7 ms·

I've heard of massive dust storms on Mars. This is the first I've heard of deadly dust. It's also bombarded by X-rays and gamma rays. So Mars is completely unin

by Flankk 4y ago

I've heard of massive dust storms on Mars. This is the first I've heard of deadly dust. It's also bombarded by X-rays and gamma rays. So Mars is completely uninhabitable. Astronauts would need an airlock with chemical shower and secondary breathing apparatus to be able to even consider taking off their space suit. The base would have to be underground. To be clear the plan is to fly past the moon and through space for nine months for that? Sounds half baked.

elihu 4y ago
I don't understand why "the base would have to be underground" is such a deal-breaker for so many people. I mean it would suck if your whole environment is like a typical basement, but these could be quite large living spaces, well lit with plants and trees and big empty spaces. Lava tubes on Earth that are spacious and miles long aren't all that rare, and on Mars I think the expectation is that lower gravity should tend to result in larger lava tubes. The perchlorates are a problem, but not one that's impossible to deal with. One possible workaround is to have space suits that you never actually bring inside, you just sort of climb in and out through a hatch in the back that docks with the habitat. Similarly with vehicles, they could dock with the habitat so you can get in and out without going outside.
- Flankk 4y ago
  Mars is made of solid volcanic rock covered in dust. If the hypothetical lava tube idea doesn't work, not much else will. My skepticism begins with SpaceX releasing illustrations of a planned above-ground base.[1] Elon has said for the base to become self sustainable they will need around a million people. There is a fine line between genius and insanity. [1] https://images.adsttc.com/media/images/59ce/60f5/b22e/384e/1000/00bf/slideshow/Screen_Shot_2017-09-29_at_10.43.48_AM.jpg https://images.adsttc.com/media/images/59ce/60f5/b22e/384e/1...
  - elihu 4y ago
    I agree that an above-ground base is probably not realistic without substantial shielding. The illustration I'm inclined to interpret as marketing fluff. I don't think lava tubes are the only option, though -- they're just probably the best option in terms of most space for the least effort. Mars has a lot of sulfur which can be used to make a kind of sulfur-based concrete that isn't used much on Earth because Portland cement is much more useful and convenient. But let's say you can make building blocks out of sulfur-based concrete or some other native material. (Worst case you make them out of something light and bring them with you from Earth.) You dig a big hole in the dusty soil, then stack blocks igloo-fashion to make a dome in the bottom of the hole. Then you stack some more blocks to make a (relatively) dust-free stairwell, then pile the Martian soid set aside from digging the hole back over the top of everything else. So now you have a strong below-ground compressive structure that you can line with plastic or something and put in an airlock. The weight of the soil above counteracts the air pressure inside. Ideally most of the habitat-construction work would be done by robots before people get there; that would be some tricky engineering though.

by Flankk 4y ago

elihu 4y ago

I don't understand why "the base would have to be underground" is such a deal-breaker for so many people. I mean it would suck if your whole environment is like a typical basement, but these could be quite large living spaces, well lit with plants and trees and big empty spaces. Lava tubes on Earth that are spacious and miles long aren't all that rare, and on Mars I think the expectation is that lower gravity should tend to result in larger lava tubes. The perchlorates are a problem, but not one that's impossible to deal with. One possible workaround is to have space suits that you never actually bring inside, you just sort of climb in and out through a hatch in the back that docks with the habitat. Similarly with vehicles, they could dock with the habitat so you can get in and out without going outside.

Flankk 4y ago
Mars is made of solid volcanic rock covered in dust. If the hypothetical lava tube idea doesn't work, not much else will. My skepticism begins with SpaceX releasing illustrations of a planned above-ground base.[1] Elon has said for the base to become self sustainable they will need around a million people. There is a fine line between genius and insanity. [1] https://images.adsttc.com/media/images/59ce/60f5/b22e/384e/1000/00bf/slideshow/Screen_Shot_2017-09-29_at_10.43.48_AM.jpg https://images.adsttc.com/media/images/59ce/60f5/b22e/384e/1...
- elihu 4y ago
  I agree that an above-ground base is probably not realistic without substantial shielding. The illustration I'm inclined to interpret as marketing fluff. I don't think lava tubes are the only option, though -- they're just probably the best option in terms of most space for the least effort. Mars has a lot of sulfur which can be used to make a kind of sulfur-based concrete that isn't used much on Earth because Portland cement is much more useful and convenient. But let's say you can make building blocks out of sulfur-based concrete or some other native material. (Worst case you make them out of something light and bring them with you from Earth.) You dig a big hole in the dusty soil, then stack blocks igloo-fashion to make a dome in the bottom of the hole. Then you stack some more blocks to make a (relatively) dust-free stairwell, then pile the Martian soid set aside from digging the hole back over the top of everything else. So now you have a strong below-ground compressive structure that you can line with plastic or something and put in an airlock. The weight of the soil above counteracts the air pressure inside. Ideally most of the habitat-construction work would be done by robots before people get there; that would be some tricky engineering though.