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"Engineer, engineer, engineer" Good thing you guys aren't a Canadian company, lest you be fined into non-existence. Seriously, folks, call your employees what

"Engineer, engineer, engineer" Good thing you guys aren't a Canadian company, lest you be fined into non-existence. Seriously, folks, call your employees what they are. Programmers, DBAs, Sysadmins. I personally appreciate the work that Heroku has done with PostgreSQL, but I'm ate up when I see technology companies (whom are employers of the previously listed titles) refer to their employees as 'engineers'.

dpritchett 15y ago
When in Rome, do as the Romans do.
jphackworth 15y ago
Why pick on Heroku for this? Google, Microsoft, Apple, Facebook, and basically every other tech company do the same thing.
- user911302966 15y ago
  Yes, many companies are guilty of it. It comes down to ego inflation. "Engineer" lends an air of prestige and esteem, but it's a title that's undeserved by most who use it in modern times. Of course, this gets severely down-voted because many people on HN and similar sites think of themselves in this fashion, and their ego takes a hit when they run across a comment such as mine.
  - astine 15y ago
    You're being down-voted for the very same reason that someone in the US complaining that Canada doesn't use imperial units would be.
  - shykes 15y ago
    I don't think it has anything to do with ego inflation. To me "engineer" evoques a specific methodology and state of mind that is shared by all engineers, whether they build bridges, sewer systems or software. It emphasizes that your job is to create solutions to real-world problems - and that writing software is just one part of that job.
mbell 15y ago
This is really backwards thinking. The regulation of 'Engineer' has not grown to support the concept of the modern world. The laws in Canada were enacted as a result non-qualified people designing bridges and buildings that fell over. At the time almost all 'Engineering' actively had a life safety component, the same is far from true today. Those fields that still life safety components are of course regulated, primarily through PE licensing but there certain is no reason not to properly use the term 'Engineer' when its due. For what its worth my degree is in electrical engineering and have never even considered getting a PE license, its not applicable in the fields I work in.
- amackera 15y ago
  I have a degree in Computer Engineering, but I've never got a PE license either. The important thing is that I don't ever call myself an Engineer. I am a programmer, or developer, or whatever; calling myself an Engineer would be dishonest. I don't think it's backwards thinking so much as an important distinction between how Canada uses the word "Engineer" and how much of the rest of the (English speaking) world does.
  - mbell 15y ago
    I don't see how calling yourself an 'Engineer' is dishonest, adding 'Professional Engineer' or 'PE' to your title would be dishonest as those terms have regulatory meaning. 'Engineering is the discipline, art, skill and profession of acquiring and applying scientific, mathematical, economic, social, and practical knowledge, in order to design and build structures, machines, devices, systems, materials and processes that safely realize improvements to the lives of people.' Regardless of the formal designation of 'PE' or other designation many people do fit the term 'Engineer'. The real issue is that some limited jurisdictions have decided that 'Engineer' must equal 'PE'. That doesn't make the use of the term 'Engineer' improper outside those jurisdictions nor does it make the choice to equate the two concepts universally correct.
    - amackera 15y ago
      Though I understand and largely agree with your argument, the reason why I don't call myself an Engineer is that I know that people may not understand the distinction. I legally cannot call myself a "Professional Engineer". In order to prevent unintentionally misleading people, I stay as far from the word "Engineer" as possible. I suppose it's not really dishonest. I depends more on the individual's intentions.
amackera 15y ago
I think it's more of a cultural difference. "Engineer" just doesn't mean the same thing south of the border; it means more like "developer", or perhaps "technical employee".

dpritchett 15y ago

When in Rome, do as the Romans do.

jphackworth 15y ago

Why pick on Heroku for this? Google, Microsoft, Apple, Facebook, and basically every other tech company do the same thing.

user911302966 15y ago
Yes, many companies are guilty of it. It comes down to ego inflation. "Engineer" lends an air of prestige and esteem, but it's a title that's undeserved by most who use it in modern times. Of course, this gets severely down-voted because many people on HN and similar sites think of themselves in this fashion, and their ego takes a hit when they run across a comment such as mine.
- astine 15y ago
  You're being down-voted for the very same reason that someone in the US complaining that Canada doesn't use imperial units would be.
- shykes 15y ago
  I don't think it has anything to do with ego inflation. To me "engineer" evoques a specific methodology and state of mind that is shared by all engineers, whether they build bridges, sewer systems or software. It emphasizes that your job is to create solutions to real-world problems - and that writing software is just one part of that job.

mbell 15y ago

This is really backwards thinking. The regulation of 'Engineer' has not grown to support the concept of the modern world. The laws in Canada were enacted as a result non-qualified people designing bridges and buildings that fell over. At the time almost all 'Engineering' actively had a life safety component, the same is far from true today. Those fields that still life safety components are of course regulated, primarily through PE licensing but there certain is no reason not to properly use the term 'Engineer' when its due. For what its worth my degree is in electrical engineering and have never even considered getting a PE license, its not applicable in the fields I work in.

amackera 15y ago
I have a degree in Computer Engineering, but I've never got a PE license either. The important thing is that I don't ever call myself an Engineer. I am a programmer, or developer, or whatever; calling myself an Engineer would be dishonest. I don't think it's backwards thinking so much as an important distinction between how Canada uses the word "Engineer" and how much of the rest of the (English speaking) world does.
- mbell 15y ago
  I don't see how calling yourself an 'Engineer' is dishonest, adding 'Professional Engineer' or 'PE' to your title would be dishonest as those terms have regulatory meaning. 'Engineering is the discipline, art, skill and profession of acquiring and applying scientific, mathematical, economic, social, and practical knowledge, in order to design and build structures, machines, devices, systems, materials and processes that safely realize improvements to the lives of people.' Regardless of the formal designation of 'PE' or other designation many people do fit the term 'Engineer'. The real issue is that some limited jurisdictions have decided that 'Engineer' must equal 'PE'. That doesn't make the use of the term 'Engineer' improper outside those jurisdictions nor does it make the choice to equate the two concepts universally correct.
  - amackera 15y ago
    Though I understand and largely agree with your argument, the reason why I don't call myself an Engineer is that I know that people may not understand the distinction. I legally cannot call myself a "Professional Engineer". In order to prevent unintentionally misleading people, I stay as far from the word "Engineer" as possible. I suppose it's not really dishonest. I depends more on the individual's intentions.

amackera 15y ago

I think it's more of a cultural difference. "Engineer" just doesn't mean the same thing south of the border; it means more like "developer", or perhaps "technical employee".