some alone time. In a way we are different people in different rooms. The transitions could be interesting to explore. For example toilet > kitchen is not done or even illegal. A toilet in the garden on the other hand seems fun. Maybe hybrid rooms build an interesting character. Say a bath in the middle of the living room next to the fire place. A kitchen library also seems fascinating.
dirkhe 4y ago
Maybe we will see some sort of AI to generate floor plans based on outer dimensions, orientation and room needs/preferences.

210 points by standfest 4y ago

As someone who knows Matthias, I can vouch for the engineering effort behind Archilyse's work. I'll admit I was a tiny bit jealous when I first watched their pitch! They have identified an area where they can clearly add significant value and the analysis their software runs on a dwelling is robustly built and incredibly thorough. I wish them well with their expansion beyond Switzerland!

rubyfan 4y ago
Can you say more about what Archilyse is doing?
- standfest 4y ago
  Archilyse provides a SaaS tool to convert floor plans (raster images) into 3d models of buildings (IFC or GeoJSON) with embedded contextual information. the 3d model accuracy gets verified via additional data sources (governmental building hull data, client database entries) and all buildings are geolocated. subsequently, in a 25cm grid multiple simulations (3d view shed analysis, daylight, traffic noise, centrality, discrete metrics) are computed and aggregated into feature vectors. these are used for training AVMs (reducing prediction errors in half), architectural analysis (judging architecture competitions), construction cost estimation, life cycle cost estimation, energy load peak prediction, ... different research groups use this dataset to derive design patterns and to come up with augmented ai workflows for architectural design (like copilot) or as benchmarks for novel fitness/cost functions in MCO strategies.
  - nchudleigh 4y ago
    Really cool thanks for explaining
cameron4 4y ago
I'm an architect (of buildings) and mostly lurk here but this is very interesting and had to comment - many designers don't like the idea of quantifying design value through measurable data, but it's most definitely the future. The design time and cost savings that can be had from using datasets or software like Archilyse's will continue to grow, while also (hopefully) ensuring a higher baseline design value of buildings. I'm personally just beginning my journey of coding/programming because of exactly this sort of thing (among other reasons).
- terminalcommand 4y ago
  Since you're an architect, I have a question. Considering the housing shortage everywhere and the land scarcity, wouldn't it be more logical to build higher apartments? My neighbourhood doesn't allow any apartment building taller than 5 floors for example. Why not grant 30 floors? I live in an earthquake zone sure. But there are residences that high allowed in the area, but for middle-class apartments maximum height is limited with 5 floors. I don't get this. Let's build higher, denser apartments and solve the housing shortage. Am I too optimistic?
  - cameron4 4y ago
    Your logic is correct, or at least most would say so! Denser housing could solve a lot of housing issues. The problem is getting denser housing built, especially in not-so-dense neighborhoods. This could be for any number of reasons - the accusatory voice in my head likes to think it's mostly due to NIMBYs ("not in my backyard!" or folks that don't want to live in higher density neighborhoods) because of their warped perception of these spaces: higher crime, higher traffic, unsafe for children, etc. Some of these views may be true, but it's not a given in every high density neighborhood. Safe, walkable, dense neighborhoods exist in many places already. Another issue can be policy, and specifically zoning, which a lot of NIMBYs fight very hard to control. I'm no expert on zoning, but the general consensus among architects and pro-housing people is that it's holding back a lot of potential homes from being constructed. Check this out for some opinions on zoning: [https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/energy/can-the-us-housing-crisis-be-fixedby-abolishing-zoning/2022/07/31/81a74e6c-10d1-11ed-8482-06c1c84ce8f2_story.html https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/energy/can-the-us-ho...] In my previous city there's a popular type of "middle housing" (not high end single-family, and not small apartments) called a dingbat. They at one point in time were crucial for filling the gap in housing but have now been regulated away. Check this out for info on dingbats: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vlWvcsGlHA4 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vlWvcsGlHA4] For your neighborhood in particular, zoning regulations have likely limited height to 5 floors. Maybe folks in the community lobbied for this regulation to keep density down, or maybe your towns infrastructure can't support a higher density of cars (and this brings up building code and parking requirements that we have in America) - there could be many combinations of reasons for this density limit, but you should look into it! A city's history of zoning policy can be very interesting, as they oftentimes stem from decades old regulations or segregation. Your optimism is valid - optimism is incredibly important for solving problems like these, especially when so many solutions exist! Implementing those solutions is usually the toughest part.
seleenz 4y ago
Probably not the kind of comment that’s usually left on HN but whatever, please tell Matthias (and if he could tell his team) that they went CRAZY with this dataset. As a data nerd I d*mn near started BARKING. Can’t stress enough how HARD they went, I hope their bills are ALWAYS paid, I hope they catch EVERY green light they need to, I hope their pasta dishes are NEVER watery. You get the drift by now. Matthias and gang if you’re reading this thanks for all your hard work. BEYONCÉS of data FORREAL.
- standfest 4y ago
  matthias here. damn ninjas are cutting onions again. thanks a lot for your kind words, it was an incredible team effort over the last years to create this. we simply hope that the community is going crazy with the data. and there is one more, even bigger thing, we will announce soon. so if this data amazed you, buckle up!
  - grapescheesee 4y ago
    Can you work on capital letters in replies. Not being rude here. Very great work!

323 4y ago

One question has been bothering me: why are rooms square? Some say that it's more economical to build this way, and that it causes less problems with aligning furniture to the wall. But that doesn't explain billionaire houses. They certainly love spending money on them, yet despite all kinds of extravaganza, the rooms are also mostly square. So i think it's something deeper, I think it's just too suspicious that across most modern cultures rooms are square. My theory is that it's related to the fact that we have 4 sides, so it's kind of symmetrical that we prefer to live in 4-sided things too.

sieabahlpark 4y ago
pottertheotter 4y ago
You’re thinking too deep and already know the answer. It’s expensive to build non-square rooms. And it sucks for functionality.
dwater 4y ago
What 4 sides do you have?
- twitexplore 4y ago
  seahorses have 4 sided spines. parent poster is of the pipefish family, and their question is not about human housing, but frustratingly rectangular aquariums.
  - lostlogin 4y ago
    But that’s worse. You could leave the top off the aquarium, leaving 5 sides, but getting it down to 4 means the water falls out. M
alex_young 4y ago
Furniture is pretty difficult to make for for rooms with odd wall configurations. You have to custom design every piece and wind up losing a bunch of space in a dresser or closet in most cases.

didgetmaster 4y ago

Interesting data set. I am building a new kind of data analysis tool (https://www.Didgets.com https://www.Didgets.com) so I am always looking for good open data sets to download, import into my tool, and see what the data shows and to test out my tool. I downloaded both CSV files (geometry and simulations) and built a couple relational tables with them in a few minutes. I am confused by a few things. There are 42,207 unique values in the 'apartment_id' column. The most common one is d41d8cd98f00b204e9800998ecf8427e which is referenced 1451 times. At first I thought that it might actually be some kind of 'plan_id' where the same plan was used to build multiple apartments (this id is associated with 13 different 'building_id' values) but drilling down to each one reveals some very different features. It is certainly possible that the same plan could be used with slight variations (e.g. one has a tub in the bathroom while another had a shower installed), but some of the features were very unique. For example there are 26 different KITCHEN areas associated with the id, but only 21 LIVING_DINING areas. My tool is great for finding and fixing anomalies in data sets if they exist. This one is a bit confusing about what some elements mean and the site doesn't explain them very well. If the same plan is being used across multiple buildings, it might be interesting to see how the amount of light entering the building differs based on if the same plan was used to build an apartment on the north side of a building vs the south side.

screature2 4y ago
I think d41d8cd98f00b204e9800998ecf8427e is the md5 sum of "nothing", e.g. md5 reverse will get you a zero-length stream of characters. (granted this is entirely without looking at the data) but my guess is that they MD5 hashed whatever was in that apartment_id column and if it was empty it spat out d41d8cd98f00b204e9800998ecf8427e
- tleilaxu 4y ago
  >Ah yes, I recognise that particular md5 hash value from memory. Excellent, I certainly know I am reading HN.
- Quarrel 4y ago
  Yep:  touch null ~  md5sum null d41d8cd98f00b204e9800998ecf8427e null

schnevets 4y ago

I think the improvements and increased acceptance of prefabricated construction and machine learning can make for an intriguing combination. I am by no means a construction specialist, but if you distill ML to new innovation from historical data sets, architecture certainly has untapped potential. Just imagine being able to input a geolocation and automatically receiving insight about construction that optimizes for usable space, energy efficiency, or even the prospective homeowner's lifestyle (an AI that recommends different layout options for a family of 5, lifelong bachelor, and non-family roommates on identical quarter-acre plots) On a slightly more disruptive angle, imagine an AI that could understand a municipality's building code and optimize the space while complying with the literal requirements. Your town has banned finished attics without two methods of egress? Here is an ideal renovation that will provide that necessary balcony while maintaining budget (and here are 4 other buildings in the town that were approved with the same design).

hooverd 4y ago
We can also throw genetic algorithms at the problem and come up with some really unhinged floorplans.
- m463 4y ago
  I'm sorry, but that makes me think of a trapdoor under the welcome mat for unwanted solicitation.
- stairlane 4y ago
  if the genetic algorithm was built such that it used simulated traditional building materials and assembly techniques then sure. otherwise most genetic algorithms essentially boil down to calculating local minima and maxima of stresses and strains, and optimizes accordingly. The resulting geometry is generally fine for a manufacturing technique such as 3d printing. Otherwise, despite the material efficiency the labor involved might explode exponentially.
- joshspankit 4y ago
  Gehry.AI

tiagod 4y ago

This is a nitpick that's not related to the article itself, but I found that sorting by most viewed, the asc/desc dropdown has an effect from what I expected.

rainbringer2000 4y ago

The intersection of architecture and 3d design with ML is an intersect I haven't seen much work in, but it would be fascinating to see what comes from this

6510 4y ago

The way we shape our maze determines our behavior which one could use to design personality. For example, if the kitchen is on the road side you wont see your neighbors as often. Or 2 bathrooms give your grumpy morning mind some alone time. In a way we are different people in different rooms. The transitions could be interesting to explore. For example toilet > kitchen is not done or even illegal. A toilet in the garden on the other hand seems fun. Maybe hybrid rooms build an interesting character. Say a bath in the middle of the living room next to the fire place. A kitchen library also seems fascinating.

dirkhe 4y ago

Maybe we will see some sort of AI to generate floor plans based on outer dimensions, orientation and room needs/preferences.