4 ms·

On the other hand, Elders voted the UK out of the EU.

by dfbsdfbwe2ef2e 4y ago

deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
59125throwaya 4y ago
Trial by combat may have had its place in the leadership transition process
bluepizza 4y ago
They showed up for their civic rights. The youth did not. If the youth had listened to them, they would have voted, and that vote would have turned out different.
- madsbuch 4y ago
  Unfortunately, this does not matter when generation sizes differ. The older generations are by far larger. There are good resources on how this has shaped society. Example are less support for education support and better policies for investments. Ie. Large generations decide how the world looks for small generations.
  - bluepizza 4y ago
    Leave won with 51.9% of the votes, on a voter turnout of 72.2%. It was not the irreversible situation you are making it to be.
- anothernewdude 4y ago
  Whole point of the article was that we have elders because they look out for the youth. If they don't then they are useless, and can just die already.
  - throw__away7391 4y ago
    But, they aren't. The boomers I think are the first generation in historical memory to act this way. Everything is about them, it's always been about them. Look at Social Security funding/timing, look at the ages of our politicians. Look at the response to COVID (and for reference compare it to the response to AIDs). Literally every single thing they've gotten their hands on from infrastructure to politics to the economy and housing to the environment has been transformed into some kind of Ponzi scheme. I'm in my 40s now, but I still feel in some ways like a kid living in a world run by and for boomers. Politically, economically, culturally I definitely have more in common with a gen-z than boomers.
    - dragonwriter 4y ago
      > The boomers I think are the first generation in historical memory to act this way No, they aren't. > Everything is about them, it's always been about them No, it isn't. > Look at Social Security funding/timing, You mean the way that, as Boomers were in early-mid career, the Silent Generation-dominated political class vastly increased taxes on workers for social security while also for the first time adopting taxes on social security benefits for the first time? > Look at the response to COVID (and for reference compare it to the response to AIDs). They are remarkably similar at the federal level, actually. In both cases, Republican Administrations deliberately didn't take it seriously for political reasons until media coverage of deaths and other political pressure from below resulted in a partial reversal. Everything about COVID happened faster, but the faster policy shift was mostly a result of it being a faster spreading, more acutely impactful pandemic, killing about as many people in its first year in the US as AIDS has in the US in total to date. EDIT TO ADD: > I'm in my 40s now, but I still feel in some ways like a kid living in a world run by and for boomers. This is relatively normal. Boomers in their own 40s experienced the same thing with regard to Silents. The big difference is because Gen X is a so much of bust generation compared to both Boomers and Millennials, they never became or will become dominant, and because not only are Millenials more liberal than Boomers but Gen X is more conservative than both, Gen X’s influence is basically to slightly extend and reinforce the feeling of Boomer domination for Millenials.
      - throw__away7391 4y ago
- cumshitpiss 4y ago
  It's incredibly unfair to blame Brexit on youth voter turn out... It was incredibly stupid to pose that question as a simple majority leave/stay referendum, and then equally stupid to actually go through with it given such a narrow majority. Certain capital owners were the ones who advocated for it, and ultimately the ones who benefited, and they manipulated the older and xenophobic.
  - tartoran 4y ago
    I wonder what percentage of those elders acknowledge they have been manipulated but I suspect that number to be rather low.
  - bluepizza 4y ago
    This is a disrespectful oversimplification of a very complex issue. Older people remember that Charles de Gaulle did everything that he could to keep the UK out of European politics. They remember the first referendum on remain/leave, that happened in 1975. They remember all of the exceptions, negotiations, all of the crashes. The EU is great, and I personally consider a grave mistake to leave it, but this sort of unidimensional oversimplification of complex issues is a major factor in politics polarisation.
- dfbsdfbwe2ef2e 4y ago
  I'm glad you agree with me. The Elders showed up for their civic right, and voted the UK out of the EU. So they're not great.
markb139 4y ago
Not all of us did
ralusek 4y ago
Ya, no reason to be apprehensive regarding an extra-national apparatus, barely representative or accountable to its constituents, entirely illiberal and increasingly exercising arbitrary authority, with a clear pattern of being the predominant tool for lawmaking well beyond its original purview. No reason to look at their American contemporaries' federal government, where virtually all issues are now to be addressed at the federal level or not at all, with consideration that the original responsibilities of the federal government were basically meant to be limited to few things beyond regulating interstate affairs. If anything, our elders have failed to impart sufficient skepticism of state authority. The current generation of young people doesn't even understand the difference between "what I think is right" and "what I'd like imposed by the state onto others," let alone "what I'd like to be imposed onto others across the broadest scope manageable by the largest authority under my influence." I will go so far to say that the primary obligation of elders in perpetuity will be to warn that any apparatus built in the name of imposing your will onto others is an apparatus whose objectives need not, and will not, mirror your own.

On the other hand, Elders voted the UK out of the EU.

deleted 4y ago

[deleted]

59125throwaya 4y ago

Trial by combat may have had its place in the leadership transition process

bluepizza 4y ago

They showed up for their civic rights. The youth did not. If the youth had listened to them, they would have voted, and that vote would have turned out different.

madsbuch 4y ago
Unfortunately, this does not matter when generation sizes differ. The older generations are by far larger. There are good resources on how this has shaped society. Example are less support for education support and better policies for investments. Ie. Large generations decide how the world looks for small generations.
- bluepizza 4y ago
  Leave won with 51.9% of the votes, on a voter turnout of 72.2%. It was not the irreversible situation you are making it to be.
anothernewdude 4y ago
Whole point of the article was that we have elders because they look out for the youth. If they don't then they are useless, and can just die already.
- throw__away7391 4y ago
  But, they aren't. The boomers I think are the first generation in historical memory to act this way. Everything is about them, it's always been about them. Look at Social Security funding/timing, look at the ages of our politicians. Look at the response to COVID (and for reference compare it to the response to AIDs). Literally every single thing they've gotten their hands on from infrastructure to politics to the economy and housing to the environment has been transformed into some kind of Ponzi scheme. I'm in my 40s now, but I still feel in some ways like a kid living in a world run by and for boomers. Politically, economically, culturally I definitely have more in common with a gen-z than boomers.
  - dragonwriter 4y ago
    > The boomers I think are the first generation in historical memory to act this way No, they aren't. > Everything is about them, it's always been about them No, it isn't. > Look at Social Security funding/timing, You mean the way that, as Boomers were in early-mid career, the Silent Generation-dominated political class vastly increased taxes on workers for social security while also for the first time adopting taxes on social security benefits for the first time? > Look at the response to COVID (and for reference compare it to the response to AIDs). They are remarkably similar at the federal level, actually. In both cases, Republican Administrations deliberately didn't take it seriously for political reasons until media coverage of deaths and other political pressure from below resulted in a partial reversal. Everything about COVID happened faster, but the faster policy shift was mostly a result of it being a faster spreading, more acutely impactful pandemic, killing about as many people in its first year in the US as AIDS has in the US in total to date. EDIT TO ADD: > I'm in my 40s now, but I still feel in some ways like a kid living in a world run by and for boomers. This is relatively normal. Boomers in their own 40s experienced the same thing with regard to Silents. The big difference is because Gen X is a so much of bust generation compared to both Boomers and Millennials, they never became or will become dominant, and because not only are Millenials more liberal than Boomers but Gen X is more conservative than both, Gen X’s influence is basically to slightly extend and reinforce the feeling of Boomer domination for Millenials.
    - throw__away7391 4y ago
cumshitpiss 4y ago
It's incredibly unfair to blame Brexit on youth voter turn out... It was incredibly stupid to pose that question as a simple majority leave/stay referendum, and then equally stupid to actually go through with it given such a narrow majority. Certain capital owners were the ones who advocated for it, and ultimately the ones who benefited, and they manipulated the older and xenophobic.
- tartoran 4y ago
  I wonder what percentage of those elders acknowledge they have been manipulated but I suspect that number to be rather low.
- bluepizza 4y ago
  This is a disrespectful oversimplification of a very complex issue. Older people remember that Charles de Gaulle did everything that he could to keep the UK out of European politics. They remember the first referendum on remain/leave, that happened in 1975. They remember all of the exceptions, negotiations, all of the crashes. The EU is great, and I personally consider a grave mistake to leave it, but this sort of unidimensional oversimplification of complex issues is a major factor in politics polarisation.
dfbsdfbwe2ef2e 4y ago
I'm glad you agree with me. The Elders showed up for their civic right, and voted the UK out of the EU. So they're not great.

markb139 4y ago

Not all of us did

ralusek 4y ago

Ya, no reason to be apprehensive regarding an extra-national apparatus, barely representative or accountable to its constituents, entirely illiberal and increasingly exercising arbitrary authority, with a clear pattern of being the predominant tool for lawmaking well beyond its original purview. No reason to look at their American contemporaries' federal government, where virtually all issues are now to be addressed at the federal level or not at all, with consideration that the original responsibilities of the federal government were basically meant to be limited to few things beyond regulating interstate affairs. If anything, our elders have failed to impart sufficient skepticism of state authority. The current generation of young people doesn't even understand the difference between "what I think is right" and "what I'd like imposed by the state onto others," let alone "what I'd like to be imposed onto others across the broadest scope manageable by the largest authority under my influence." I will go so far to say that the primary obligation of elders in perpetuity will be to warn that any apparatus built in the name of imposing your will onto others is an apparatus whose objectives need not, and will not, mirror your own.