6 ms·

I'll add my anecdotal experience, got covid in 2020, got the vaccine a year later and felt butterflies in my chest immediately after. Went away after a few seco

I'll add my anecdotal experience, got covid in 2020, got the vaccine a year later and felt butterflies in my chest immediately after. Went away after a few seconds but after a month discomfort started during intense exercise. Another month later and I went to the ER with mild pericarditis. Its been a long ~year of recovery where I had to keep my HR under 100 and take tons of anti-inflammatories. Got lucky that I had it mild and finally back to normal (minus getting out of fitness), lets hope it stays that way. What I learned (perhaps too late lol): * Medical Science is largely empirical (requires statistical nous), unfortunately doctors do not understand statistics, take argmaxes and treat things deterministically in the guise of evidence based medicine. * Said doctors advise Insurance companies so any doctors that do understand statistics will be bounded within the confines of what the insurance company considers evidence based medicine. This creates wasted work and even frustration as the doctor has to jump through hoops to get things done. * getting a rare disease or disease with uncertainty requires becoming an expert on it to "correctly" navigate the health system (US here). I have a newfound appreciation for not only those who have to deal with insurance but simply navigating the uncertainty.

beagle3 4y ago
Getting a rare disease means you have to become the expert of your own disease in other places as well. For the “average” rare disease, the vast majority of the people in the medical system have either (a) not heard of it at all (b) had one paragraph (at most, one lecture) about it while studying. (c) have likely not met a patient with said disease, or maybe a couple over a decade or two The doctors you see have no time to study and be up to date about multiple rare diseases. Whereas you have the time and the motivation (and hopefully the ability) to understand all the updates, consider anecdotes, etc.
timr 4y ago
I got the vaccine long before getting Covid (about a year before), and have had palpitations ("butterflies") since the vaccine. Are the two related? No idea. But it illustrates the fallacy of relying on anecdote. For anything. That said: we know that the vaccine causes myocarditis in younger men, and the rate is at least in 1 in 5000, and quite probably higher than that [1]. A recent study of Thai boys suggested a much higher rate, on the order of 1 in 100 [2]: [1] https://anishkokamd.substack.com/p/vaccine-myocarditis-update-from-thailand?r=6chj5&utm_medium=ios https://anishkokamd.substack.com/p/vaccine-myocarditis-updat... [2] https://twitter.com/anish_koka/status/1560617943762878464 https://twitter.com/anish_koka/status/1560617943762878464
- yieldcrv 4y ago
  covid causes myocarditis at a higher rate just a reminded because some people don’t know, not advocating for an additional original strain booster or any cause aside from that it definitely needs to be factored into incidence reports
  - krackers 4y ago
    >covid causes myocarditis at a higher rate Not for all age groups: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=32623508 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=32623508
    - n8henrie 4y ago
      I think your link (or rather the reference in your link) refutes your statement. If I'm reading correctly, beyond age, you also have to subgroup by sex and by the particular vaccine type to find a subgroup where myocarditis risk of vaccine exceeds that of the disease.
  - bamboozled 4y ago
    Here’s the thing though, it shouldn’t be a choice of Covid19 or a vaccine that isn’t good for you right ? Yes there are risks , but we’re just accepting that this vaccine might fuck with our cardiovascular systems now ? Disclaimer: I took covid vaccines
    - yieldcrv 4y ago
      > not advocating for an additional original strain booster or any cause we should be able to point out the strength of arguments without being seen as a supporter of the counterargument
  - orangetuba 4y ago
    There are also a number of cases where someone got mild covid, and then months later got vaccinated and developed pericarditis and myocarditis.
RichardCNormos 4y ago
Three young men I work with got myocarditis from the vaccine. In each case, the emergency room staff didn't believe that it was a vaccine injury. In each case, they called it "anxiety" and sent them home. Only later were they able to find doctors willing to call it vaccine injury, but who knows how much damage was done in the meantime with the condition left untreated. The point is, this isn't rare, and you are not alone.

beagle3 4y ago

Getting a rare disease means you have to become the expert of your own disease in other places as well. For the “average” rare disease, the vast majority of the people in the medical system have either (a) not heard of it at all (b) had one paragraph (at most, one lecture) about it while studying. (c) have likely not met a patient with said disease, or maybe a couple over a decade or two The doctors you see have no time to study and be up to date about multiple rare diseases. Whereas you have the time and the motivation (and hopefully the ability) to understand all the updates, consider anecdotes, etc.

timr 4y ago

I got the vaccine long before getting Covid (about a year before), and have had palpitations ("butterflies") since the vaccine. Are the two related? No idea. But it illustrates the fallacy of relying on anecdote. For anything. That said: we know that the vaccine causes myocarditis in younger men, and the rate is at least in 1 in 5000, and quite probably higher than that [1]. A recent study of Thai boys suggested a much higher rate, on the order of 1 in 100 [2]: [1] https://anishkokamd.substack.com/p/vaccine-myocarditis-update-from-thailand?r=6chj5&utm_medium=ios https://anishkokamd.substack.com/p/vaccine-myocarditis-updat... [2] https://twitter.com/anish_koka/status/1560617943762878464 https://twitter.com/anish_koka/status/1560617943762878464

yieldcrv 4y ago
covid causes myocarditis at a higher rate just a reminded because some people don’t know, not advocating for an additional original strain booster or any cause aside from that it definitely needs to be factored into incidence reports
- krackers 4y ago
  >covid causes myocarditis at a higher rate Not for all age groups: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=32623508 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=32623508
  - n8henrie 4y ago
    I think your link (or rather the reference in your link) refutes your statement. If I'm reading correctly, beyond age, you also have to subgroup by sex and by the particular vaccine type to find a subgroup where myocarditis risk of vaccine exceeds that of the disease.
- bamboozled 4y ago
  Here’s the thing though, it shouldn’t be a choice of Covid19 or a vaccine that isn’t good for you right ? Yes there are risks , but we’re just accepting that this vaccine might fuck with our cardiovascular systems now ? Disclaimer: I took covid vaccines
  - yieldcrv 4y ago
    > not advocating for an additional original strain booster or any cause we should be able to point out the strength of arguments without being seen as a supporter of the counterargument
- orangetuba 4y ago
  There are also a number of cases where someone got mild covid, and then months later got vaccinated and developed pericarditis and myocarditis.

RichardCNormos 4y ago

Three young men I work with got myocarditis from the vaccine. In each case, the emergency room staff didn't believe that it was a vaccine injury. In each case, they called it "anxiety" and sent them home. Only later were they able to find doctors willing to call it vaccine injury, but who knows how much damage was done in the meantime with the condition left untreated. The point is, this isn't rare, and you are not alone.