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I don't think your sex is "private healthcare information." How would sharing the total number of males in various facilities violate an individuals privacy rig

I don't think your sex is "private healthcare information." How would sharing the total number of males in various facilities violate an individuals privacy rights? (sidebar: if you think you retain your right to privacy in prison... all I can say is you've clearly never been to prison :) Regarding the right to privacy, what's your take on the privacy rights of the (female) women who are being physically forced to house & sleep in a cell with males?

joshuamorton 4y ago
> Regarding the right to privacy, what's your take on the privacy rights of the (female) women who are being physically forced to house & sleep in a cell with males? Any argument here about privacy is entirely independent of sex and gender. Prison is dehumanizing, address that. Don't be a transphobe. Edit: There's a bunch of mistaken comments here assuming that this will protect women prisoners in some capacity. That's totally wrong! Women in prison are sexually assaulted, raped, and even impregnated by men all the time and have been for years. Those men are guards[0]. And this happens at a vastly higher rate per capita and overall than any assault by trans inmates. Anyone here with a legitimate interest in protecting women in prison would be attempting to address that harm, because it is far more dire for numerous reasons. [0]: https://ktla.com/news/nationworld/the-rape-club-womens-prison-in-norcal-fostered-culture-of-abuse-inmate-say/ https://ktla.com/news/nationworld/the-rape-club-womens-priso...
- lesstenseflow 4y ago
  Is a woman a transphobe for not wanting to share a jail cell with a person who has a penis? I think most people would consider safeguarding female prisoners from males common sense. I think you should take a moment to consider the (female) women in this situation. Imagine you're a woman 100% at the mercy of the state, and the state locks you in a cell with a male person. Put yourself in their shoes, and try to extend some empathy to them.
  - joshuamorton 4y ago
    I never made any comment about women in prison. I have empathy to anyone in prison. Like I said, its deeply inhumane. I think people in prison should be protected from other people in prison if they are dangerous, and I think prisons fail to do that today. I don't accept your presumption that having a penis makes someone inherently more dangerous. Again: if your goal is to protect women in prison, the best way to do that is to advocate for reform that makes prisons safer for everyone. Not by being transphobic, which you're doing instead.
    - BitwiseFool 4y ago
      >"Again: if your goal is to protect women in prison, the best way to do that is to advocate for reform that makes prisons safer for everyone. Not by being transphobic, which you're doing instead. " Perfect is the enemy of good and while it's hard to disagree with the sentiment of "reform that makes prisons safer for everyone ", we have no idea what that actually entails and that's so much of a monumental task that it's basically a non-starter. I feel like the sentiment here is "this wouldn't be a problem if we changed everything, so why don't we?"
    - denton-scratch 4y ago
      > people in prison should be protected from other people in prison I strongly agree; if you deprive someone of their liberty, then you take on the responsibility of protecting them - because you've deprived them of the ability to protect themselves. I'm not aware of any prison regime that takes the safety of prisoners as a key objective. [Edit] Nor do I know of a state that handles the deliberate negligence of prisoner welfare as a criminal offence.
    - jibe 4y ago
      I don't accept your presumption that having a penis makes someone inherently more dangerous The data really really doesn't support your view. Men are objectively more dangerous. https://www.statista.com/statistics/251886/murder-offenders-in-the-us-by-gender/ https://www.statista.com/statistics/251886/murder-offenders-... https://stoprape.humboldt.edu/statistics https://stoprape.humboldt.edu/statistics An estimated 91% of victims of rape & sexual assault are female and 9% male. Nearly 99% of perpetrators are male
- cluedos 4y ago
  > Women in prison are sexually assaulted, raped, and even impregnated by men all the time and have been for years. Those men are guards. Indeed and this is why feminist organizations, and others with an interest in women's rights and safety, push for policies of only employing female prison guards in women's prisons. It's no stretch to see why they don't want male prisoners to be incarcerated there too, no matter how such males identity. If the male guards can't be trusted not to sexually abuse women, how can you expect the same from cohabiting males?
nemothekid 4y ago
>I don't think your sex is "private healthcare information." Your sex is private information under GDPR. Why would the GDPR be stricter than than HIPAA in this case? >Regarding the right to privacy, what's your take on the privacy rights of the (female) women who are being physically forced to house & sleep in a cell with males? "But what about the children?" is never a good argument for taking the away the rights of others.
- lesstenseflow 4y ago
  You're assuming male prisoners have a "right" to be housed with female prisoners, and that female prisoners have no right to sex-segregated facilities. Whether the former "right" exists is far from a settled question. Assuming the former right does exist, then there is a conflict of rights (between the wishes of males who want to be housed with females, and females who want to be housed without males). Rights conflicts like this are not solved by simply telling one group (in this case, women) to shut up and stop complaining. Where the ACLU comes in here I have no idea.
  - tsimionescu 4y ago
    Using "males" and "females" here is irrelevant and actively seeking to confuse. People typically consider that women (cis or trans) have a right to be housed together, and separately from cismen. If anything, the biggest problem of policy are trans-men, who would likely feel much more concerned by being housed with cis-man prisoners, but who would also make women uncomfortable.
    - ryan93 4y ago
      The desire of women not to be housed with men has nothing to do with the interior gender experience of the male in question.
      - tsimionescu 4y ago
        Sure, but it also has nothing to do with their chromosome structure. It has a lot to do with their gender expression, in the end.
munificent 4y ago
> what's your take on the privacy rights of the (female) women who are being physically forced to house & sleep in a cell with males? Keeping penises out of the same room with vaginas will not magically eliminate sexual assault because sexual assault is based on power and willingness to harm another, not whether not tab A physically fits into slot B. If you think keeping penises away from vaginas will eliminate prison rape then clearly you don't know much about rape in mens' prisons.
- Karunamon 4y ago
  It will, however, eliminate pregnancy.
  - tsimionescu 4y ago
    Transwomen are not normally fertile, since the hormone treatments seriously impede the working of their testicles (if they still have them).
    - lesstenseflow 4y ago
      One would assume surgery or hormones are required to change your gender designation in Washington State, but in fact this is not the case (neither is required). Here's the form to change gender designation on your driver's license in WA, anyone living in washington state can do it today: https://www.dol.wa.gov/forms/520043.pdf https://www.dol.wa.gov/forms/520043.pdf
      - kbelder 4y ago
        Will that lower insurance rates? Hmm...
    - cluedos 4y ago
      It's all about 'gender identity' these days, not hormones and surgery. Indeed, in trans circles, expecting the latter as a required factor is often considered highly offensive. This, and the notion that a person needs to experience gender dysphoria to be trans, is now derisively known as the 'truscum' point of view.

joshuamorton 4y ago

> Regarding the right to privacy, what's your take on the privacy rights of the (female) women who are being physically forced to house & sleep in a cell with males? Any argument here about privacy is entirely independent of sex and gender. Prison is dehumanizing, address that. Don't be a transphobe. Edit: There's a bunch of mistaken comments here assuming that this will protect women prisoners in some capacity. That's totally wrong! Women in prison are sexually assaulted, raped, and even impregnated by men all the time and have been for years. Those men are guards[0]. And this happens at a vastly higher rate per capita and overall than any assault by trans inmates. Anyone here with a legitimate interest in protecting women in prison would be attempting to address that harm, because it is far more dire for numerous reasons. [0]: https://ktla.com/news/nationworld/the-rape-club-womens-prison-in-norcal-fostered-culture-of-abuse-inmate-say/ https://ktla.com/news/nationworld/the-rape-club-womens-priso...

lesstenseflow 4y ago
Is a woman a transphobe for not wanting to share a jail cell with a person who has a penis? I think most people would consider safeguarding female prisoners from males common sense. I think you should take a moment to consider the (female) women in this situation. Imagine you're a woman 100% at the mercy of the state, and the state locks you in a cell with a male person. Put yourself in their shoes, and try to extend some empathy to them.
- joshuamorton 4y ago
  I never made any comment about women in prison. I have empathy to anyone in prison. Like I said, its deeply inhumane. I think people in prison should be protected from other people in prison if they are dangerous, and I think prisons fail to do that today. I don't accept your presumption that having a penis makes someone inherently more dangerous. Again: if your goal is to protect women in prison, the best way to do that is to advocate for reform that makes prisons safer for everyone. Not by being transphobic, which you're doing instead.
  - BitwiseFool 4y ago
    >"Again: if your goal is to protect women in prison, the best way to do that is to advocate for reform that makes prisons safer for everyone. Not by being transphobic, which you're doing instead. " Perfect is the enemy of good and while it's hard to disagree with the sentiment of "reform that makes prisons safer for everyone ", we have no idea what that actually entails and that's so much of a monumental task that it's basically a non-starter. I feel like the sentiment here is "this wouldn't be a problem if we changed everything, so why don't we?"
  - denton-scratch 4y ago
    > people in prison should be protected from other people in prison I strongly agree; if you deprive someone of their liberty, then you take on the responsibility of protecting them - because you've deprived them of the ability to protect themselves. I'm not aware of any prison regime that takes the safety of prisoners as a key objective. [Edit] Nor do I know of a state that handles the deliberate negligence of prisoner welfare as a criminal offence.
  - jibe 4y ago
    I don't accept your presumption that having a penis makes someone inherently more dangerous The data really really doesn't support your view. Men are objectively more dangerous. https://www.statista.com/statistics/251886/murder-offenders-in-the-us-by-gender/ https://www.statista.com/statistics/251886/murder-offenders-... https://stoprape.humboldt.edu/statistics https://stoprape.humboldt.edu/statistics An estimated 91% of victims of rape & sexual assault are female and 9% male. Nearly 99% of perpetrators are male
cluedos 4y ago
> Women in prison are sexually assaulted, raped, and even impregnated by men all the time and have been for years. Those men are guards. Indeed and this is why feminist organizations, and others with an interest in women's rights and safety, push for policies of only employing female prison guards in women's prisons. It's no stretch to see why they don't want male prisoners to be incarcerated there too, no matter how such males identity. If the male guards can't be trusted not to sexually abuse women, how can you expect the same from cohabiting males?

nemothekid 4y ago

>I don't think your sex is "private healthcare information." Your sex is private information under GDPR. Why would the GDPR be stricter than than HIPAA in this case? >Regarding the right to privacy, what's your take on the privacy rights of the (female) women who are being physically forced to house & sleep in a cell with males? "But what about the children?" is never a good argument for taking the away the rights of others.

lesstenseflow 4y ago
You're assuming male prisoners have a "right" to be housed with female prisoners, and that female prisoners have no right to sex-segregated facilities. Whether the former "right" exists is far from a settled question. Assuming the former right does exist, then there is a conflict of rights (between the wishes of males who want to be housed with females, and females who want to be housed without males). Rights conflicts like this are not solved by simply telling one group (in this case, women) to shut up and stop complaining. Where the ACLU comes in here I have no idea.
- tsimionescu 4y ago
  Using "males" and "females" here is irrelevant and actively seeking to confuse. People typically consider that women (cis or trans) have a right to be housed together, and separately from cismen. If anything, the biggest problem of policy are trans-men, who would likely feel much more concerned by being housed with cis-man prisoners, but who would also make women uncomfortable.
  - ryan93 4y ago
    The desire of women not to be housed with men has nothing to do with the interior gender experience of the male in question.
    - tsimionescu 4y ago
      Sure, but it also has nothing to do with their chromosome structure. It has a lot to do with their gender expression, in the end.

munificent 4y ago

> what's your take on the privacy rights of the (female) women who are being physically forced to house & sleep in a cell with males? Keeping penises out of the same room with vaginas will not magically eliminate sexual assault because sexual assault is based on power and willingness to harm another, not whether not tab A physically fits into slot B. If you think keeping penises away from vaginas will eliminate prison rape then clearly you don't know much about rape in mens' prisons.

Karunamon 4y ago
It will, however, eliminate pregnancy.
- tsimionescu 4y ago
  Transwomen are not normally fertile, since the hormone treatments seriously impede the working of their testicles (if they still have them).
  - lesstenseflow 4y ago
    One would assume surgery or hormones are required to change your gender designation in Washington State, but in fact this is not the case (neither is required). Here's the form to change gender designation on your driver's license in WA, anyone living in washington state can do it today: https://www.dol.wa.gov/forms/520043.pdf https://www.dol.wa.gov/forms/520043.pdf
    - kbelder 4y ago
      Will that lower insurance rates? Hmm...
  - cluedos 4y ago
    It's all about 'gender identity' these days, not hormones and surgery. Indeed, in trans circles, expecting the latter as a required factor is often considered highly offensive. This, and the notion that a person needs to experience gender dysphoria to be trans, is now derisively known as the 'truscum' point of view.