7 ms·

I recently heard about this in my stage 4 support group. No doctor will go on record that they do it however. God forbid there be dignity in choosing when to sh

I recently heard about this in my stage 4 support group. No doctor will go on record that they do it however. God forbid there be dignity in choosing when to shuffle off the mortal coil.

0F 4y ago
God bless you.
muglug 4y ago
Yes — my grandfather, who had a chest infection aged 99¾, was given an increasing amount of morphine for the pain (instead of antibiotics). The death came at the point he could no longer recognise his children, where his quality of life was basically nil. It was a release.
silisili 4y ago
Being a doctor must be tough. My brother is a doctor, though we aren't close or even on speaking terms. But I hear his tales via our mom. A recent tale is that a family member got a bad cancer. Our mom called him to get the scoop, who he'll only give to her, apparently. He said 'Mom, she'll be dead in two years. She'll initially respond really well to treatment, then just get worse until the end.' Doctors know these things, but many won't tell the patient because it's depressing, and also there's a tiny chance they're wrong. Of course neither told said family member, and she's currently in the responding well phase. It's shattering hearing their hope, so I guess their doctor wasn't blunt either...
- dev_throw 4y ago
  I think the pendulum might be swinging the other way - me and a lot of other folks in my stage 4 support group got given a very grim diagnosis and subsequent prognoses from our oncologists even though the 5 year survival statistics are outdated. It was quite depressing in the beginning but after connecting with some people who have survived years past their onc's expiry date, I feel hopeful.
  - silisili 4y ago
    I'm hopeful for you! Apologies if my previous comment was doom and gloom - was just thinking about the things doctors do and perhaps even know and have to decide... sounds incredibly stressful. But of course that was one specific case, and every case and person is different. Anyhow, stay strong, and best of luck to you, truly.
- oefrha 4y ago
  My mother spent thirty years in the OR saving cancer patients, so I know a thing or two about this topic. Different patients respond differently to treatment, life expectancy can vary greatly even in the terminal stage, so doctors are unlikely to know “she'll be dead in two years. She'll initially respond really well to treatment, then just get worse until the end.” Delivering that information when there actual is non-negligible hope left would be imprudent.
- fullstop 4y ago
  > My brother is a doctor, though we aren't close or even on speaking terms Given the nature of this post, maybe consider working on this relationship and at least getting back to the point of talking to each other.
  - silisili 4y ago
    Thanks. Rereading what I'd written sounded awkward, I guess I was trying to explain it was third hand information without being evasive/mysterious. Didn't mean it as a complaint or even bad thing. Last time we saw each other he kept making incredibly racist comments about and even to my (nonwhite) wife and kid's face - it was the first time they'd even met!
    - fullstop 4y ago
      > Last time we saw each other he kept making incredibly racist comments about and even to my (nonwhite) wife and kid's face - it was the first time they'd even met! Well, that's certainly unfortunate. I honestly do not know how you can bridge a gap that wide.
refurb 4y ago
There is nothing illegal about causing death in the pursuit of treatment or reducing pain and suffering. It's obviously a fine line, but giving a patient who is in severe pain so much morphine it hastens their death is not illegal.

I recently heard about this in my stage 4 support group. No doctor will go on record that they do it however. God forbid there be dignity in choosing when to shuffle off the mortal coil.

0F 4y ago

God bless you.

muglug 4y ago

Yes — my grandfather, who had a chest infection aged 99¾, was given an increasing amount of morphine for the pain (instead of antibiotics). The death came at the point he could no longer recognise his children, where his quality of life was basically nil. It was a release.

silisili 4y ago

Being a doctor must be tough. My brother is a doctor, though we aren't close or even on speaking terms. But I hear his tales via our mom. A recent tale is that a family member got a bad cancer. Our mom called him to get the scoop, who he'll only give to her, apparently. He said 'Mom, she'll be dead in two years. She'll initially respond really well to treatment, then just get worse until the end.' Doctors know these things, but many won't tell the patient because it's depressing, and also there's a tiny chance they're wrong. Of course neither told said family member, and she's currently in the responding well phase. It's shattering hearing their hope, so I guess their doctor wasn't blunt either...

dev_throw 4y ago
I think the pendulum might be swinging the other way - me and a lot of other folks in my stage 4 support group got given a very grim diagnosis and subsequent prognoses from our oncologists even though the 5 year survival statistics are outdated. It was quite depressing in the beginning but after connecting with some people who have survived years past their onc's expiry date, I feel hopeful.
- silisili 4y ago
  I'm hopeful for you! Apologies if my previous comment was doom and gloom - was just thinking about the things doctors do and perhaps even know and have to decide... sounds incredibly stressful. But of course that was one specific case, and every case and person is different. Anyhow, stay strong, and best of luck to you, truly.
oefrha 4y ago
My mother spent thirty years in the OR saving cancer patients, so I know a thing or two about this topic. Different patients respond differently to treatment, life expectancy can vary greatly even in the terminal stage, so doctors are unlikely to know “she'll be dead in two years. She'll initially respond really well to treatment, then just get worse until the end.” Delivering that information when there actual is non-negligible hope left would be imprudent.
fullstop 4y ago
> My brother is a doctor, though we aren't close or even on speaking terms Given the nature of this post, maybe consider working on this relationship and at least getting back to the point of talking to each other.
- silisili 4y ago
  Thanks. Rereading what I'd written sounded awkward, I guess I was trying to explain it was third hand information without being evasive/mysterious. Didn't mean it as a complaint or even bad thing. Last time we saw each other he kept making incredibly racist comments about and even to my (nonwhite) wife and kid's face - it was the first time they'd even met!
  - fullstop 4y ago
    > Last time we saw each other he kept making incredibly racist comments about and even to my (nonwhite) wife and kid's face - it was the first time they'd even met! Well, that's certainly unfortunate. I honestly do not know how you can bridge a gap that wide.

refurb 4y ago

There is nothing illegal about causing death in the pursuit of treatment or reducing pain and suffering. It's obviously a fine line, but giving a patient who is in severe pain so much morphine it hastens their death is not illegal.