7 ms·

Doesn't matter what the actual number is if that is our perception, whether that is because of media or peer/cultural influence.

zmgsabst 4y ago
- ratww 4y ago
  The "rest" that hates it is also a very vocal minority, probably even less than the 8-10%. Most people don't give a shit about it. Assuming the rest does is heavy projection.
  - namelessoracle 4y ago
    - ratww 4y ago
      - AndrewUnmuted 4y ago
        ratww 4y ago
        AndrewUnmuted 4y ago
        ratww 4y ago
        AndrewUnmuted 4y ago
        ratww 4y ago
        No, your point is that unless I completely agree with you about some specific voting demographics that happens to be a pet theory of yours, then I'm wrong about something completely unrelated. Seems like you're knee deep in this shit and projecting your views in an entire country.
        AndrewUnmuted 4y ago
        dang 4y ago
        Breaking the site guidelines like this will get you banned here. Please don't do it again. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html Edit: you've been breaking the site guidelines so badly and so often that we've banned the account. Please see https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=32351713 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=32351713.
        dang 4y ago
        Breaking the site guidelines like this will get you banned here. Please don't do it again. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html Edit: you've been breaking the site guidelines in other places too. That's seriously not cool.
        deleted 4y ago
        [deleted]
  - coldtea 4y ago
    >Most people don't give a shit about it. Yes, but the parent's point might still hold. You might not watch something because you hate the thing they put in (and that could be a minority), but you might not watch something also because "you don't give a shit" about the thing they put in - and want more of what you do like. I think the Ghostbusters remake is an example where people not hating woke ideologically, still dislike the movie, because they don't give a shit about the things the writers found so important...
    - ratww 4y ago
      Thinking that film is bad isn't really "hating woke culture", though. In fact I know plenty of "woke" people who also think that it sucks. Some maybe semi-secretly. The film has plenty to be criticised.
      - coldtea 4y ago
        OK, take Captain Marvel, which is part run-of-the-mill Marvel movie, part lecture. A lot of people tune out because of that. Whereas they don't have any issue with a strong, feminist female lead like Ripley (were men are usually the laughing stock, and all die in the hands of the xenomorph due to incompetence).
        ratww 4y ago
        Ah, I think I understand your point. Your point is that "stuff <10% of people will like" doesn't make up for a mediocre film, and studios are trying to capitalise on that rather than working on better stories. If so, I definitely agree.
    - orwin 4y ago
      I've heard someone said "i usually care when the communication departement goes way too political: it usually mean that that the story is bad . In this case it was about video games, but i feel like it can be extended to TV shows and movies. There is a lot of good rather feminist TV shows who don't get touted as feminist (mostly YA and fantasy tbh). The one who tries to sold themselves on that though, are all bad. But i think this is transitory. In the 60s, when "La nouvelle vague" started to include different, new stereotypes (of women mostly, but of men too), there wasn't a lot of really good success in the beginning (to my eyes at least, the stereotypes were too much). They also had less money and couldn't afford to go wrong that many time, and eventually Truffaut got it right imho. Hollywood il bust, probably a lot, lot more than La nouvelle vague, but will start to get it right. Hopefully.
- nameistaken 4y ago
- danny_taco 4y ago
  You talk about the figures being meaningful, while you seem to be making up numbers of your own.
  - zmgsabst 4y ago
    - mxkopy 4y ago
      >and the rest hate it. Source?
- tablespoon 4y ago
  > Corporations “went Woke” because they misperceived that as having popular support while only 8-10% of people supported it — and the rest hate it. > That misperception has lost hundreds of billions in shareholder value, adding up just Disney, Warner, and Netflix. How so? Do any of those companies have competitors who didn't "go woke," and are now profiting off their missteps? Those companies may have lost a ton of value, but I don't think it's because of that cause. > Democrat politicians seem to have similarly misperceived — and now are facing widespread public backlash to their policy. But that may not matter. They're also cultivating a backlash against Republicans, hoping that will counter any backlash against them. IMHO, in our political moment, the major parties don't even try to make the middle happy; they try to make the middle mad at the other guys, so they can coddle their respective activist bases. This is why "democracy all the things" is kind of a shitty system. Primaries push the adults out of the room and give extremists too much say, which then requires toxic behavior to salvage an overall victory.
  - hammock 4y ago
    Even inside of Big Media you can see the relative commercial success or failure of a movie like Toy Story compared to a disinterested one like Top Gun
  - zmgsabst 4y ago
    Yes — imported and independent media have done well over that same period. They’re literally setting records. You can also compare within a single studio, such as Prime Video: why did Reacher and Terminal List succeed where Wheel of Time and Rings of Power did not? Edit: > IMHO, in our political moment, the major parties don't event try to make the middle happy; they try to make the middle mad at the other guys, so they can coddle their activist bases. I agree.
    - mcphage 4y ago
      > where Wheel of Time and Rings of Power did not? So far, Rings of Power has pulled in Infinity dollars per episode. Probably won't stay that way, but that seems pretty successful to me.
    - 4y ago
- groby_b 4y ago
  Dude. Take off the political glasses. Disney lost value because it's mismanaged by a horrible CEO, and hasn't produced anything meaningful outside of Marvel and Star Wars since forever. Add to that a struggling parks business in general, combined with epic mismanagement around "maybe we should just target people who want $5K hotel rooms and $2K drinks", and... here we are. Netflix, similarly, suffers from self-inflicted wounds. Their struggling attempts to monetize account sharing are a much too late financial attempt to paper over the fact that their auth system is... not so good. Mildly put. Their content content has taken a deep turn towards "reality" schlock after they so brilliantly ousted Cindy Holland (who was responsible for bringing good content) while elevating Bela Bajaria (the king of garbage shows). Those shows play well on social media, but they do shit all for the bottom line. It's not "went woke", it's "leaned into incompetence". The same holds true on the political side. A large chunk of the recession rests firmly on politicians who completely and utterly fucked up the handling of the pandemic. Republicans and Democrats both. Different flavors of incompetence, but... it was a shit show either way.
  - hammock 4y ago
    >hasn't produced anything meaningful outside of Marvel and Star Wars since forever. AKA only the most profitable franchises of all time…
    - swores 4y ago
      Which is why they're not doing as well as they should be, rather than literally crashing and burning. At their size having two great franchises isn't good enough if everything else is absolute shit (not that I'm saying it is all shit, just that those two alone can't carry the stock market's expectation of more than just those two succeeding).
    - andsoitis 4y ago
      Disney stock is down over the last 5 years. https://finance.yahoo.com/quote/DIS/ https://finance.yahoo.com/quote/DIS/
      - 4y ago
- PenguinCoder 4y ago
  > has lost hundreds of billions in shareholder value Who gives a shit about useless thieves with no ability to actually produce or do anything worthwhile??! Fuck the 'shareholders value'. We need to do more for and pay the PEOPLE better, who get things done. Ya know, the actual workers. All that a 'shareholder' does is extract money/value from other peoples hard work.
- frumper 4y ago
  My in-law told us they were boycotting Disney for political reasons. A few months later we wanted to respect their choices so we asked her what our nephew would like for his birthday and she told us he's into The Mandalorian and Marvel.
AndrewUnmuted 4y ago
It feels many people responding to you are misunderstanding your point - and it's a very good one. The medium is the message. Everybody should read McLuhan if they work in the technology space. [0] [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_medium_is_the_message https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_medium_is_the_message

zmgsabst 4y ago

ratww 4y ago
The "rest" that hates it is also a very vocal minority, probably even less than the 8-10%. Most people don't give a shit about it. Assuming the rest does is heavy projection.
- namelessoracle 4y ago
  - ratww 4y ago
    - AndrewUnmuted 4y ago
      - ratww 4y ago
        AndrewUnmuted 4y ago
        ratww 4y ago
        AndrewUnmuted 4y ago
        ratww 4y ago
        No, your point is that unless I completely agree with you about some specific voting demographics that happens to be a pet theory of yours, then I'm wrong about something completely unrelated. Seems like you're knee deep in this shit and projecting your views in an entire country.
        AndrewUnmuted 4y ago
        dang 4y ago
        Breaking the site guidelines like this will get you banned here. Please don't do it again. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html Edit: you've been breaking the site guidelines so badly and so often that we've banned the account. Please see https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=32351713 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=32351713.
        dang 4y ago
        Breaking the site guidelines like this will get you banned here. Please don't do it again. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html Edit: you've been breaking the site guidelines in other places too. That's seriously not cool.
        deleted 4y ago
        [deleted]
- coldtea 4y ago
  >Most people don't give a shit about it. Yes, but the parent's point might still hold. You might not watch something because you hate the thing they put in (and that could be a minority), but you might not watch something also because "you don't give a shit" about the thing they put in - and want more of what you do like. I think the Ghostbusters remake is an example where people not hating woke ideologically, still dislike the movie, because they don't give a shit about the things the writers found so important...
  - ratww 4y ago
    Thinking that film is bad isn't really "hating woke culture", though. In fact I know plenty of "woke" people who also think that it sucks. Some maybe semi-secretly. The film has plenty to be criticised.
    - coldtea 4y ago
      OK, take Captain Marvel, which is part run-of-the-mill Marvel movie, part lecture. A lot of people tune out because of that. Whereas they don't have any issue with a strong, feminist female lead like Ripley (were men are usually the laughing stock, and all die in the hands of the xenomorph due to incompetence).
      - ratww 4y ago
        Ah, I think I understand your point. Your point is that "stuff <10% of people will like" doesn't make up for a mediocre film, and studios are trying to capitalise on that rather than working on better stories. If so, I definitely agree.
  - orwin 4y ago
    I've heard someone said "i usually care when the communication departement goes way too political: it usually mean that that the story is bad . In this case it was about video games, but i feel like it can be extended to TV shows and movies. There is a lot of good rather feminist TV shows who don't get touted as feminist (mostly YA and fantasy tbh). The one who tries to sold themselves on that though, are all bad. But i think this is transitory. In the 60s, when "La nouvelle vague" started to include different, new stereotypes (of women mostly, but of men too), there wasn't a lot of really good success in the beginning (to my eyes at least, the stereotypes were too much). They also had less money and couldn't afford to go wrong that many time, and eventually Truffaut got it right imho. Hollywood il bust, probably a lot, lot more than La nouvelle vague, but will start to get it right. Hopefully.
nameistaken 4y ago
danny_taco 4y ago
You talk about the figures being meaningful, while you seem to be making up numbers of your own.
- zmgsabst 4y ago
  - mxkopy 4y ago
    >and the rest hate it. Source?
tablespoon 4y ago
> Corporations “went Woke” because they misperceived that as having popular support while only 8-10% of people supported it — and the rest hate it. > That misperception has lost hundreds of billions in shareholder value, adding up just Disney, Warner, and Netflix. How so? Do any of those companies have competitors who didn't "go woke," and are now profiting off their missteps? Those companies may have lost a ton of value, but I don't think it's because of that cause. > Democrat politicians seem to have similarly misperceived — and now are facing widespread public backlash to their policy. But that may not matter. They're also cultivating a backlash against Republicans, hoping that will counter any backlash against them. IMHO, in our political moment, the major parties don't even try to make the middle happy; they try to make the middle mad at the other guys, so they can coddle their respective activist bases. This is why "democracy all the things" is kind of a shitty system. Primaries push the adults out of the room and give extremists too much say, which then requires toxic behavior to salvage an overall victory.
- hammock 4y ago
  Even inside of Big Media you can see the relative commercial success or failure of a movie like Toy Story compared to a disinterested one like Top Gun
- zmgsabst 4y ago
  Yes — imported and independent media have done well over that same period. They’re literally setting records. You can also compare within a single studio, such as Prime Video: why did Reacher and Terminal List succeed where Wheel of Time and Rings of Power did not? Edit: > IMHO, in our political moment, the major parties don't event try to make the middle happy; they try to make the middle mad at the other guys, so they can coddle their activist bases. I agree.
  - mcphage 4y ago
    > where Wheel of Time and Rings of Power did not? So far, Rings of Power has pulled in Infinity dollars per episode. Probably won't stay that way, but that seems pretty successful to me.
  - 4y ago
groby_b 4y ago
Dude. Take off the political glasses. Disney lost value because it's mismanaged by a horrible CEO, and hasn't produced anything meaningful outside of Marvel and Star Wars since forever. Add to that a struggling parks business in general, combined with epic mismanagement around "maybe we should just target people who want $5K hotel rooms and $2K drinks", and... here we are. Netflix, similarly, suffers from self-inflicted wounds. Their struggling attempts to monetize account sharing are a much too late financial attempt to paper over the fact that their auth system is... not so good. Mildly put. Their content content has taken a deep turn towards "reality" schlock after they so brilliantly ousted Cindy Holland (who was responsible for bringing good content) while elevating Bela Bajaria (the king of garbage shows). Those shows play well on social media, but they do shit all for the bottom line. It's not "went woke", it's "leaned into incompetence". The same holds true on the political side. A large chunk of the recession rests firmly on politicians who completely and utterly fucked up the handling of the pandemic. Republicans and Democrats both. Different flavors of incompetence, but... it was a shit show either way.
- hammock 4y ago
  >hasn't produced anything meaningful outside of Marvel and Star Wars since forever. AKA only the most profitable franchises of all time…
  - swores 4y ago
    Which is why they're not doing as well as they should be, rather than literally crashing and burning. At their size having two great franchises isn't good enough if everything else is absolute shit (not that I'm saying it is all shit, just that those two alone can't carry the stock market's expectation of more than just those two succeeding).
  - andsoitis 4y ago
    Disney stock is down over the last 5 years. https://finance.yahoo.com/quote/DIS/ https://finance.yahoo.com/quote/DIS/
    - 4y ago
PenguinCoder 4y ago
> has lost hundreds of billions in shareholder value Who gives a shit about useless thieves with no ability to actually produce or do anything worthwhile??! Fuck the 'shareholders value'. We need to do more for and pay the PEOPLE better, who get things done. Ya know, the actual workers. All that a 'shareholder' does is extract money/value from other peoples hard work.
frumper 4y ago
My in-law told us they were boycotting Disney for political reasons. A few months later we wanted to respect their choices so we asked her what our nephew would like for his birthday and she told us he's into The Mandalorian and Marvel.

AndrewUnmuted 4y ago

It feels many people responding to you are misunderstanding your point - and it's a very good one. The medium is the message. Everybody should read McLuhan if they work in the technology space. [0] [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_medium_is_the_message https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_medium_is_the_message